Keaton Batman- Custom

[MaulFan]

Re: Keaton Batman

Shawn's batman is the best Keaton batman fig ever made in my opinion.

And a much better return on your investment, in my opinion all the customs that guy has up are overpriced, the figures should look better for the money he's charging. The only thing I like about his Batman is the weapons, not sure where he got them to include but that's a nice addition to have. The cowl on the Wayne head version looks horrendous to me.

 

[MINIATURE-ART]

Re: Keaton Batman

And a much better return on your investment, in my opinion all the customs that guy has up are overpriced, the figures should look better for the money he's charging. The only thing I like about his Batman is the weapons, not sure where he got them to include but that's a nice addition to have. The cowl on the Wayne head version looks horrendous to me.

The grapnel gun is Billiken as well. Billiken made a version "B" figure holding a grapnel gun in the right hand.

BOBBY

 

[Natrix]

Re: Keaton Batman

hey check this out:
https://cgi.ebay.com/12-inch-Black-...Z2480QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1742.m153.l1262
"black man returns"? wtf?

WB has been cracking down on custom DC figures so sellers are trying to get around having their auctions taken down.

 

[eighthsamurai]

Re: Keaton Batman

are you serious???
WB are the biggests arses around. what a bunch of idiots. i thought i might be something like that but i didn't want to believe it.

 

[zedex9r]

Re: Keaton Batman

I am actually really surprised that it has taken this long for a company or licensee to take action. As much as we all enjoy a good custom, when someone starts to make money from using a well known actor or character the property holders take notice.

In the real world the person making a custom to sell is in effect bypassing all the proprietary rights that the company has the rights to hold.

These figures need to made as "knockoffs" which is what the seller has now done by changing the names to avoid the counterfeiting and licensing right violations that was happening.

Warner Brothers or any other major company with big brand names have every right to protect their interests. while it is ok to make a custom licensed character for your own collection, it's when you start selling them and making a profit at their expense that they are forced to do this.

No need for the name calling

 

[MaulFan]

Re: Keaton Batman

Interestingly, they also identify them as Mike Keaton and V Kilmer to not even use the full actor names.

 

[Captain Britain]

Re: Keaton Batman

I think it's okay to call Warner Brothers names. They crack down on sellers of custom toys to preserve their business interests...yet these probably demonstrate more artistry than 90% of their own product. The company that made Batman and Robin, and took twenty years to make a new Superman movie, then made Superman Returns, should look to its own stewardship of these cultural icons before it tries to stop customisers producing what consumers basically want.

No more finger waving please, it's rude.

 

[zedex9r]

Re: Keaton Batman

I think it's okay to call Warner Brothers names.

No, actually it's not. It is immature and not necessary.

Hey I am all for a good quality custom of those hard to get characters but I also believe that companies have a right to protect their licenses.

As you can clearly see, these figures are still for sale and Warner Brothers haven't put a complete stop to it. They are still clearly recognisable for who they are portraying, all that seems to be required was some simple name changes. Even the chinese "knock offs" have the good sense to use different names most of the time.

To call these custom figures my their licensed names on Ebay means that people searching for official products are lead to believe that they have purchased them. This is what Warner Brothers are trying to stop to help protect their name.

Do you think that any of the money made from the sale of these figures goes back to Warner Brothers in any way? I very much doubt it. Hardly seems fair to me especially when these figures sell for nearly as much as a Hot Toys Batman. At least I know with Hot Toys royalty fees are going back to Warner Brothers to help contribute to future projects.

In the past even Hot Toys were known to make unofficial "famous types" interpretations of certain people but never used the names and rights held by the license holder. But in the end even they sought out the licenses to produce Official merchandise. Personally I think that there is a great more benefit to this as we get high quality movie accurate figures with the backup and support of the license holder.

I already have one of the Soveriegn fantastic customs coming soon and you know what, I would have still purchased this figure even if it was called The Black Knight or something to that effect.

 

[Captain Britain]

Re: Keaton Batman

I'm all for capitalism and the rule of law, but singing a hymn in support of WB's right to protect its properties is a bit much. I don't actually disagree with anything you say, I just don't see the need to say it at all.

But I'm sure your praise for the work of the Warner Brothers anti-piracy department would warm the hearts of the Warner Brothers board of directors, if they actually gave a ^^^^ about anything you have to say.

You do know that many important figures in the entertainment industry have links to organised crime, right?

 

[Masao]

Re: Keaton Batman

Zed has a point, but it is not for the reasons stated.

In the USA, customizing is not only legal, it seems to be the one surviving exception to buying non-existent products. Supposedly, this is to protect the right to sell these products -even if the company never makes or licenses them. I don't see the logic myself. Can you threaten a business that does not exist?

According to an FTC lawyer I have been in contact with; "You can modify anything you buy." There is no continued ownership of an individual item once it is sold. However, the current law protects "Intellectual Property" rights such as copyright and trademark.

The result is that you can buy a figure and make any customization you like, but you cannot sell the item as "-man" as identified by the registered trademarks etc. You can make the image, you just can't use the name...or sell it using the registered trademarks.

Oddly, if you sculpt a figure from scratch, you may be in violation of someone else's IP rights! Stupid I know, but Lawyers run the world, not the good guys.

The interesting point about all this is that the non-recast model kits built as action figures should clearly be free of any legal restrictions! Why? They are already licensed items!! If they are illegal, licensing means nothing.

That is the way I would vote if I were a juror.

BTW, if any of my info about legal points is out of date or circumstances change, I stand corrected. I also stand by my opinion of current legal abuses.

In case anyone cares -Batman is a derivative work.

 

[eighthsamurai]

Re: Keaton Batman

No need for the name calling

dude, it seems you come from a corporate world where big companies are allowed to produce crap and peddle it to the public, where lawyers and accountants largely dictate and limit the artistic output we get to see and own.

i come from boards like this that want to see people take these beloved characters away from all that greed and crap and do something amazing with them - like make great custom figures. it makes for art. it makes people love the characters more. if anything these big companies should be grateful that these customisers are creating awareness and a love for these characters in a way they find it very hard to do so.

i love batman. and superman. and warner brothers have ^^^^ed around with both many times in the past. so yes i will call them names and if you work for them, i apologise.

forgetting the stupid contracts and laws etc. for one minute, the public owns batman. not some machine like WB. so put that finger away. if this customiser spent his hard earned time and money perfecting a batman creation, something he loves, i feel he should be allowed to sell it. but the law says otherwise. i couldn't defend WB's actions myself. but you have a perfectly 100% valid and completely legal argument there. i just don't think it should be that way.

another thing, any idiot who searches for a batman figure on ebay and doesn't realise it's a custom, especially when it says in big letters in the description that its a custom should be disappointed by buying it. i can't see how they would though. that 1/6 ebay fig is better than any WB have released - oh wait they haven't!

and you must really have some interest in WB. i called a large corporation names, and you defended them and decided to insult me, a fellow board member, instead. nice.

 

[Roc74]

Re: Keaton Batman

But I'm sure your praise for the work of the Warner Brothers anti-piracy department would warm the hearts of the Warner Brothers board of directors, if they actually gave a ^^^^ about anything you have to say.

I dont disagree with what Zender says neither but i wouldnt put my neck for them niether...
Some companies at least try to show they are not only in it for the profit but also for the fans/consumers. They could be just pretending but at least they try...
WB I believe only in it for Profit, which is nothing wrong with, just that I wont be displaying any type of loyalty to them niether...

 

[galactiboy]

Re: Keaton Batman

This is actually an interesting discussion, I really hadn't thought about the legality of making a custom figure of a character and selling it. I had assumed that if you made the figure it was okay, but totally makes sense how it would infringement.

I'll still buy customs and sleep fine at night, but interesting nonetheless.

 

[sladesuperagent]

Re: Keaton Batman

Just wanted to chime in and say "Eff WB!"

I think I could come up with a great, mature argument for that statement, but I probably already have somewhere on this board...

Wait--here it is--I'm gonna go throw on my Adam West Batman series DVD..oh, wait, there ISN'T one?!?!

Yeah, EFF WB!

 

[eighthsamurai]

Re: Keaton Batman

eff 'em in the ear!

 

[MaulFan]

Re: Keaton Batman

I have to say, while WB is big corporate and the ones making decisions have little to do with the actual creation of characters and designs, I do respect the protection of rights to the use of images and designs and such created. This is similar to the Orphaned Works Act issues and those bother me so it'd be hypocritical to attack WB. As an artist, if I take the time to make a photo or an illustration or whatever, I should be entitled to full control over its use. If someone uses that work for a little mom and pop store that only 200 people will ever see, I would still expect some sort of reimbursement for the use of my work, I put in the labor and I should be able to control when, where and how it's used. It's hard to swallow that mentallity from corporations like WB because it's the suits, not Keaton or Burton or people really hands on in the creation of the source material for these items, who are making the call as to what can and can't be done, but I favor the protection of rights and if photographers and illustrators and the likes are to be protected then it's only fair to allow films and such the same protections.

 

[Lee in MI]

Re: Keaton Batman

I agree with Maulfan here. As an architect, we too have to have control (usually joint control with the owner) of our work so that it is not plagerized (sp?) by others...other architects and/or contractors. That prevents others from making mo' dollars offa your ideals and your intellectual work. But...

I do see what you guys are saying and I think the anger and frustration are born out of WB inability to churn out good products for the fans and consumers based on the properties they control. I believe it is because they are so big that they both miss opportunities and pass on others due to there not being a large return on their investment if they were to promote certain properties...especially old properties like the original BM or the 60's TV show. So they take an "if we can't/wont do it, no one can" position which they are legally entitled to.

But I say they can have their rights and I still say Eff em for not being good stewards of such great properties!

Bring on the CUSTOMS!!!

 

[eighthsamurai]

Re: Keaton Batman

anyone receive anything recently? mine still isn't here. i'm wondering if it's been shipped or not. half way through month 8 now.

 

[Figurefreaks]

Re: Keaton Batman

anyone receive anything recently? mine still isn't here. i'm wondering if it's been shipped or not. half way through month 8 now.

No ...still waiting.

 

[EVILFACE]

Re: Keaton Batman

8 months??? That sucks.

I waited that long for my Arnold head though . .