Star Wars On Blu-Ray

[karamazov80]

I always thought that Gollum from LOTR was far more convincing than Jar Jar, and both were released about the same time.

I think Davy Jones in DMC may be the crowning achievement of CGI so far. When I first saw that movie I simply couldn't tell. I knew that at least some of his tentacles were digital but was shocked to find out he was CG from head to toe.

Somehow in AWE I thought they took a slight step back and he seemed more cartoony in parts.

Both of those were pretty good CG. Gollum probably is one of the best I've seen. But it's all still too inconsistent and ultimately unbelievable for my tastes. Guy in suit still wins!

 

[Khev]

Wasn't Davy Jones a guy in a motion capture blue suit?

Well yes but that's not what you see on screen.

He's motion captured but completely digital.

 

[Yodacappy]

So I finally picked this set up. Haven't started watching it yet but I'll fit it in between Skyrim sessions...

 

[Darthrazz]

Well yes but that's not what you see on screen.

He's motion captured but completely digital.

He did look damn good though! I remember seeing an interview with the guy who played him. He said he was pissed because the other actors were dressed as pirates and he was in a blue suit with balls on it!

 

[Too Much Garlic]

You're talking about story rather than technicality. Visually, the CG is better, in most cases (although it's still easier to make environments with miniatures).

And again with Terminator, I'm just comparing something like the CG Terminator Endoskeleton to the stop motion Endoskeleton. Of course T1 and T2 are better than T3, but that's due to the story rather than the FX quality.

Honestly, I see nothing stellar about the CG work in T3. It looked phony.

There are other movies where the CG work looks very realistic, but again, the illusion is oftentimes hampered by crappy "acting" of the CG character due to the animator being a crappy "actor" if you know what I mean. It's like they do the fake prolonged theater stage death with swirls and arm movements and hamming things up instead of just losing all sense of connection with any and all of your body parts and just collapse to the ground. Monsters have to stumble forward and swirl around (troll in Harry Potter 1, big snake in Harry Potter 2 and many other CG creatures). They can't just DIE...

The reason Davy Jones worked in Pirates and why Gullom worked in Lord of the Ring was due to ONE single fact - there was an actor dictating the movements and the character. Jar Jar also had an actor on set, but it is very unlikely much of his movements were used at all, when the digital creation was put in his place + the character sucked, because he never felt natural or plausible. I would take a puppet Yoda from the OT over digital Yoda from the prequels... also because the artists designing him in the prequels absolutely had no bleading concept about how Yoda actually looked and moved, but just made a crappy version copy - hell, they could have made a cast from the actual mold in the archives and scanned that and made him younger, but no... they had to have a digital sculptor do the work and he failed to capture the likeness... and because Frank Oz didn't control the movements... it just didn't feel as Yoda.

I'll take real people in armor over cgi troopers that walk in line formations into battle and every single trooper in every single line - front to back - is firing wildly at nothing - instead of taking cover and fighting like any normal person would when facing laser weapons - you don't just walk straight into the line of fire. That's just unbelievably retarded.

And no consequences befall a mass murdering Jedi, neither from the hands of the Jedi, any authority in the galaxy or Amidala... well... what kind of a signal is that to send to anyone. Hey... it doesn't matter if you kill men, women and children if you get pissed off... it's all cool. WOW.

They took so many wrong turns with the PT... and Lucas with his unwavering need to make the OT more like the PT... that I don't care for the movies anymore. Every other director and studio gives us the theatrical versions and the special editions and the director's cuts, cleaned up, restored and made pretty for DVD and Blu-Ray: Steven Spielberg, Ridley Scott, James Cameron... but not Lucas.

 

[Too Much Garlic]

WOW... that came out sounding... rather... angry. Hmm... guess I DO care!

Just not about the Special Editions and PT.

 

[Khev]

And no consequences befall a mass murdering Jedi, neither from the hands of the Jedi, any authority in the galaxy or Amidala... well... what kind of a signal is that to send to anyone. Hey... it doesn't matter if you kill men, women and children if you get pissed off... it's all cool. WOW.

You don't think Anakin suffered any consequences for his actions?

 

[Too Much Garlic]

You don't think Anakin suffered any consequences for his actions?

Name one.

Was he expelled from the Jedi Order?
Was he tried at court?
Was he sentenced?
Did he lose Amidala?

All he did was get to kill more and end up ruling the galaxy with his good buddy Emperor Palpatine.

 

[Khev]

Name one.

Obi-Wan being ordered to execute him, for starters.

 

[darthviper107]

You do realize that the animators that work on stop motion and in CG are pretty much the same thing right? Just because they're working with something physical doesn't mean that they're any better. And just technically, a CG animation done by hand would have a much better chance of being better, since they can directly compare to real-world animation and easily go back and fix problems.

Of course it helps immensely to have an actor to base the animation on, that's what motion capture is for. But they've been using motion capture since Episode 1, even with Jar Jar. The issue with Jar Jar I think is that they also added sort of cartoon like animations which made him ridiculous.

With Yoda, they did just fine, the AOTC version is a bit cartoonish but afterwards they were able to improve with things like SSS which made him look more realistic. He might not have looked like the puppet, but the puppet wasn't that realistic either. If you had never seen the puppet before and they used that today, it would look ridiculous.

As for the troopers, I agree that they should have been real people, but it's not like they couldn't have made them react more realistically, it's not like the real Stormtroopers in the OT were all that realistic in their reactions either.

 

[Too Much Garlic]

Obi-Wan being ordered to execute him, for starters.

When was that? In the third one? I take it it was AFTER he killed the younglings? AFTER Yoda failed miserably to stop someone that a barely trained Jedi took on and won over 3 movies later?

The mass murders happened in the second movie. Not one single consequence then. So, only when he kills other Jedi do any kind of consequences be ordered from the Jedi. WOW... what compassion towards others.

 

[Khev]

You're talking about the Tusken Raiders? I'm pretty sure the idea is that Anakin didn't go blabbing about that to the Jedi Council. As far as Amidala is concerned, yeah that's pretty silly that she wasn't turned off by that. Of course coming from Naboo its possible she didn't know what they were. All she heard from Cliegg was that they were vicious monsters or something like that.

 

[pixletwin]

When was that? In the third one? I take it it was AFTER he killed the younglings? AFTER Yoda failed miserably to stop someone that a barely trained Jedi took on and won over 3 movies later?

The mass murders happened in the second movie. Not one single consequence then. So, only when he kills other Jedi do any kind of consequences be ordered from the Jedi. WOW... what compassion towards others.

Ummmmmm..... pretty obvious that Palpatine and Padme were the only ones who knew about that.

 

[Too Much Garlic]

You do realize that the animators that work on stop motion and in CG are pretty much the same thing right?

Like different cartoonists. They both draw the image, but that doesn't mean cartoonist B is as good as cartoonist A. Just seems there's an awful lot of B cartoonists doing this CGI stuff. Where did all the A's go?

The dinosaurs in JP1 work for the single fact that Phil Tippet supervised their actions and movements. In the following movies he wasn't there to punch the animators to make them look and act like animals, which is why they act more like standard movie monsters.

Send the animators to acting school so they know the do's and don'ts of character movement and actions.

 

[Too Much Garlic]

Ummmmmm..... pretty obvious that Palpatine and Padme were the only ones who knew about that.

Yes, 'cause obviously the Jedi couldn't see what others were doing. OH WAIT... Yoda could with Luke, so sorry... you lose.

 

[Khev]

Yes, 'cause obviously the Jedi couldn't see what others were doing. OH WAIT... Yoda could with Luke, so sorry... you lose.

The prequels were quite clear that the Dark Side was clouding the Jedis' vision. Enough so that they even contemplated making an announcement about it in the Senate.

 

[sithlord13]

But yeah it never rang true that goodie goodie padme would be like oh cool you wiped out the scum.

But Lucas did fumble it. Too many
Consessions to the idea that kids wouldn't handle it.
No vast clone armies battling each
Other at great detriment to the galaxy. No subtle slide towards the dark side for anakin.

I too find myself increasing losing interest in the pt

 

[pixletwin]

Yes, 'cause obviously the Jedi couldn't see what others were doing. OH WAIT... Yoda could with Luke, so sorry... you lose.

uh huh.

Yoda sensed that Anakin was in "pain". That is all.... something which was also pretty obviously spelled out in the movies. So I am afraid you did win, but not what you thought you had won...

 

[Too Much Garlic]

You're talking about the Tusken Raiders? I'm pretty sure the idea is that Anakin didn't go blabbing about that to the Jedi Council. As far as Amidala is concerned, yeah that's pretty silly that she wasn't turned off by that. Of course coming from Naboo its possible she didn't know what they were. All she heard from Cliegg was that they were vicious monsters or something like that.

Also when they sneak into that Geonosian bedchamber and startle those sleeping in the walls. First thing Anakin does when they jump out to apprehend him for trespassing was to chop several in half, before even one of them pulled a weapon on him. Several were just trying to get away from the invaders.

Sure, Obi-Wan had been captured on that planet... but he was a trespasser too. Guess you just go in guns blazing whenever you friends get arrested for being where he's not allowed. There's certainly no diplomacy with these Jedi. They tried that for like what... 5 minutes in the first movie... all since then... lightsaber first, shoot before asking questions.

 

[Too Much Garlic]

uh huh.

Yoda sensed that Anakin was in "pain". That is all.... something which was also pretty obviously spelled out in the movies. So I am afraid you did win, but not what you thought you had won...

Did you watch ep5 at all? Yoda had apparently had a little less grape juice + in that movie as he could see pretty clearly what Luke was doing and what he was thinking.

So... sure... Anakin was a Jedi... and Luke was not at that point. But if he was blocking Yoda... then he must have asked himself that fundamental question... WOW... what is that kid hiding of evil doings. Man the Jedi are ******* in the PT.