Sarah Palin hung in effigy in West Hollywood

[IrishJedi]

Oh come off of it. This country has gotten to be waaaaay too far to the right over the last sixty years or so, which is why the economy is blowing up right now just like it did in the late 1920s and mid 1850s. We're long overdue for a correction away from unchecked laissez-faire market economics and excessive deregulation, which simply are unsustainable. check your history books.

Obama is not going to turn the U.S. into another Sweden even if he wanted to, which he does not.

We have an extreme right-wing party and a centrist party ascendant here when we need a center-right and a center-left to have a productive governmental dialogue.

I agree with a lot of what you said, except for your assertion that Obama is at all Centrist/Moderate. He's as far-Left as any candidate has been our lifetime.

 

[RoboDad]

Socialists say Obama is no socialist:

https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-obama-chicago-socialist,0,4048540.story

I am already calling it that someone will reply with this:

"That's what they want to say because they want him to get in! They are lying!"

or

"A Chicago newspaper? HA! BIASED!"

No, I'm not going to say either of those things. I'll let Obama's words speak for themselves: "I think when you spread the wealth around it's good for everybody". Government "spreading the wealth around" is synonymous with wealth redistribution. Now, from wikipedia: "All socialists advocate the creation of an egalitarian society, in which wealth and power are distributed more evenly."

So, does it really matter what other socialists say, when the man has, in his own words, espoused the philosophy?

 

[LChinoz]

Of course an extreme socialist isn't going to call Obama socialist. Nevertheless, his ideas are socialist. Wealth redistribution, more entitlement programs, socialized medicine, etc.....

I like the way you think

Obama's health care plan is far from socialist. You want socliast, see Hillary's. Obama's plan is to lower premiums on health care, and has NO mandate on coverage for adults (he does mandate children to be covered).

About wealth redistribution, Obama has always stated form the beginning he wants to give tax breaks to those strugging, which are the middle class. I mean, in the last eight years our middle class has almost completely disappeared...leaving us with only poor and wealthy. Obama wanting to help strugging families does not make him a socialist. He is just parroting the Democratic talking points Clinton also had, to help middle class families instead of rich corportations.

And I am not sure what entitlement programs you may be referring to. Obama does have a plan to give a $5000 tuition credit for college students who do community service. While community service for college students is mandated in many foreign countries, Obama is not making it a requirement. He is only using it as an incentive so students start becoming involved in the goings on of their neighborhoods and the country as a whole.

 

[El Roranous]

No, I'm not going to say either of those things. I'll let Obama's words speak for themselves: "I think when you spread the wealth around it's good for everybody". Government "spreading the wealth around" is synonymous with wealth redistribution. Now, from wikipedia: "All socialists advocate the creation of an egalitarian society, in which wealth and power are distributed more evenly."

So, does it really matter what other socialists say, when the man has, in his own words, espoused the philosophy?

You are using wikipedia as a source.... oh brother.

 

[LChinoz]

No, I'm not going to say either of those things. I'll let Obama's words speak for themselves: "I think when you spread the wealth around it's good for everybody". Government "spreading the wealth around" is synonymous with wealth redistribution. Now, from wikipedia: "All socialists advocate the creation of an egalitarian society, in which wealth and power are distributed more evenly."

So, does it really matter what other socialists say, when the man has, in his own words, espoused the philosophy?

Well, the term "spread the wealth around" does sound socialist, too bad his plans mimic those of past Democrats. He is not pushing socialism, he simply is calling his tax breaks for the middle class "spreading the wealth." Not the best choice of words, but his plans speak for themselves.

 

[El Roranous]

Who cares what he said- he is a politician... which means his words mean nothing in the long run.


He is also incredibly wealthy himself and the other dinosaur running is even wealthier. They don't care who has money as long as they get to keep theirs.

 

[RoboDad]

You are using wikipedia as a source.... oh brother.

Yeah, I know. I'm so ashamed.

But I did limit it to one sentence, because that one sentence happened to be correct (a rarity for wikipedia, to be sure) .

 

[DarthNeil]

Sigh...

Play nice.

 

[El Roranous]

Yeah, I know. I'm so ashamed.

But I did limit it to one sentence, because that one sentence happened to be correct (a rarity for wikipedia, to be sure) .

I just remember trying to get away with that in one of my English courses and I nearly got beheaded by my professor. To his credit, Wikipedia now strikes fear into my heart.

 

[RoboDad]

Well, the term "spread the wealth around" does sound socialist, too bad his plans mimic those of past Democrats. He is not pushing socialism, he simply is calling his tax breaks for the middle class "spreading the wealth." Not the best choice of words, but his plans speak for themselves.

How do tax credits for people who already pay no taxes fit your narrow definition? By my definition, it is wealth redistribution. It is socialism.

 

[drbrad1975]

Oh come off of it. This country has gotten to be waaaaay too far to the right over the last sixty years or so, which is why the economy is blowing up right now just like it did in the late 1920s and mid 1850s. We're long overdue for a correction away from unchecked laissez-faire market economics and excessive deregulation, which simply are unsustainable. Check your history books.

Obama is not going to turn the U.S. into another Sweden even if he wanted to, which he does not.

We have an extreme right-wing party and a centrist party ascendant here when we need a center-right and a center-left to have a productive governmental dialogue.

You think we have become more right over the years and Obama is a centrist? Oh boy.....How is this so?

 

[metaphorge]

I agree with a lot of what you said, except for your assertion that Obama is at all Centrist/Moderate. He's as far-Left as any candidate has been our lifetime.

You're correct, but that isn't saying very much relative to, say, FDR or to the politics of other industrialized democratic republics. Obama only seems extreme because our political spectrum has gotten so far rightward.

I'd personally prefer things if the Socialists and the Libertarians were the two premiere parties and duked it out over economic policy....

You think we have become more right over the years and Obama is a centrist? Oh boy.....How is this so?

Compare the Nixon adminstration with Reagan and Dubya and compare Clinton to Kennedy and Johnson and then get back to me.

 

[drbrad1975]

You're correct, but that isn't saying very much relative to, say, FDR or to the politics of other industrialized democratic republics. Obama only seems extreme because our political spectrum has gotten so far rightward.

I'd personally prefer things if the Socialists and the Libertarians were the two premiere parties and duked it out over economic policy....



Compare the Nixon adminstration with Reagan and Dubya and compare Clinton to Kennedy and Johnson and then get back to me.

https://blog.kiplinger.com/politics/2008/03/barack-obama-hes-no-john-f-ken.html

 

[LChinoz]

How do tax credits for people who already pay no taxes fit your narrow definition? By my definition, it is wealth redistribution. It is socialism.

I do not have a narrow definition. The Democrats have always been about giving relief to the middle class. Some who do not pay taxes may get credits, and hopefully Obama addresses this, but the assertion that tax credits for non-tax payers somehow describes Obama's plan is itself narrow. There is some good info on his tax plan here:

https://www.economist.com/world/unitedstates/displaystory.cfm?STORY_ID=12342127

 

[Kibishii]

I don't care if it Palin, Obama, the Pope, or Bush...that is sick and anyone who does that has issues.

 

[drbrad1975]

I do not have a narrow definition. The Decomocrats have always been about giving relief to the middle class. Some who do not pay taxes may get credits, and hopefully Obama addresses this, but the assertion that tax credits for non-tax payers somehow describes Obama's plan is itself narrow. There is some good info on his tax plan here:

https://www.economist.com/world/unitedstates/displaystory.cfm?STORY_ID=12342127

Where does I don't like either one of their plans fit in? They both suck in my opinion, and McCain's idea of buying back bad mortgage loans is just a bid to buy some votes. Why can't we have a legitimate 3 party system for those of us that don't fit the mold on either side?

 

[metaphorge]

https://blog.kiplinger.com/politics/2008/03/barack-obama-hes-no-john-f-ken.html

And what does that have to do with comparing the policies of Bill Clinton to JFK and LBJ, or comparing Nixon to Bush or Reagan? We're talking about rightward drift of the U.S., why you want to change the subject?

 

[metaphorge]

Why can't we have a legitimate 3 party system for those of us that don't fit the mold on either side?

Because we have a single-winner voting system, which always tend to produce two-party systems. I agree that this sucks.

 

[LChinoz]

Where does I don't like either one of their plans fit in? They both suck in my opinion, and McCain's idea of buying back bad mortgage loans is just a bid to buy some votes. Why can't we have a legitimate 3 party system for those of us that don't fit the mold on either side?

Barr or Nader dude...take your pick.

 

[pixletwin]

What about Ron Paul?