READ FIRST POST! [iminime] Wall Street Killer - Patrick Bateman

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Re: FINAL SCREAMING SCULPT REVEAL [iminime] Wall Street Killer - Patrick Bateman

Even though I'm not an artist, I do understand that the final product will come out better if an artist has their heart in it. Most people tend to not understand that and think that someone who has the gift can just pull off anything.

What I don't get is the difference between the two expressions. She already has a good handle on Bale's likeness without having her "heart into it" or being a fan personally. Why would she be able to capture his likeness so much more in a sculpt that's smiling as opposed to a sculpt that's angry. How much really changes between the two expressions and where does likeness get lost? I just don't see how you can do one so confidently and not the other.

As far as voting and all of that, from the beginning this was a project done for the people. No one in Iminime is a fan of this movie. If they were fans, they wouldn't have chose the screaming sculpt to begin with; or it would've been more scene accurate and not based off of a promo pic found in google images. They wanted to use their own artistic freedom and that's where that sculpt came from. Denny thought it was going to be a crowd shocker but it wasn't. By not being a fan, there is a disconnect with the character and a lack of understanding in the way Bateman is perceived by fans.

The clear balance to this equation is a more serious sculpt and it should be based solely on the nail gun shot. All other angles should only be used as reference for facial features.

Whoever has a nice sized, clear image of the nail gun expression, please post it (I can't find a good enough one). It's the 4th pic on the bottom row of Axe's collage 2 pages back.

They should mix that look with this longer hair style (longer than the screaming sculpt), or just use this as the runner up pic to base the sculpt from:


5pat-1.jpg
 
Re: FINAL SCREAMING SCULPT REVEAL [iminime] Wall Street Killer - Patrick Bateman

Even though I'm not an artist, I do understand that the final product will come out better if an artist has their heart in it. Most people tend to not understand that and think that someone who has the gift can just pull off anything.

What I don't get is the difference between the two expressions. She already has a good handle on Bale's likeness without having her "heart into it" or being a fan personally. Why would she be able to capture his likeness so much more in a sculpt that's smiling as opposed to a sculpt that's angry. How much really changes between the two expressions and where does likeness get lost? I just don't see how you can do one so confidently and not the other.

As far as voting and all of that, from the beginning this was a project done for the people. No one in Iminime is a fan of this movie. If they were fans, they wouldn't have chose the screaming sculpt to begin with; or it would've been more scene accurate and not based off of a promo pic found in google images. They wanted to use their own artistic freedom and that's where that sculpt came from. Denny thought it was going to be a crowd shocker but it wasn't. By not being a fan, there is a disconnect with the character and a lack of understanding in the way Bateman is perceived by fans.

The clear balance to this equation is a more serious sculpt and it should be based solely on the nail gun shot. All other angles should only be used as reference for facial features.

Whoever has a nice sized, clear image of the nail gun expression, please post it (I can't find a good enough one). It's the 4th pic on the bottom row of Axe's collage 2 pages back.

They should mix that look with this longer hair style (longer than the screaming sculpt), or just use this as the runner up pic to base the sculpt from:


5pat-1.jpg




No point in posting pics they are doing what they want and I respect that from a artist standpoint .
 
Re: FINAL SCREAMING SCULPT REVEAL [iminime] Wall Street Killer - Patrick Bateman

Yes they expressed their artistic freedom with the screaming sculpt. The vote was to see what the fans wanted for the 2nd sculpt. And the winning choice was undisputed

Let's not forget that this project was brought to Denny's attention by the fans and it was only our desire for Bateman that brought him to life. This is also very likely Iminime's most important project that they have going right now. The numbers prove that: The size of the interest list, the amount of pages in the thread, the amount of different boardies posting, etc. Based on statistic categories like those, this project is getting from 2x up to 10x more attention than anything else that they have in the pipeline. EVEN LECTER. I hope Denny sees that.
 
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Re: FINAL SCREAMING SCULPT REVEAL [iminime] Wall Street Killer - Patrick Bateman

Even though I'm not an artist, I do understand that the final product will come out better if an artist has their heart in it. Most people tend to not understand that and think that someone who has the gift can just pull off anything.

What I don't get is the difference between the two expressions. She already has a good handle on Bale's likeness without having her "heart into it" or being a fan personally. Why would she be able to capture his likeness so much more in a sculpt that's smiling as opposed to a sculpt that's angry. How much really changes between the two expressions and where does likeness get lost? I just don't see how you can do one so confidently and not the other.

As far as voting and all of that, from the beginning this was a project done for the people. No one in Iminime is a fan of this movie. If they were fans, they wouldn't have chose the screaming sculpt to begin with; or it would've been more scene accurate and not based off of a promo pic found in google images. They wanted to use their own artistic freedom and that's where that sculpt came from. Denny thought it was going to be a crowd shocker but it wasn't. By not being a fan, there is a disconnect with the character and a lack of understanding in the way Bateman is perceived by fans.

The clear balance to this equation is a more serious sculpt and it should be based solely on the nail gun shot. All other angles should only be used as reference for facial features.

Whoever has a nice sized, clear image of the nail gun expression, please post it (I can't find a good enough one). It's the 4th pic on the bottom row of Axe's collage 2 pages back.

They should mix that look with this longer hair style (longer than the screaming sculpt), or just use this as the runner up pic to base the sculpt from:


5pat-1.jpg

Judging by the posts so far I thought the unwritten rule was if you say anything even 1% negative in this thread you are a heretic :monkey1

But yeah at this point I have learned the scowl is definitely the way to go for this character. It would be a shame to see two smile like sculpts in the end. Part of me ponders if it would be better just buying the headsculpt and raincoat and then bashing the rest. I am probably in the minority, but the perfect Kato quality accuracy of a suit is honestly irrelevant to me. I rather use a spare Hot Toys Friend suit and body, which can be bought (alongside the entire figure) for something like eighty dollars. It's not accurate, but it works for me. Things like the axe and knife and what not are basic stuff too. My point is that part of me wonders how they can expect a huge investment on the fans while also giving the fans a sense of isolation by not respecting/honoring their opinions on the piece.
 
Judging by the posts so far I thought the unwritten rule was if you say anything even 1% negative in this thread you are a heretic :monkey1

You know what's funny.. And this is probably not the place for this discussion.. If you go in the Hot Toys threads you get a ton if people complaining about minutia even with prices that are much lower than customs and here in the custom threads you get collectors willing to pay top dollar for some sculpts that aren't usually perfect.
 
Re: FINAL SCREAMING SCULPT REVEAL [iminime] Wall Street Killer - Patrick Bateman

Judging by the posts so far I thought the unwritten rule was if you say anything even 1% negative in this thread you are a heretic :monkey1

But yeah at this point I have learned the scowl is definitely the way to go for this character. It would be a shame to see two smile like sculpts in the end. Part of me ponders if it would be better just buying the headsculpt and raincoat and then bashing the rest. I am probably in the minority, but the perfect Kato quality accuracy of a suit is honestly irrelevant to me. I rather use a spare Hot Toys Friend suit and body, which can be bought (alongside the entire figure) for something like eighty dollars. It's not accurate, but it works for me. Things like the axe and knife and what not are basic stuff too. My point is that part of me wonders how they can expect a huge investment on the fans while also giving the fans a sense of isolation by not respecting/honoring their opinions on the piece.

There will always be some 'fans' who will feel isolated, and some who feel happy... every project/figure does that. Look at say your choices for example... you dont care about the clothing, which seems essential for some others because its an integral part of the hedonism the character portrays. You are willing to do a kit bash so only head and accessories are fine for you... so you will feel isolated when there is a hit on that direction. Similarly when someone who is picky about the clothing feels the suit isnt accurate enough, he will feel isolated.
But saying they do not respect fans is maybe taking it a little too far and a little maybe say. selfish? I think Iminime do take a lot of fan input. And trust me this sculpt wouldn't be what it is, if they never took input.

There comes a time when some fans set aside some things they would have liked and consider on the positives. I was not a fan of the screaming expression chosen when it was announced, but I am a huge fan of Bateman. The fact a 1/6 figure of him was happening was great enough for me to put aside any other misgivings I had. Because my love for having this character in a decent 1/6 representation overpowered my need to make it accurate to the T. I was willing to overlook some issues which could not be avoided due to feasibility because I wanted to see the larger thing. Which is a high quality Bateman figure.

I already asked CREG to make a smirk sculpt run which he had agreed to later so no matter what Ill be improving on my figure with time adding to it bits and pieces that could not make it with this set.

Fan opinions are always divided, but sometimes an artist has to do what he believes he can do the best. And we all have our own personal preferences.
I think it was a bad move on my part to take/make the vote. When Denny asked me to get the opinion he didnt ask me or anyone to tell him what to do explicitly. He had asked me to find what the consensus was on the 2nd expression. He was very much willing to do what everyone wanted. I gave the results to him... for some unforseen reason the team felt it was not something comfortable for them. They reported that situation here. Unfortunately for them it made some fans inadvertently feel 'disrespected' and 'isolated'.

Therefore since the vote was my idea, and it made people think it meant as a surety of what would happen, I would like to apologise.

But your voices, perseverance and resentment has borne fruit. The sculptor has agreed to do/try the scowl expression.

For the sake of all of us, the fans, here. I sincerely hope she delivers on this one as well as she delivered on the previous one :)
 
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Re: FINAL SCREAMING SCULPT [iminime] Wall Street Killer - Patrick Bateman

I understand what you are saying Axe. Ultimately it is the artist handling the project and their vision is what they are delivering. The fans always have the choice whether or not to go through with it in the end and our opinions, even if they are not always impactful physically, do have an effect on perhaps how the artist sees the fans or considers going about their work.

I also do clearly remember you constantly reminding us about how indefinite things were such as the voting and what not. Therefore it wouldn't have been too much of a surprise to me to see the creators take a different turn in the end.
 
Re: FINAL SCREAMING SCULPT REVEAL [iminime] Wall Street Killer - Patrick Bateman

But your voices, perseverance and resentment has borne fruit. The sculptor has agreed to do/try the scowl expression.

For the sake of all of us, the fans, here. I sincerely hope she delivers on this one as well as she delivered on the previous one :)

:clap:goodpost:
 
Re: FINAL SCREAMING SCULPT [iminime] Wall Street Killer - Patrick Bateman

I also do clearly remember you constantly reminding us about how indefinite things were such as the voting and what not. Therefore it wouldn't have been too much of a surprise to me to see the creators take a different turn in the end.

And this as well. It is fantastic to actually have input, but at the end of the day if the artist wants to go a certain direction then we eventually vote with our wallets.
 
Re: FINAL SCREAMING SCULPT REVEAL [iminime] Wall Street Killer - Patrick Bateman

For the sake of all of us, the fans, here. I sincerely hope she delivers on this one as well as she delivered on the previous one :)


I don't know what you’re so worried about, you're getting your smiley sculpt from CREG anyway. But please, no "I told you so's" if by chance the sculpt doesn't live up to the high expectations. The truth is without seeing the final product of her attempt at a smiling sculpt, we'd have nothing tangible to compare. For all we know her attempt at the smiling expression might not have lived up to the expectations either had it come to life.

The first WIP pics that were posted for the screaming sculpt with lightning speed when this thread first got started. It was like she whipped it up overnight. If she can pull something like this out of her hat that fast, I have faith that she can do a scowling, smiling, laughing, crying, etc. sculpt if she wanted to. I’m really not sure what the source of all these sudden reservations on the scowl sculpt is. But what I do know is there is enough talent in that office to make it happen.

If Hyun Ji Kim feels that she can only tackle a smiling sculpt with confidence and not the scowl (the reasoning is beyond me), than maybe there is someone else in the house that is a better choice for the job. You Hong Ha did a great job with the Rick sculpt. The crinkle in the brow and the smaller eyes are two big factors in achieving the scowl. Maybe he can take on this expression more confidently :dunno
 
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Re: FINAL SCREAMING SCULPT REVEAL [iminime] Wall Street Killer - Patrick Bateman

I don't know what you’re so worried about, you're getting your smiley sculpt from CREG anyway. But please, no "I told you so's" if by chance the sculpt doesn't live up to the high expectations. The truth is without seeing the final product of her attempt at a smiling sculpt, we'd have nothing tangible to compare. For all we know her attempt at the smiling expression might not have lived up to the expectations either had it come to life.

The first WIP pics that were posted for the screaming sculpt with lightning speed when this thread first got started. It was like she whipped it up overnight. If she can pull something like this out of her hat that fast, I have faith that she can do a scowling, smiling, laughing, crying, etc. sculpt if wanted to. I’m really not sure what the source of all these sudden reservations on the scowl sculpt is. But what I do know is there is enough talent in that office to make it happen.

If Hyun Ji Kim feels that she can only tackle a smiling sculpt with confidence and not the scowl (the reasoning is beyond me), than maybe there is someone else in the house that is a better choice for the job. You Hong Ha did a great job with the Rick sculpt. The crinkle in the brow and the smaller eyes are two big factors in achieving the scowl. Maybe he can take on this expression more confidently :dunno
Let me answer all the questions/points you raised one by one...

First I am worried, because unlike others, Its not just about what I want. My main concern is in getting the best 1/6 Bateman figure in all respects within all the given contraints. I wasnt a fan of the screaming expression but that didnt mean I didnt do everything possible to get all critique from the best Bale likeness critics and pass it onto the sculptors who did a phenomenal job to take that in and give us what we have now. So my concern goes beyond 'what I want'. My Concern is on the quality of the whole set.
I am talking everyday, negotiating to add more and more stuff to the set and suggesting and providing Denny with everything possible to make sure every part of this set be it clothing, accessories or for the sculpt be top notch enough to make it the definitive Bateman figure. So even if I didnt vote for scowl, I will be buying it, because its another essential part of Bateman and like all other sculpts I would want to own, I want its likeness to be as good as the best in the market. The bar has been raised and I for one will not be happy with anything lesser than what has been achieved.

And you cannot rob me of the sadistic pleasure of saying "I told you so" if unfortunately the sculpt fails :lol. Because honestly it is fan pressure or should I say demand that is getting the sculpt done. I was on the side of supporting whatever the artist felt was best because in these matters I always believe an artists knows best. When an artist dos what they want and if it doesnt turn out well, atleast the 'blame' (if you want to call it so) can be squarely on him. But in this case it wont be squarely the artist, we too will have to share a big part of it.

The first WIP pictures of the scream which you saw in lighting speed were NOT in lightning speed, sculpting had begun (which I was later told) while the interest list was still filling up as Denny had decided to do the figure (so it was almost half a weeks work I guess). As for the faith you have in her ability, thats ofcourse understandable because of the high quality of work that she has already done.

The reasoning is beyond you why a scuptor is feeling better about some expressions over another, because you cant see the fact that there are specific things that sculptors/artists feel more comfortable or believe in themselves to be better capable of doing. Just like a sportsman can be great, but there always are certain aspects or plays he will not be confident or sure about. These are not math problems like if a=b and b=c then a=c that if a sculptor can do this they can easily do another. These same sculptors have done fantastic jobs as well as not so great ones too (IMO), so the chances of the result swing both ways.

Also I think Denny knows best who is suitable for sculpting what. He must have considered all things before making his reservations about the sculpt public to you all, because remember he was the one who wanted to give you guys what you guys wanted, its not like he totally disregarded the numbers or anything. So I think the suggestion about changing sculptors is pretty much moot.
A sculpt at this quality is more to do than just having the ability to sculpt a deep brow and small eyes and whatever. You want the scowl desperately I can understand that, but the point you raised is silly.
You are not a sculptor, so you wouldnt really know, and neither would most of us who have no experience in executing such art.
Also the fact that she did take the scowl up finally means she will give it her best shot. My only issue is that we will never know what we could have got if we gave her a free reign instead of making her bow to our whims.

Anyway as usual Im 100% behind every part of this project no matter what the choice of expression or sculpt or accessories or clothing, and will continue providing them with whatever assistance they ask of me to help ensure we get the best Bateman that is possible.

images
 
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Re: FINAL SCREAMING SCULPT REVEAL [iminime] Wall Street Killer - Patrick Bateman

...And you cannot rob me of the sadistic pleasure of saying "I told you so" if unfortunately the sculpt fails :lol. Because honestly it is fan pressure or should I say demand that is getting the sculpt done....

...These same sculptors have done fantastic jobs as well as not so great ones too (IMO), so the chances of the result swing both ways....

...the point you raised is silly.... My only issue is that we will never know what we could have got if we gave her a free reign instead of making her bow to our whims.


Ankit, you know your my bud and I'm not trying to argue with you. But I do want to rob you of your sadistic pleasure :lol. No one wanted to hear it in the Skipper thread and no one wants to hear it here. If the tables were turned and the smiley sculpt was approved and then was a bust at reveal, you wouldn't want to hear it either. The difference is if the scowl tanks we're gonna hear it from you and if the tables were turned, you'd be hearing it from 30+ people :lol. Like you said they can sometimes be hit or miss so there is no definite evidence that the smile sculpt "would've been the way to go" God forbid the scowl doesn't wow the crowd. The both have basically the same chances of success or otherwise as far as I'm concerned.

I am not an artist but as I said earlier I do understand that their heart has to be in it in whatever sense for a better final result. I know many people don't get that and are under the impression that if you have the gift it should prove to be consistent in all circumstances and situations. So I do agree with what you’re saying about comfort zones. But that's the exact reason why my point is not "silly". All I'm saying is there is a room full of talent there and if one artist isn't comfortable tackling a certain job, I'm sure there's someone else in that room that is.

Please remember how this project was born to begin with. No one is putting a gun to anyone's head and making people bow to whims or whatever else. It's "fan demand" that got this off of the ground in the first place. And I'm not down playing Iminime's personal choices at all, but the fact is this thread has gotten WAY more attention than any other offering they currently have. They have full reveals of figures that only generated 10-38 pages of talk. This is their busiest thread and it's based off of a single sculpt that most of us appreciate, but not many really wanted. So "fan demand" is good for business. Just sayin' :cool:

At the end of the day let's stay positive that the scowl will be a grand slam, and that CREG's smirk will follow suit (which I will be in for as well). The more top quality options the better and we'll all walk with the definitive Bateman which will go down in the books if all is done correctly.
 
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Re: FINAL SCREAMING SCULPT [iminime] Wall Street Killer - Patrick Bateman

This thread wins the prize for greatest number of text walls. :horror
 
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Re: FINAL SCREAMING SCULPT [iminime] Wall Street Killer - Patrick Bateman

Just a few very vocal die hard fans here who's passion for the project is amping their need to vent BIGTIME.

Excuse us if the convo is irking anyone :wave
 
Re: FINAL SCREAMING SCULPT [iminime] Wall Street Killer - Patrick Bateman

Just a few very vocal die hard fans here who's passion for the project is amping their need to vent BIGTIME.

Excuse us if the convo is irking anyone :wave

So long as you don't break into a wall-o-text review of a genesis album or something...
 
Re: FINAL SCREAMING SCULPT [iminime] Wall Street Killer - Patrick Bateman

Just a few very vocal die hard fans here who's passion for the project is amping their need to vent BIGTIME.

Excuse us if the convo is irking anyone :wave

There's a common denominator in all these Iminime thread blowups :monkey1 (Hint: not you)

Huge turn off
 
Re: FINAL SCREAMING SCULPT [iminime] Wall Street Killer - Patrick Bateman

So long as you don't break into a wall-o-text review of a genesis album or something...

F__K!!! I was gonna do that after I got that fig in hand. So I should lay off is what your saying? :wink1:
 
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