Hot Toys - MMS DX 01- The Dark Knight - The Joker spec and pics

[wbss21]

On this one, I second the thoughts around a-dev's logic. Though it resembles Ledger a lot but it does not go with the 'Honour Guard' costume at all. This costume (and HT's sculpt) was made to represent that 1 sec shot in the movie. But then, as wbss21 said, to each his own.

If a collector/fan wants to display something s/he appreciates in a certain way, so be it. Collecting is about doing something which appeals to your senses, not others. But of course, some people are touchy. If they do not get (desired) acknowledgement/appreciation for something they own (and paid big bucks for it), they feel miserable and get defensive about it. Let people be happy the way they are, its a free world after all.

I'm not defensive. You don't have to like the sculpt. I'm just stating my opinion, as others have stated their's. I'm just a bit confused as to how anyone could objectively say that the Hot Toys sculpt is a better sculpt then Adam's. Objectively as in, not letting personal bias cloud ones judgment. One could easily say people are dissing the customs because they're angry about not having them themselves. I'm not accusing anyone of that. But it's the same thing as accusing certain posters of being angry over someone not liking what they have and that being the sole reason they're making points as to it's attributes.

The quality of these customs is better then the HT sculpts, simply because they aren't mass produced and each piece is done with a great deal of care and time dedicated. It's of better quality, and I'm saying that objectively. It's a more accurate sculpt, and I'm saying that objectively. That doesn't mean you have to like it more then the HT's sculpt. You can like the HT sculpt a thousand times more, and no one can tell you you're wrong for having that opinion.

But to say that the HT's sculpt is of better quality, or more accurate in terms of LOOKING like Heath and the character as he appears on film, makes me think there's personal bias coming in to the equation. And that's fine. But that's just what I think. I don't think one can objectively say that and mean it.

Anyway though, I don't want to start a fight or anything. Or accuse anyone of anything. That's not my intention. I was just asking a question, and responding to the answer. But by all means, if you like the HT's sculpt more, then that's totally cool.

 

[BB&WSF]

I am totally with you wbss21 and understand what you mean. And, that "defensive" was not for you, it was used in context of 'Generally...' and as a

 

[wbss21]

Ah, okay. No worries then.

 

[Alex Logan]

Actually I think enterbay did it first.movable eyes,seperate hair peices,heck hot toys are even stealing there sculpters[arnie kim]what next is hot toys gonna make 1 4 scale figures?oh wait they stole that to.so maybe enterbay should be getting the credit for raising the bar.as far as the likeness thing if your just looking at a expresion then why is nobody defending the v1 joker?the likeness is the most important aspect of these sculpts.heath ledger was an actor who played the joker,so it should look like heath ledger.would a bruce wayne figure just be a guy in a suit?

Well, considering Hot Toys started making 1/6 figures in 2000 and Enterbay started doing it in 2005, I would say Enterbay stole ideas first.

Even if you give Enterbay the credit for rasing the bar, what have they done with that bar? Next to nothing. How many figures have they put out?

Personally, I don't think either company "stole" from the other. Hot Toys is just suppost to give up and go home because Enterbay started doing better sculpts? I don't think so.

And how did Hot Toys steal Arnie Kim? Maybe Kim left Enterbay on his own. Maybe he wanted to make more money. Enterbay is a pretty small company.

 

[intothevoid]

I see we're back at the HT versus customs jokers argument again

IMO no sculpt is perfect, but Adam's attempts are the closest. So far this one he did for Kato in silicone has been my favourite

And my laughing version is a prized possession

I think the HT BR Joker (main head) is a very good sculpt, but I think Adam's are significantly more accurate

 

[a-dev]

Its fair to say I'm jealous of anyone who has those Adam sculpts^ Those are amazing.

Wbss21 - I get you now. I've actually done something similar with some Arnie T-800s from Terminator. I based a figure off one individual photograph from a promotion shoot - he doesn't appear in the film that way at all, I just thought it would be an easy but effective kitbash so I did it. Yet I doubt anyone else would bother with it.

With the HT sculpts of normal Joker - I really like what HT did with the mouth on the DX one, thats the kind of quirkiness of Ledgers performance that I don't see in the customs. However when it looks as lifelike as Adam's sculpts I can see why that just wouldn't seem so important.

By the way whose doing the sculpts that CREG customs is running his Interest polls on? The guys who can beat HT aren't many and hasn't Adam retired from customs?

 

[batfan08]

I'm just a bit confused as to how anyone could objectively say that the Hot Toys sculpt is a better sculpt then Adam's. One could easily say people are dissing the customs because they're angry about not having them themselves. I'm not accusing anyone of that.

So, you're objectively saying that anyone who holds the opinion that the Hot Toys sculpt is better than your Imaresqd1 Joker isn't thinking "objectively?" No matter how many times you use the word "objectively" or tell people that "I'm not saying that," it seems pretty clear to me that you are, in fact, saying that. That being said, I'll give you every one of my reasons for why I think that.
1.These are Joker figures, they are meant to look just as much like the character as they are the actor (you can claim he has "mean" eyes, but if people can't see it, how can you expect them to factor that into their opinion?
2. Your figure looks like Heath Ledger, Hot Toys' figure looks like Heath Ledger as The Joker
3. Your sculpt is "better quality" than Hot Toys because they "aren't mass produced and each piece is done with a great deal of care," again, I think that Hot Toys is better, as they were able to do just what you said, and also were able to accurately replicate that on a mass scale.

I think that's a pretty "objective" way of putting it, don't you?

 

[EVILFACE]

My $1500 doll is better than your $150 doll!

 

[Remy]

As far as the comment on Bobby's looking caked on, it's something to see in hand. In some pics, it may look like a Sloppy paint but it's not so, the thing is, with silicone, it looks like skin, and with the paint, it looks like a paint on skin. It's really something to see in hand.

I've had numerous guests at my house, and I don't make any comment at all to joker to draw them in to it, and it's funny, everytime, theyre looking at the joker, they start to look at it for a long time, and would make comment that it looks real. Everytime, they all say it's their favorite out of all my collection. Basically compared to other 1/6, bobby's nailed the realism. It looks like a miniature wax museum.
Silicone is the next evolution to 1/6, it really makes you wish that all figures are made with it. The difference is Other paint such as the dx sparrow looks kinda like skin, silicone looks like skin so it adds a lot of realism. It is a pain to take a picture of it though, cause lighting plays a huge part.

I must also say, I'm not a big baller collector, most of my collection consist of mainly Hot toys, but this joker is worth every penny.

Old iPhone pics.

 

[Commtech]

Incredible, Remy. Just incredible.

 

[wbss21]

Its fair to say I'm jealous of anyone who has those Adam sculpts^ Those are amazing.

Wbss21 - I get you now. I've actually done something similar with some Arnie T-800s from Terminator. I based a figure off one individual photograph from a promotion shoot - he doesn't appear in the film that way at all, I just thought it would be an easy but effective kitbash so I did it. Yet I doubt anyone else would bother with it.

With the HT sculpts of normal Joker - I really like what HT did with the mouth on the DX one, thats the kind of quirkiness of Ledgers performance that I don't see in the customs. However when it looks as lifelike as Adam's sculpts I can see why that just wouldn't seem so important.

By the way whose doing the sculpts that CREG customs is running his Interest polls on? The guys who can beat HT aren't many and hasn't Adam retired from customs?

Yeah, exactly. That's my intent.

 

[wbss21]

So, you're objectively saying that anyone who holds the opinion that the Hot Toys sculpt is better than your Imaresqd1 Joker isn't thinking "objectively?" No matter how many times you use the word "objectively" or tell people that "I'm not saying that," it seems pretty clear to me that you are, in fact, saying that. That being said, I'll give you every one of my reasons for why I think that.
1.These are Joker figures, they are meant to look just as much like the character as they are the actor (you can claim he has "mean" eyes, but if people can't see it, how can you expect them to factor that into their opinion?
2. Your figure looks like Heath Ledger, Hot Toys' figure looks like Heath Ledger as The Joker
3. Your sculpt is "better quality" than Hot Toys because they "aren't mass produced and each piece is done with a great deal of care," again, I think that Hot Toys is better, as they were able to do just what you said, and also were able to accurately replicate that on a mass scale.

I think that's a pretty "objective" way of putting it, don't you?

No. Not really. I said, objectively, and anyone being objective will realize this is true, the customs are more accurate in terms of looking like Heath Ledger and are of higher quality. That's factual. It doesn't mean you have to like the sculpts more. But to say HT sculpts are "better" in terms of quality and likeness is a falsity. To say you LIKE HT's sculpts better is your own, personal opinion, and no one can tell you you're wrong.

 

[batfan08]

That is not a falsity. To say it's a falsity is an opinion in and of itself. If I want to say HT sculpts are better, who are you to say otherwise? What makes your opinion factual? I'd say you're just butt-hurt because you shelled out bookoo bucks on a custom, and people disagree with your stance on the matter.

 

[wbss21]

That is not a falsity. To say it's a falsity is an opinion in and of itself. If I want to say HT sculpts are better, who are you to say otherwise? What makes your opinion factual? I'd say you're just butt-hurt because you shelled out bookoo bucks on a custom, and people disagree with your stance on the matter.

And one could easily just say you're jealous. I'm not saying you are. But nor am I'm "butt-hurt", lol. I don't care, believe me. I just find it extremely difficult to believe that one could objectively look at these sculpts and say that Hot Toy's sculpts are of better quality and more accurate in the features to the actor. They're not. Again, you don't have to like the sculpt, the expression, the paint apps, what have you, but to say HT's sculpts are "better", in terms of quality and likeness, is I believe just personal bias speaking.

 

[Padrinno]

Here my joker

 

[thedarkknight]

And one could easily just say you're jealous. I'm not saying you are. But nor am I'm "butt-hurt", lol. I don't care, believe me. I just find it extremely difficult to believe that one could objectively look at these sculpts and say that Hot Toy's sculpts are of better quality and more accurate in the features to the actor. They're not. Again, you don't have to like the sculpt, the expression, the paint apps, what have you, but to say HT's sculpts are "better", in terms of quality and likeness, is I believe just personal bias speaking.

Sorry, but it's still an opinion, from both of you.

 

[batfan08]

And one could easily just say you're jealous. I'm not saying you are. But nor am I'm "butt-hurt", lol. I don't care, believe me. I just find it extremely difficult to believe that one could objectively look at these sculpts and say that Hot Toy's sculpts are of better quality and more accurate in the features to the actor. They're not. Again, you don't have to like the sculpt, the expression, the paint apps, what have you, but to say HT's sculpts are "better", in terms of quality and likeness, is I believe just personal bias speaking.

...and you saying that yours are better is what, fact? Granted, I could've used a better term than butt-hurt, but you telling people that they're wrong or biased for holding a different opinion, and then stating that Hot Toys' sculpts aren't better as though your word is fact is just ridiculous.

 

[ZaCHw117]

I really like the DX's HS, but some of the custom heads are just jaw dropping. Can't wait to see what HT does with the 2.0

I agree that HT's cop joker's HS is better then the custom one though.

 

[Raymond F.]

I won't even go into the excessive head shaking I seem to do when I think and see all the money being thrown around on joker related stuff...

I put a BR head on my joker one and was happy. Then they showed DX and I was like whatever ill replace it but don't really care.

I've seen people drop thousands into custom jokers and at the end of the day I gotta be honest, it looks better than the DX joker yes... But not deal breaking better. Nothing that in my opinion is really worth forking out a cent more than the 200 or so the DX cost. That's just me though, obviously Kato is the man and can make anything look better but the way I look at it is, a man of his talent, if I'd want him to improve something it would be something that already sucked. Like sideshow James bond suits or something. Or something totally orginal that cant be cobbled together, like some more period style suits like from the godfather. Not an outfit that was pretty damn good already.

As far as the heads go I still think the bank robber head is as good as I've seen... The bobby c one I dont care for at all and intentional or not the flakyness looks sloppy to me.

I will agree that the Adam ones are awesome and can totally see why guys would like some of the expression variations like the laughing for variety.

But as far as replacing the standard hot toys stuff goes... Well whatever it's not my money but nothing annoys me more than all the interest threads for every Tom ____ and Harry sculptor doing a ledger joker... There's so many things I dont have that is rather see their talent applied to

 

[DarkMagic]

Sorry, but it's still an opinion, from both of you.

This.

You can't say one is "objectively" better, and then qualify it by saying you "believe" anyone that says different is speaking from personal bias...because that ENTIRE statement is an opinion.