Hot Toys - MMS DX 01- The Dark Knight - The Joker spec and pics

[villainsfan42]

You misheard the line. He says "I killed his parents", refering to Robin's. Bruce feels guilty for not being heard at the circus when Two Face demands Batman reveal himself, causing the Graysons to be murdered. Alfred then reassures him that it was Two Face who's responsible.

are you sure about that? i thought he was referring to his own parents, especially since the whole movie was filled with those lame flashbacks to his parents funeral and his father's journal etc.

 

[snoop101]

gotta agree with you about that devil. at first, especially when i was younger, i thought it was an interesting idea to have joker be the killer of bruce's parents...but then i started to get into the comics more, so that made me dislike the idea. but what really killed it for me (movie wise) was batman forever. "i killed my parents." "sorry sir?" "two face killed my parents".....WHO THE F__K WROTE THAT?? the line itself is just plain stupid, and the idea of he or twoface killing his parents doesn't work if it was joker. that killed the movie continuity, and was just dumb imo. actually...it wasn't dumb-imo...it was just dumb-FACT!

He was refering to robins parents.

 

[Devil_666]

You misheard the line. He says "I killed his parents", refering to Robin's. Bruce feels guilty for not being heard at the circus when Two Face demands Batman reveal himself, causing the Graysons to be murdered. Alfred then reassures him that it was Two Face who's responsible.

Which is still stupid because Boss Zucco (i.e. random gangster) killed the Grayson's. Two-Face killed Jason Todd's father. The second Robin. Not to mention Robin is a grown *** man in Batman Forever which completely ruins the whole "Ward" aspect of Batman and Robin's relationship. Bruce Wayne decides to look after a grown *** man!? Yeah.. that's not gay at all.

 

[snoop101]

I'm the opposite.

I hated that about the 89' Batman because it made absolutely no sense and was completely unnecessary IMO. It also wasn't true to Batman's origin in the comics, which is the source material being used for ALL of these films. The Joker is supposed to be obsessed with Batman. Not the other way around. The Joker enjoys (albeit in a sick and twisted way) ANY type of contact he has with Batman. It's always The Joker doing stuff to attract Batman.. so The Joker can have contact. That's what he enjoys.

That sick relationship completely dies if The Joker murdered Batman's parents. Because then, just like in the 89' film Batman would be the one obsessed. Batman would be the one constantly trying to make contact with The Joker, etc.

Also (in the comics and even in the 89' film) Batman made The Joker (Red Hood storyline) so that sets up the connection between the two. But it's a connection that The Joker is fixated with. Not Batman. Since for the most part Batman isn't even aware that the Red Hood was Joker (at least initially).

And in TDK, the connection is how much fun Joker has 'playing' with Batman. It's an adversarial relationship. The Joker becomes obsessed with Batman because to him, Batman is the only worthy opponent he can find (since he pretty much has his way with everyone else in Gotham).

IMO both those elements work in both films without The Joker murdering Batman's parents. Seriously.. to this day I still think that element of the 89' film is stupid.

The joker killing Bruces parents was a great twist to the original story, and shows a much stronger relationship between batman and his arch nemesis. What youre saying is that in TDK, the jokers relationship with batman is better because he enjoys 'playing' with batman.

 

[snoop101]

Which is still stupid because Boss Zucco (i.e. random gangster) killed the Grayson's. Two-Face killed Jason Todd's father. The second Robin. Not to mention Robin is a grown *** man in Batman Forever which completely ruins the whole "Ward" aspect of Batman and Robin's relationship. Bruce Wayne decides to look after a grown *** man!? Yeah.. that's not gay at all.

It would be "less Gay" if he decided too watch after a teenager.

 

[Darth Madden]

Joker killing Bruce's parents is just to close of a connection. Why can't the Joker just be a raving lunatic who comes out of nowhere. It reeks of George Lucas who has to interconnect everything like Anakin building C-3PO.

 

[rothnroller]

Thanks very much for your help!

 

[Devil_666]

What youre saying is that in TDK, the jokers relationship with batman is better because he enjoys 'playing' with batman.

Not simply because he enjoys "playing" with Batman, but because he's a complete stranger yet he's so twisted Joker honestly feels like he has a connection with Batman. Almost like a stalker. He makes up this imaginary connection and goes out of his way to do things to get Batman's attention. It's solidified in his ending speech while he's hanging upside down.

"I think you and I are destined to do this forever."

It would be "less Gay" if he decided too watch after a teenager.

The original Robin wasn't a teenager. He was a little kid. That's the reason WHY Bruce Wayne takes him in: because his entire family is gone and Bruce knows the feeling of being a child and having no family. So he has that connection with Robin. All that changes if you switch up the age and make Robin a grown *** man. Do people adopt children/teenagers? Yes. Do people adopt 20+ yr. old men? NO.

If you think adopting a child in need makes you gay, and "adopting" a 20+ year old man is normal, you've got problems bro.

 

[EdwardNashton1]

Joker killing Bruce's parents is just to close of a connection.

That is one of the reasons I don't much care for 1989 Batman.

 

[Devil_666]

That is one of the reasons I don't much care for 1989 Batman.

Hmmm.. I didn't like that one aspect either but I wouldn't say it ruined the whole movie for me. Still like that film. Just don't like that one element.

 

[EdwardNashton1]

Hmmm.. I didn't like that one aspect either but I wouldn't say it ruined the whole movie for me. Still like that film. Just don't like that one element.

Well I mean it's not like I don't enjoy watching it. I just felt Joker was miscast, and that Batman was miscast as well. That's not to say Keaton can't be Batman, because he can, he just isn't exactly in my top 3.

But I also didn't like how the Joker was middle-aged as well. I still liked stuff like the Batwing, the parade scene, and I lean more towards liking the design of the batmobile than not.

 

[Geil]

I think a lot of the difference is simply attributed to the style the movies were in those days and the ones they take on in the more current movies.
Us older bunch can appreciate the "cheesier" older movies better as we still remember how we enjoyed them at the time. We won;t just suddenly dismiss them now when compared to the ultra realistic, dark undertone the current movies nowadays all take. For younger guys here that never gone through those days it will just be "weird" just like old black & white or other really old movies or TV shows will feel to us.
Well they do have a term for it ... Generation gap...

 

[zeelhar]

I think a lot of the difference is simply attributed to the style the movies were in those days and the ones they take on in the more current movies.
Us older bunch can appreciate the "cheesier" older movies better as we still remember how we enjoyed them at the time. We won;t just suddenly dismiss them now when compared to the ultra realistic, dark undertone the current movies nowadays all take. For younger guys here that never gone through those days it will just be "weird" just like old black & white or other really old movies or TV shows will feel to us.
Well they do have a term for it ... Generation gap...

 

[Devil_666]

Us older bunch can appreciate the "cheesier" older movies better as we still remember how we enjoyed them at the time. We won;t just suddenly dismiss them now when compared to the ultra realistic, dark undertone the current movies nowadays all take. For younger guys here that never gone through those days it will just be "weird" just like old black & white or other really old movies or TV shows will feel to us.
Well they do have a term for it ... Generation gap...

Can't speak for anyone else, but I'm 33. So that notion doesn't apply to me nor does it have any bearing on my opinion and what I've talked about. Just saying.

 

[Maglor]

I think a lot of the difference is simply attributed to the style the movies were in those days and the ones they take on in the more current movies.
Us older bunch can appreciate the "cheesier" older movies better as we still remember how we enjoyed them at the time. We won;t just suddenly dismiss them now when compared to the ultra realistic, dark undertone the current movies nowadays all take. For younger guys here that never gone through those days it will just be "weird" just like old black & white or other really old movies or TV shows will feel to us.
Well they do have a term for it ... Generation gap...

Couldn't have said it better myself!

Can't speak for anyone else, but I'm 33. So that notion doesn't apply to me nor does it have any bearing on my opinion and what I've talked about. Just saying.

Well, I'm 32 and I totaly agree.

Guys like Nygma are from a different generation so their perspective is going to be different. Nothing wrong with that.

 

[Geil]

Well, I'm 32 and I totaly agree.

Guys like Nygma are from a different generation so their perspective is going to be different. Nothing wrong with that.

OOOmph I am older still
Luckily I am young at heart otherwise I will have two generation gaps between me and Ed

 

[snoop101]

Not simply because he enjoys "playing" with Batman, but because he's a complete stranger yet he's so twisted Joker honestly feels like he has a connection with Batman. Almost like a stalker. He makes up this imaginary connection and goes out of his way to do things to get Batman's attention. It's solidified in his ending speech while he's hanging upside down. "I think you and I are destined to do this forever." If you think adopting a child in need makes you gay, and "adopting" a 20+ year old man is normal, you've got problems bro.

Its called sarcasm. I dont give a ____ about batman forever or how old robbin was. And When in TDK does it mention the jokers "imaginary connection" with batman? When the joker said you and I are destined to do this forever, it was simply foreshadowing that the joker would appear in more batman films because hes batmans #1 VILLAIN! You also said the joker enjoys playing with batman?

 

[cr0w]

I hate pretty much every aspect of the '89 film with the exception of Michael Keaton. Hell, I hated it when I first saw it opening night when I was 9 years old. The Joker/Batman's parents connection, Nicholson's Joker, Billy Dee Williams as Dent, Vicki Vale, Knox, the Prince soundtrack, Bob the Goon, geriatric Alfred, the fact that every single scene screamed "Soundstage" instead of an organic environment..I could go on and on. But to me, the single worst part of the movie was Napier being the one who killed the Waynes. That just felt completely unnecessary and stretched the story way too much.

I'd recommend everyone (if they haven't already) read The Killing Joke. That explains Batman and Joker's relationship perfectly.

 

[Devil_666]

I'd recommend everyone (if they haven't already) read The Killing Joke. That explains Batman and Joker's relationship perfectly.

I was essentially describing that.

 

[Maglor]

I hate pretty much every aspect of the '89 film with the exception of Michael Keaton. Hell, I hated it when I first saw it opening night when I was 9 years old. The Joker/Batman's parents connection, Nicholson's Joker, Billy Dee Williams as Dent...

That brings up the question I have always had about the series.

How can Billy Dee Williams and Tommy Lee Jones be Two Face in Forever?