Sithlord1975
Super Freak
Who is this kid??
James Cameron's AVATAR discussion thread
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Les Walker
Digging my way out!
Re: I saw AVATAR in 3D!
Best comment I have actually heard a friend say to me about AVATAR is, "It's the best Pagan movie ever made!" I laughed at that, and had to agree. It does sort of justify and embody all that stuff, so bless her heart for that comment.
I liked the movie a lot. Is it a top favorite, no. But I loved the immersion experience. The 3D was super. The plot is growing on me, but yeah, it's recycled. So what! It's Cameron on steriods, so just go have some fun. Leave any fanaticism at bay.
And Shai, for what it's worth, I am a HUGE Batman fan, but was not a huge Dark Knight movie fan, for personal reasons, even though I totally think it upgrades what superhero movies can be, I prefer still Batman Begins over it. But that statement aside, this Avatar is a cool movie. Worth seeing, and ONLY on a big screen, and in 3-D. All these not sure people should just go. You're either gonna like it or not, as there are no guarantees in life, but this one is sort of a given in one small respect, Cameron does not waste film. He does make entertainment. Go have fun, and leave expectations at home. This movie (and Cameron for that matter, admittedly...) could care less what you expect.
It's it's own thing in many ways. Just see it.
Best comment I have actually heard a friend say to me about AVATAR is, "It's the best Pagan movie ever made!" I laughed at that, and had to agree. It does sort of justify and embody all that stuff, so bless her heart for that comment.
I liked the movie a lot. Is it a top favorite, no. But I loved the immersion experience. The 3D was super. The plot is growing on me, but yeah, it's recycled. So what! It's Cameron on steriods, so just go have some fun. Leave any fanaticism at bay.
And Shai, for what it's worth, I am a HUGE Batman fan, but was not a huge Dark Knight movie fan, for personal reasons, even though I totally think it upgrades what superhero movies can be, I prefer still Batman Begins over it. But that statement aside, this Avatar is a cool movie. Worth seeing, and ONLY on a big screen, and in 3-D. All these not sure people should just go. You're either gonna like it or not, as there are no guarantees in life, but this one is sort of a given in one small respect, Cameron does not waste film. He does make entertainment. Go have fun, and leave expectations at home. This movie (and Cameron for that matter, admittedly...) could care less what you expect.
It's it's own thing in many ways. Just see it.
SnakeDoctor
Super Freak
Predictable and cliche'd, and this coming from a John Wayne fan. The mind boggles.
I've seen one John Wayne movie in my entire life. I like the quote.
SnakeDoc
LOTRFan
The Grey Pilgrim
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Who is this kid??
a 33 years old man, who likes substance and story over big explosion and shiny colors when watching a movie.
SnakeDoctor
Super Freak
I concur....but i still give it 10/10 tho....it's just so beautiful and i really related to the characters. And Sam Worthington is hot!
I'd give it a 3 or 4/10 at best ... based solely on the spectacle of the thing. Like I said -- extremely impressive visuals. Cameron should've invested more of his $500M on writing ...
The story was a joke.
A human gets lost among the wise and nature-connected natives. At first, they don't accept him. But, he goes through their trials and becomes one of them (by taming a small pterodactyl, because NO ONE can tame the slightly bigger pterodactyl). Then he gets rejected again the white man betrays them by toppling their giant tree ... led by two of the most one-dimensional villains in cinematic history -- (1) the bloodthirsty marine (a knockoff of R.Lee Ermey) who just likes watching indians bleed, and (2) the money-hungry corporate stooge who'd kill an infant with his bare hands for a nickel (chasing after a mineral called "unobtainium" ... how inventive). Blah, blah.
The human must re-win the trust of the wise treeless natives, so he tames the big pterodactyl (it didn't appear any more difficult than the small pterodactyl) ... wahoo. He gives a cheesy melodramatic speech (they can take our lives, but they'll never take our freedom ... today is our independence day!), rallies the natives, and becomes the leader of the blue indians. Several shallow meaningless characters (red shirts) die in the meantime (to prove that the situation is serious) ... the altruistic scientist, the gung-ho helicopter pilot that realized the error of her ways and the beauty of the blue nature-people, the wise indian chief, the lead indian warrior .... I had to choke back the tears.
The new indian leader prays to the tree of mother nature for help. The indians attack to preempt the human "shock-and-awe", "daisy-cutter" campaign (very subtle cultural references there). At first, it goes well because the indians' wooden arrows can all of a sudden pierce the windshields of military vehicles ... what luck! Then it looks bad, because arrows still suck. But, then the day is saved when the magic tree unleashes the woodland creatures (apparently just finished cleaning Snow White's cabin) who defeat the big, bad military and save the magic tree forever (THAT'S the ending that this 3-hours were building up to?!?! A magic tree controlled by mother nature? Yippee.)
The human decides to permanently become a blue indian. There is happiness among the nature-people.
Who writes this stuff? There wasn't an unpredictable moment in this entire movie. The characters were shallow and one-dimensional. The story was tired and cliche'd. It was a complete mess with impressive visual effects.
And, for the record, I loved the Dark Knight ... so I'm hardly a contrarian (I don't dislike things just because they're popular ... I dislike things just because they suck). And, I'm complaining on this thread because I spent $12.00 on this movie, and I want to get $12.00 worth of amusement out of it.
SnakeDoc
Bamboota
Super Freak
Its my mission.My Holy War on this forum.I must denounce the farce that is cacavatar.Sorry.
ironwez20
Super Freak
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laudanum09
Super Freak
Great movie. well as a movie objectively it was pretty decent. As an anti-imperialist allegory, I thoroughly enjoyed it. Propagandistic demonization of corporate greed and military hubris in a somewhat kid-friendly way is only a good thing in my book.
willocrew
Super Freak
I completely disagree with you.
While Avatar's plot admittedly comes straight out of a scriptwriting 101 textbook with the inevitable 'good triumphs over evil' conclusion, I think James Cameron has taken the right approach by sticking to this 'safe' plot formula/structure.
From a film-maker's perspective, they have spent huge amounts of money making this film & having a 'safe' storyline is the smart thing to do for the sake of commercial appeal.
What they want is to make enough returns from this movie to warrant a sequel because a sequel is where the real money is gonna be at since all the ground work has already been laid. It makes no sense screwing around with a risky plot & spoiling Avatar's appeal.
From a feature film fan's perspective, i'll take polished predictable stuff over a film that tries too hard to be different & fails.
How often have we seen directors try too hard and end up with a convoluted mess of a movie? Matrix sequels anyone?
I pay money to watch hollywood feature films so I can have a good time & just sit back & enjoy my friday night.
I watch lower budget European short-films for my dose of thought provoking & controversial material.
laudanum09
Super Freak
^ I dig.
i too wanted to just enjoy my friday night and i did, but it really didnt hurt that there was a black and white, caricatured, evil imperialists vs. peaceful natives plot. that just sealed the deal, seriously. i don't watch eisenstein's movies for the depth of story, i watch them because they WERE cinematically revolutionary AND to see commies blowing up stuff and winning. I kinda liked Avatar in the same way. visually stunning and something unrivaled plus a simple hook that I could get down with. I'm sure there are people on the other side of the aisle that liked a movie like Red Dawn for the same reasons, as cheesy BS propaganda that they can dig with action. never took it to be something overly thought provoking nor did i see it as trying to. it was a simple allegory with spectacular visuals and fine acting. good stuff.
i too wanted to just enjoy my friday night and i did, but it really didnt hurt that there was a black and white, caricatured, evil imperialists vs. peaceful natives plot. that just sealed the deal, seriously. i don't watch eisenstein's movies for the depth of story, i watch them because they WERE cinematically revolutionary AND to see commies blowing up stuff and winning. I kinda liked Avatar in the same way. visually stunning and something unrivaled plus a simple hook that I could get down with. I'm sure there are people on the other side of the aisle that liked a movie like Red Dawn for the same reasons, as cheesy BS propaganda that they can dig with action. never took it to be something overly thought provoking nor did i see it as trying to. it was a simple allegory with spectacular visuals and fine acting. good stuff.
SnakeDoctor
Super Freak
I'm not a film snob. I don't watch artsy european films. I don't watch many "controversial" movies. I like big-budget action flicks. Among my favorite movies are Die Hard and The Dark Knight.
But, if a movie makes me roll my eyes throughout, it isn't going to get high marks. It doesn't have to be too edgy -- but I don't want to watch a story that could've been written by a high school drama student. Some character complexity would be a good thing. A single plot twist or unexpected moment; one sympathetic military guy; a shred of non-highmindeness among the natives. The wise indian thing has been done to death. It was a half-assed story that's been told a hundred times, with characters that were flat and uninteresting.
And, I've had enough of the preachy junk. We get it already. Tell a good story, don't give me a lesson.
SnakeDoc
But, if a movie makes me roll my eyes throughout, it isn't going to get high marks. It doesn't have to be too edgy -- but I don't want to watch a story that could've been written by a high school drama student. Some character complexity would be a good thing. A single plot twist or unexpected moment; one sympathetic military guy; a shred of non-highmindeness among the natives. The wise indian thing has been done to death. It was a half-assed story that's been told a hundred times, with characters that were flat and uninteresting.
And, I've had enough of the preachy junk. We get it already. Tell a good story, don't give me a lesson.
SnakeDoc
SnakeDoctor
Super Freak
For the record, you didn't actually disagree with me. We seem to agree in principle that it was a simple-minded "safe" (cliche'd) story out of "scriptwriting 101". You simply asserted that you liked that it was cliche'd.
SnakeDoc
laudanum09
Super Freak
^ Well said, but Die Hard lacks everything you just criticized the movie for not having.
EDIT: and I love Die Hard.
EDIT: and I love Die Hard.
Nothing is truly original... just something you're not familiar with...
everybody is familiar with this story... nothing wrong with that...
everybody is familiar with this story... nothing wrong with that...
SnakeDoctor
Super Freak
Die Hard has a complex and nuanced villain (one of the more underrated villains in cinematic history). Die Hard has an engaging plot. Die Hard has a complex reluctant hero (breaking cliche) and both competence and incompetence among the police officers. There is character depth, and characters you actually care about.
Die Hard is everything that Avatar isn't.
SnakeDoc
SnakeDoctor
Super Freak
Familiarity does not preclude SOME originality. I'm not asking for complete originality ... but A LITTLE unpredictability and/or character depth is not too much to ask.
I could've written this thing myself ... and, my policy is, if I can do it, it ain't that good.
SnakeDoc
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