SPECTRE - Bond 24
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slackerboy
Super Freak
That's the thing about Bond, even the bad entries in the series are celebrated.
The series has reached a level of acceptance that we embrace the bad along with the good.
We do this when we buy the box set.
I mean, who doesn't want to own the entire box set, no one!
Not even Star Wars has acheived that level, no one wants to own the PT!
But View to a Kill, DAD and Octopussy, hell yeah they're sitting on my shelf in my glorious box set!
This might be better served in another thread, but I've seen quite a few shots taken at Octopussy. I know folks don't like that Bond disguises himself as a clown, but he WAS at the circus! Not like he picked up the outfit from Q branch. It's a nice visual call back to 009 at the beginning of the movie. My problem with the scene is that it's set against a ticking clock and he goes into the trailer and comes out like 30 seconds later (bomb time) in full disguise, complete with professional makeup! Having dressed as the Joker for Halloween (not nearly that well) I can attest that it would take WAY longer to look that good. 30 seconds is Mrs. Doubtfire-smack-your-face-in-the-makeup-tub and run out of the trailer.
I think the movie's a lot of fun, lots of high adventure spots (first Bond produced after Raiders of the Lost Ark), humor, a great stunt on the plane at the end. If it had been Roger Moore's last, it would've been a really high spot to leave. Alas, there's a View to A Kill. No WAY are they on the same level though.
Could be nostalgia since it was HBO a lot at my babysitter's house when I was a kid, but it's one of my favorites. Just my pair o' pennies.
CallMeTheDoctor
Super Freak
Do it -- I did it myself and I have to say Craig takes it over for Connery in my books. And seeing QoS again, I still don't see the need for crucifying the film. It's a great movie IMO.
Irvy
Super Freak
QoS has some redeeming stuff if badly edited at times. He's a bit unhinged and full of rage in that flick.
The opening Aston chase beats the lame Spectre one and the stuff with Mathis is gold.
The opening Aston chase beats the lame Spectre one and the stuff with Mathis is gold.
GodzillaSpawn
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That car chase was pretty cool. But I hated the "villain" (he reminds me of the guy who owns the comic book Shop in Big Bang Theory) and that he even put of a second of a fight against Bond. The cinematography wasn't like the past two films which I think are a big part of the love I have for these films.
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spindrift
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Spectre is terrific and may i say the most BONDian of all Craig's film(that is a good thing). It looks incredible and Craig is sooo cool and has the best vibe he ever has had as Bond.
The US critics are just jokes,they have piled on this movie- like it was revenge for Craig being short in interviews with their buds in the "media".
The US critics are just jokes,they have piled on this movie- like it was revenge for Craig being short in interviews with their buds in the "media".
CallMeTheDoctor
Super Freak
I read an interview as to the use of Greene. And quite honestly it made it more enjoyable. The purpose of Greene is that there is nothing, absolutely NOTHING intimidating about him. No muscle, no scars, no sinister voice; he's just a *****.
But when he goes against Bond, he's unpredictable, he's a guy that has not fought someone toe to toe. He always has his lackeys kill. Not out of manipulation like Blofeld, or with strength like a hemchman; but he actually pays people to do his own ****.
He's a guy that is terrified of anything against him. He uses threats barked behind his organization, not from him. And when you really break it down, he's actually the only villain to put up a fight with. Chiffre trapped him, Silva had an army but didn't fight him at the end. And Waltz was a trap. Even M had a longer fight than Craig in CR, SF, or Spectre.
To me, I think he was a good villain. He is someone that is scary, because you learn that almost anyone could be in that position.
Yup, even his bad movies provide some comfort, like a blanket that's a few days overdue its wash day, stinky yet still comfortable.
You know, like Godzilla.
There are some things that can't comfort you no matter how hard you try.
Godzilla has Godzilla vs Megalon... Bond has Die Another Day.
This might be better served in another thread, but I've seen quite a few shots taken at Octopussy. I know folks don't like that Bond disguises himself as a clown, but he WAS at the circus! Not like he picked up the outfit from Q branch. It's a nice visual call back to 009 at the beginning of the movie. My problem with the scene is that it's set against a ticking clock and he goes into the trailer and comes out like 30 seconds later (bomb time) in full disguise, complete with professional makeup! Having dressed as the Joker for Halloween (not nearly that well) I can attest that it would take WAY longer to look that good. 30 seconds is Mrs. Doubtfire-smack-your-face-in-the-makeup-tub and run out of the trailer.
I think the movie's a lot of fun, lots of high adventure spots (first Bond produced after Raiders of the Lost Ark), humor, a great stunt on the plane at the end. If it had been Roger Moore's last, it would've been a really high spot to leave. Alas, there's a View to A Kill. No WAY are they on the same level though.
Could be nostalgia since it was HBO a lot at my babysitter's house when I was a kid, but it's one of my favorites. Just my pair o' pennies.
Octopussy has moments I like. But it has some of the goofier humor. In all honesty I hardly remember the film. I remember Moore was getting to old for the role. I enjoyed it at one point when I was older but tried watching it again and I struggled to find entertainment value in it.
I agree 100% It was nice to have Craig in a Bond film that was a bit lighter and more fun.
GodzillaSpawn
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I really enjoyed seeing Bond in his prime in this. In CR he was a bit raw and in Quantum he was a little sloppy by rage. Skyfall had him trying to work back from bad injuries or age against a spy that knew all his secrets. This time he's ahead of the curve for most of the film. Even when he seems trapped or caught he's got a plan the entire time.
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slackerboy
Super Freak
Sadly, he was too old, which makes View To A Kill all the worse. That movie was just so dull after the first 30 minutes.
Poor Die Another Day, AKA Pierce Brosnan's Moonraker. Was stunned in the theater at just how awful that one was. I enjoy Moonraker so much more, even though it's just as outlandish. Probably because it's the first Bond I saw, when I was 4...though I can just barely remember images from the movie at that time. The part where the dogs chased the woman down in the woods stuck with me though. I never forgot that part.
Moonraker was my first Bond film also. I still find enjoyment out of that one. JAWS being in it helped even though he was turned into the Coyote to Bond's Roadrunner in that one. Die Another Day actually starts out good. I think I enjoy it up until he gets to the ice castle... But man does it go south after that.... AWFUL!!!!
It's funny. Aside from the dodgy CGI and dreadful acting all the way around (which, granted, is a big "aside") I actually liked Die Another Day's story. The fact that the villain was the same man with a different face was a pretty cool idea to me. The only thing that was really ugh was the cloaking car. That was a bit much.
slackerboy
Super Freak
Die Another Day actually starts out good. I think I enjoy it up until he gets to the ice castle... But man does it go south after that.... AWFUL!!!!
Yeah, I think DAD was the first Bond I saw that had really noticeable BAD CGI. It was every bit as wacky as Moonraker in spots, but Moonraker had style, and practical effects. You'd think it has everything going for it, an experienced Bond director, an experienced Bond, John Barry, great locations, gorgeous women, awesome villain (Jaws, not Drax). It's clownshoes as a Bond movie, but I'd watch it over Die Another Die every day of the week and twice on Sunday.
slackerboy
Super Freak
I saw in the behind the scenes stuff that they took the idea from the book of Moonraker, the bad guy hiding in plain sight. Ironical considering how the two movies are usually mentioned with each other.
I think what also killed it for me was using CGI in place of stunts. When Halle Berry swan dives off the cliff, it's all CG. In the old days, they would've found a cliff diver to actually do the stunt and it would've been pretty impressive.
I saw in the behind the scenes stuff that they took the idea from the book of Moonraker, the bad guy hiding in plain sight. Ironical considering how the two movies are usually mentioned with each other.
I think what also killed it for me was using CGI in place of stunts. When Halle Berry swan dives off the cliff, it's all CG. In the old days, they would've found a cliff diver to actually do the stunt and it would've been pretty impressive.
I think the CG issue was across the board in the late 90's/Early 2000s. It was as if no one wanted to do any practical effects anymore, even though the CG looked way worse back then. I understand that sometimes the CG was more cost-effective, but at the expense of looking decent, it's not worth it. I'm glad there have been a bunch of pioneering directors (sad that they have to be pioneering to do this) who said "Look, we'll use CG where it makes sense, and practical when we can." That's the status quo now, and I think it forces CG companies to up their game, because they're competing with practical effects, when back then they really didn't have to.
Not excusing it per se, just saying it went way beyond Bond. It's funny how Bond is always a relic of it's time period in so many ways...even when it comes to movie-making techniques.
Mad Old Lu
Super Freak
I read an interview as to the use of Greene. And quite honestly it made it more enjoyable. The purpose of Greene is that there is nothing, absolutely NOTHING intimidating about him. No muscle, no scars, no sinister voice; he's just a *****.
But when he goes against Bond, he's unpredictable, he's a guy that has not fought someone toe to toe. He always has his lackeys kill. Not out of manipulation like Blofeld, or with strength like a hemchman; but he actually pays people to do his own ****.
He's a guy that is terrified of anything against him. He uses threats barked behind his organization, not from him. And when you really break it down, he's actually the only villain to put up a fight with. Chiffre trapped him, Silva had an army but didn't fight him at the end. And Waltz was a trap. Even M had a longer fight than Craig in CR, SF, or Spectre.
To me, I think he was a good villain. He is someone that is scary, because you learn that almost anyone could be in that position.
I agree I think Greene is a fine villain. I actually think he is the most realistic. He’s just a rich, slimy, head of industry business man. And generally they are just big pussies, hiring people to do his dirty work. And yes, when backed into a corner he is unpredictable and becomes unhinged. He thinks he’s hot sh because of all his money and power, but he’s just a sniveling weakling.
Moonraker was also my first Bond! I have a real soft spot for it because of that. And yes, Die Another Day was abyssmally bad. So embarrassing for poor Brosnan—who I really liked as Bond. You can see that he and Martin Campbell in GoldenEye were trying to steer the Bond movies towards the Casino Royale style even back then.
I've never thought Green was necessarily the problem with QoS. It's that the rest of the film is so forgettable. No matter how many times I see it, there isn't anything that really sticks with me. I recall thinking the outdoor opera was gorgeous, and hated how underutilized the beautiful Gemma was only to die covered in oil, and that the end happened in the desert. That's really all I got.
Though, there are quite a few really forgettable Bond films...so it's not the only one, it's just the most recent one. For Your Eyes Only and The Living Daylights, for example. A great villian can escalate an otherwise forgettable film, though...so maybe Green would've been better utilized in a different film.
Though, there are quite a few really forgettable Bond films...so it's not the only one, it's just the most recent one. For Your Eyes Only and The Living Daylights, for example. A great villian can escalate an otherwise forgettable film, though...so maybe Green would've been better utilized in a different film.
GodzillaSpawn
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I guess having a colorful villain goes hand in hand with Bond films for me. And he was just so tame and forgettable imo. And even being unpredictable and wild I can't take it seriously that Bond, an elite superspy who can take on multiple thugs and gunmen at once even with his hands tied and a bag on his head, would have any challenge taking Greene down in an instant. I'm sure he's been trained to deal with wild angry men throwing a fit.
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jye4ever
Broke and happy
QOS is the TDKR to CR's TDK, even though SF is the real TDK.
TheGDBatman
Super Freak
QOS is the TDKR to CR's TDK, even though SF is the real TDK.
I would say Spectre is the TDKR to Skyfalls TDK with Royale and Quantum both as Begins.
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