Prometheus Sequel (ALIEN: Covenant)

[Bravomite]

They should have had said that Covenant was damaged to the point where they had to make a pit stop. That they needed some critical resource that just happened to be on the planet forcing them to go down. Or that their navigation system was wrecked and they had the choice of either living out their lives on the ship until the air ran out or hope they get lucky down on the planet. Then when David was brought on board they could have said that he fixed the navigation or something. So many other reasons they could have had the team go down to explore a completely untested planet.

I had this same discussion with my wife after seeing the film. It would make their decision to check out the planet and deviate from the original mission so much more believable. It also would take one of Oram's (Crudup) beyond foolish decisions out of his hands.

Spoiler

Oram's other ridiculous decision to trust David and look into the egg would have played out better if he had refused to look into the egg. However, whilst distracted by egg chamber, David uses his impressive android speed and strength to rush Oram and hold his head over the egg and say something creepy like 'things would have been so much easier if you just had a little more faith'. Or perhaps in response to Oram's comment that he has seen the devil with reference to David, David could have replied along the lines of 'I rather see myself as something of a creator, would you like to meet my children?' I feel the movie needed to pay off the 'faith' aspect of Oram's character that Scott had taken pain to set up earlier

 

[guyver1]

Spoiler

the whole David to Walter to Mother connection is what's leaving me confused , not to mention why did David have to be God to the creation process of the aliens

Why Ridley..Why

 

[jye4ever]

This movie really does collapse if you get hung up on the foolishness of the cast. Even moreso than Prometheus. The whole time they were down on the planet all I kept thinking was that they could literally be on "Skull Island: The Planet" for all they knew. T-Rexes, Kongs, kaijus, any conceivable killer insect or other creepy crawly to say nothing of poisonous plants, viruses and other toxins. It boggles the mind really.

They should have had said that Covenant was damaged to the point where they had to make a pit stop. That they needed some critical resource that just happened to be on the planet forcing them to go down. Or that their navigation system was wrecked and they had the choice of either living out their lives on the ship until the air ran out or hope they get lucky down on the planet. Then when David was brought on board they could have said that he fixed the navigation or something. So many other reasons they could have had the team go down to explore a completely untested planet.

The film's plot is pretty indefensible. The reason I was still able to enjoy it was because the mayhem and tone was so dark and unsettling. And that

Spoiler

in the end no one was rewarded for their stupidity. They all died in ways that made me sympathize for them. Maybe like a "good" slasher movie where technically everyone's an idiot but you forgive the movie and just embrace the shlock. But if I didn't have that feeling I'd completely write off the film like so many of you on account of the absurdity of the characters' actions.

As usual another great analysis by the mighty Khevbacca.

I will give you the no reward for stupidity angle but man did I have a hard time swallowing that stupid Ion hurricane storm being the reason why they couldn't go down.

That is just lazy writing.

 

[guyver1]

Spoiler

And what did everyone think about the fate of Shaw and the mystery behind it

 

[jye4ever]

As a "prequel" to ALIEN and ALIENS it's still better than TPM/AOTC/ROTS. But otherwise yeah, best not to think of it as being connected to A1/A2. However I do think that Covenant can be enjoyed as a parallel reboot of sorts. Interesting that the only truly great prequel (Rogue One) was made by a different director than the original film. These Academy Award nominated/winning directors (Lucas, Scott, and Jackson) apparently really struggle with going back to tell the origins of their own films.

Even the mighty Spielberg with Jurassic and Indy!

Trevorrow > Spielberg

Gareth > Lucas

 

[theuzi9mm]

Spoiler

And what did everyone think about the fate of Shaw and the mystery behind it

I felt it was a cheap cop out TBH.

 

[Khev]

Spoiler

Oram's other ridiculous decision to trust David and look into the egg would have played out better if he had refused to look into the egg. However, whilst distracted by egg chamber, David uses his impressive android speed and strength to rush Oram and hold his head over the egg and say something creepy like 'things would have been so much easier if you just had a little more faith'. Or perhaps in response to Oram's comment that he has seen the devil with reference to David, David could have replied along the lines of 'I rather see myself as something of a creator, would you like to meet my children?' I feel the movie needed to pay off the 'faith' aspect of Oram's character that Scott had taken pain to set up earlier

Agreed. They hadn't come across a single benign entity on that planet. Oram's decision to inspect the egg made absolutely no sense whatsoever. Really nothing in the film made much sense. Why did the first Xenomorph that burst from Oram recognize

Spoiler

David as his "father?" I literally chuckled when the little xeno stood up and stretched out its arms like naked little Kal-El emerging from the pod in 1978 Superman.

This film was just freaking absurd but somehow not in a way that turned me off to it.

Even the mighty Spielberg with Jurassic and Indy!

Trevorrow > Spielberg

Gareth > Lucas

Yep.

And I too think that Noomi Rapace should have appeared in the film in some way. Even if it was super brief like that "prologue" clip that was released online (which I just watched for the first time *after* seeing the movie.) Having her not appear at all took me a bit out of the movie because it seemed like a jarring break from Prometheus and had me wondering whether Rapace had fallen out of favor with Scott, she had a scheduling conflict, the studio didn't want to pay her, etc., when I instead should have been wrapped up in nothing but the on-screen story.

Her fate was pretty disturbing though and did set up the gut punch of the ending quite nicely.

 

[Bravomite]

Why did the first Xenomorph that burst from Oram recognize

Spoiler

David as his "father?" I literally chuckled when the little xeno stood up and stretched out its arms like naked little Kal-El emerging from the pod in 1978 Superman.

That moment reminded me of baby groot lol way to make the

Spoiler

chestburster ridiculously unthreatening

 

[jye4ever]

Agreed. They hadn't come across a single benign entity on that planet. Oram's decision to inspect the egg made absolutely no sense whatsoever. Really nothing in the film made much sense. Why did the first Xenomorph that burst from Oram recognize

Spoiler

David as his "father?" I literally chuckled when the little xeno stood up and stretched out its arms like naked little Kal-El emerging from the pod in 1978 Superman.

This film was just freaking absurd but somehow not in a way that turned me off to it.



Yep.

And I too think that Noomi Rapace should have appeared in the film in some way. Even if it was super brief like that "prologue" clip that was released online (which I just watched for the first time *after* seeing the movie.) Having her not appear at all took me a bit out of the movie because it seemed like a jarring break from Prometheus and had me wondering whether Rapace had fallen out of favor with Scott, she had a scheduling conflict, the studio didn't want to pay her, etc., when I instead should have been wrapped up in nothing but the on-screen story.

Her fate was pretty disturbing though and did set up the gut punch of the ending quite nicely.

Well they showed a photo of her mutilated

crows said she had harassment problems during the making of Pro.

 

[crows]

As a "prequel" to ALIEN and ALIENS it's still better than TPM/AOTC/ROTS. But otherwise yeah, best not to think of it as being connected to A1/A2. However I do think that Covenant can be enjoyed as a parallel reboot of sorts. Interesting that the only truly great prequel (Rogue One) was made by a different director than the original film. These Academy Award nominated/winning directors (Lucas, Scott, and Jackson) apparently really struggle with going back to tell the origins of their own films.

Not to mention the whole anthology including AVP and Requiem IMO.

I guess it all depends on Awakening. If Scott doesn't pull it off, I'd say end the franchise in films

It makes laugh so much that they ruined the continuity with AVP and they always talk about AVP as the ugly stepchild,

But this movie is being hated and will be equally ignored the same as AVP

 

[theuzi9mm]

It makes laugh so much that they ruined the continuity with AVP and they always talk about AVP as the ugly stepchild,

But this movie is being hated and will be equally ignored the same as AVP

Indeed wasn't fox considering making AvP movies 'canon' they technically can't now....

 

[crows]

Ridley Scott hates the queen alien so much he also ruined aliens forever as well.

These movies should just be called ALIEN: David.

Instead of xenomorphs they should be called Davidmorphs.

 

[theuzi9mm]

Ridley Scott hates the queen alien so much he also ruined aliens forever as well.

These movies should just be called ALIEN: David.

Instead of xenomorphs they should be called Davidmorphs.

Ridley won't be satisfied until he merges Blade Runner with Alien I think. Alien: Replicant and Alien: David (sub sub title) The First Replicant


I have a feeling that somehow he will spin it as though Matt Damon turns out to be the space jockey, only after Russell Crowe fights David in a gladiator match to the death.

 

[screamingmetal]

While we're talking about stupid scenes and characters in Covenant, I'd like to add those stupid scenes where Brett was just standing there with a giant 7 foot tall monster black bug that just burst out of Kane's chest hours/days before, sneering at him with sharp metal teeth and all Brett does is just stand there looking up at the monster going "ooh wow" or when Lambert was so scared all she did was stand there crying while the same 7 foot tall black bug with sharp teeth slowly walks over to kill her after dumb ass Parker was just killed in front of her while trying to save her! More dumb characters doing dumb things that just don't make sense!
Alien Covenant and Prometheus have some stupid characters in them, who would ever think they're perfect movies.






I saw Covenant on Sunday, I liked it.
If you look too deeply at any movie you'll find something that'll irk you.

 

[Centurion]

Ridley Scott hates the queen alien so much he also ruined aliens forever as well.

These movies should just be called ALIEN: David.

Instead of xenomorphs they should be called Davidmorphs.

Right. LOL!

Then David will be called "Mother"

 

[RIDDICK]

Crazy Ass David > Drag Queen Alien

 

[theuzi9mm]

While we're talking about stupid scenes and characters in Covenant, I'd like to add those stupid scenes where Brett was just standing there with a giant 7 foot tall monster black bug that just burst out of Kane's chest hours/days before, sneering at him with sharp metal teeth and all Brett does is just stand there looking up at the monster going "ooh wow" or when Lambert was so scared all she did was stand there crying while the same 7 foot tall black bug with sharp teeth slowly walks over to kill her after dumb ass Parker was just killed in front of her while trying to save her! More dumb characters doing dumb things that just don't make sense!
Alien Covenant and Prometheus have some stupid characters in them, who would ever think they're perfect movies.






I saw Covenant on Sunday, I liked it.
If you look too deeply at any movie you'll find something that'll irk you.

They were freaked/terrified. In many cases humans are well known to freeze and be unable to move, I've witnessed it firsthand when someone is so scared they literally will not move. In Brett's case more disbelief as he just a minute before found the skin, and Ridley's genius of that scene, no words, but takes a few seconds and then Brett's eyes bug out because he realized hey, that thing probably grew or is growing. Cut to a minute later when he's face to face wth it, he's more in shock as to how large and fast it grew.

Lambert, well....she's a woman, so go figure....

 

[theuzi9mm]

Crazy Ass David > Drag Queen Alien

Since Ridley's already got the story laid out....

 

[RIDDICK]

I'm still pissed off at them for deletin' this scene.

 

[screamingmetal]

They were freaked/terrified. In many cases humans are well known to freeze and be unable to move, I've witnessed it firsthand when someone is so scared they literally will not move. In Brett's case more disbelief as he just a minute before found the skin, and Ridley's genius of that scene, no words, but takes a few seconds and then Brett's eyes bug out because he realized hey, that thing probably grew or is growing. Cut to a minute later when he's face to face wth it, he's more in shock as to how large and fast it grew.

Lambert, well....she's a woman, so go figure....

Oh I agree, and sometimes people make stupid decisions like divert course for a couple of weeks to investigate a newly discovered habitable world with a human being on it after awakening from cryo and seeing 48 people die including their captain rather than go back into cryo for another 6 years, or look into the leathery egg thing after it opens because the Machiavellian android kindly asked you too.

I spent a few hours catching up reading some of this thread, and those were just a couple of the problems I read people have with Covenant.