LOST discussion - thar be spoilers ahead!

[SwedishHeat]

You're assuming that The Purge was when Ben joined the Others. I think that they had been working together long before that, with Ben acting as their inside man amongst Dharma for many years. Throughout the 80's and up until '92, Ben (with young Ethan under his wing) still lived at the barracks, but had obviously been sneaking out at nights and building a relationship with Richard and friends. The two of them survived the purge due to their advance knowledge/cooperation and lived amongst the Others afterwards. But I think Ben chose sides and began a cooperative relationship with them all the way back in '77.

Ben was ready to join them after he was healed as a boy, but I have a feeling that Widmore dangled that carrot in front of Ben throughout many years worth of tests--"You can't join us until you spy on Dharma...and kill Rousseau and the baby. OK, now you can't join us until you kill your father." In fact, I think that Widmore's relationship with Ben mirrors Ben's own treatment of Locke as he was strung along and tested before his acceptance into the Others. (And both Widmore and Ben ended up losing their position of authority to the newcomer.)

I like your theory about why Ben was stringing Locke along, it explains why Ben hated Widmore so much. But that would mean Rousseau and crew crashed on the island while DHARMA was still active. it seems odd that they could have explored so much of the island without being caught. I'm sure they were trudging around the jungle for at least a week or so.

 

[tomandshell]

Should I bring anything Tom?

Yes, you can bring this:

https://abctvstore.seenon.com/detail.php?p=255004&pa=dotw

 

[Deeznutz6]

Wow, glad that infamous smokey was answered somewhat

 

[beeshaw]

Got more answers than I expected. Smokey, the ash, the whispers, what happened to the Cindy and the kids...

 

[Darth Waller]

OK, so when "Locke" and Richard spoke at the end of the episode, he mentioned something about being in chains the last time they met and Richard knew who "Locke" really was. Anyone remember where/when that event took place?

 

[beeshaw]

I'm assuming it has something to do with the Black Rock, which is where I think the other other's in the temple are from.

 

[beeshaw]

Whispers were heard when the other others were snatching everyone up. And Cindy was at the temple, with the kids. She was the one that told them that Jack and Co. were on the first crashed plane with her.

 

[The ill Jedi]

First twenty minutes for me = WTF?

 

[Something Sexy]

Was pretty decent. Wasn't a mind blowing 2 hours but good. I like what they are doing with the two versions of everyone. Will be interesting to see how it all comes together.

 

[plasmid303]

It was a cool surprise to see Hiroyuki Sanada in the show. I didn't see the point of his character having a translator since Sanada can speak fluent English without too heavy an accent.

 

[Michael Crawford]

It's part of his character - his comment about english really does tend to indicate he was on the Black Rock or from that period, at least to me.

Not sure how the whispers were 'explained', since we've already seen them in the past in relation to the Others and attacks.

The fact that the smoke monster has been manipulating everyone from the crashes since the very beginning as a sentient being trying to destroy Jacob through them is pretty interesting, and I suspect answers an awful lot of questions on review. I wonder if there's been any indication that it was manipulating Dharma as well...perhaps they believed they'd made a 'discovery' and harnessed it to be a security system, only to be manipulated by it against Jacob, thus the battle with the Others. Let's face it, we really don't know why the hatred and war between the Others and Dharma, beyond the obvious "we don't want you here" concept. Now with the smoke monster being something much more intelligent (the guy sitting with Jacob at the end of last season watching the black rock sail in, I'm assuming), and with the Others clearly fearing him/it, they'd had the desire to defeat anyone helping it and keep anyone else away....hmmm, interesting. Which is what's so great about the show!

 

[Darth Waller]

It'll be interesting to see how these two realities pan out. Maybe the island life will turn out to be the better one.

 

[316what]

OK, so when "Locke" and Richard spoke at the end of the episode, he mentioned something about being in chains the last time they met and Richard knew who "Locke" really was. Anyone remember where/when that event took place?

I don't think they've shown or mentioned this before last night. Hopefully there will be another Richard centric episode that answers more of his questions: relationship to Jacob and Smokey, etc.

 

[Darth Waller]

I don't think they've shown or mentioned this before last night. Hopefully there will be another Richard centric episode that answers more of his questions: relationship to Jacob and Smokey, etc.

I started to wonder that as well. Richard is one of the more interesting characters on this show and we still know very little about him.

 

[Michael Crawford]

It certainly sounds like Black Rock to me, and we've discussed before that Richard being on the ship makes a lot of sense. It also makes a lot of sense since the arrival of the Rock seems so key to the relationship between Jacob and the smoke monster. Before that we see them discussing lfe on the beach, clearly a yin and yang but at least together - after that this war appears to begin. Was it the influence of the Rock's travelers that caused the inbalance, or was it just coincidence?

But if he was refering to the Rock, man, that's a long time for Richard to avoid the smoke monster...

 

[Something Sexy]

Maybe Richard is the middle man between Jacob and the man in black. Maybe he was the one setting the rules.

 

[Darthrazz]

So anyone else think that Jacob is now Sayid just as the smoke monster is now John Locke?

 

[Something Sexy]

Ha that would be kind of sweet and i guess make sense. Then Sayid is really dead. If that is the case then how many times do you think THAT is going to happen?

 

[lcummins]

It certainly sounds like Black Rock to me, and we've discussed before that Richard being on the ship makes a lot of sense. It also makes a lot of sense since the arrival of the Rock seems so key to the relationship between Jacob and the smoke monster. Before that we see them discussing lfe on the beach, clearly a yin and yang but at least together - after that this war appears to begin. Was it the influence of the Rock's travelers that caused the inbalance, or was it just coincidence?

But if he was refering to the Rock, man, that's a long time for Richard to avoid the smoke monster...

Ah, but... When Jacob and the man in black were talking about the Black Rock, the MiB inferred that Jacob had brought many people to the island and it always ended in death and tragedy every time, so the Black Rock wasn't the "start" so to speak.

 

[The Ween]

I MISSED IT!!!!!!