Star Wars Saga (OT/PT/ST) Discussion Thread

[Khev]

Yes but imagine if you thought you had sex with someone and found out it was just a projection. Be pretty lame. Last jedi Luke projection is like that.

It depends on the projection, lol.

 

[DiFabio]

The irony of it all is that TLJ real Hamill Luke Skywalker is denounced as fake Jake Skywalker apparition but the stunt man cgi Luke in Mando is deemed the real Luke Skywalker.

Weird how some things turn out sometimes lol

I just watched the clip.

Luke’s face was horrendous. How come amateurs can make convincing deep fakes of everyone FOR FREE on YouTube, but paid SFX artists can’t achieve the same for big budget show?

Same deal with the Irishman. Young DeNiro looked horrible, yet people on YouTube made deep fakes that actually looked like a youthful Deniro. I just don’t get it. Why not just commission those guys for whatever movie or tv show project you’re working on?

 

[ZE_501]

I just watched the clip.

Luke’s face was horrendous. How come amateurs can make convincing deep fakes of everyone FOR FREE on YouTube, but paid SFX artists can’t achieve the same for big budget show?

Same deal with the Irishman. Young DeNiro looked horrible, yet people on YouTube made deep fakes that actually looked like a youthful Deniro. I just don’t get it. Why not just commission those guys for whatever movie or tv show project you’re working on?

Civil War young RDJ looked good, so I don't think it's a lack of talent, seems to be something else. Time, money, contractual stuff, who knows.

 

[JAWS]

It depends on the projection, lol.

You're a good Joe

 

[JAWS]

I really hope you realize that OT fans are the ones saying this right? Like you do know that the majority of OT fans hate what they did to Luke . Like yes you have Pt fans saying it was dumb but the vast majority of people hating are people who grew up with the OT.

You guys are in a very very very very verrrrrrry small minority when it comes to OT fans who enjoy the ST. And there is only like 4 or 5 of you tops in this room. Only you and jye keep the the ST convo going for hrs. The rest are either meh or hate it

PT fans don?t have a strong attachment to Luke. It was OT fans who were displeased with Luke and how he was treated.

You really think everyone that was happy about Luke coming back in mando only grew up with the PT ?

Sit down

Not arguing here just asking with regards to the OT old men being the ones that hated TLJ Luke..

Are they though?

I can only go by Youtube and it seems that most of the videos that hate on TLJ are much younger then I am.. 20s and 30s

Even on here the ones that seem most frustrated by Luke seem to be a bit younger.. The OT generation here on this board either are fine with it.. or they dont seem to get as upset they just choose to ignore it.

IDK...

 

[ajp4mgs]

Yes! Do it, it's so good!!

HF even helped me to appreciate TPM a little more since the princess who was an obvious inspiration for both Leia and Padme spends most of the film in disguise even using (and then weeping over) body doubles to trick those who are pursuing her.

Of course TPM/AOTC did it much *worse* (lol) but it's still a fun parallel nonetheless.

And so I did. It might be just a psychosomatic type of thing, but this time I even heard musical notes with a total vibe of JW's Jawa pieces when Tahei and Matashichi are doing their R2 & 3PO thing.

Overall, the TPM parallels stood out to me more than the ANH ones, even in addition to the Padme/Yuki comparison that you noted. Tahei and Matashichi are the conceptual model for R2 and 3PO as "narrators" in ANH, but I think their actual plot role with Makabe is more similar to Jar Jar with Qui-Gon in TPM. Bumbling and careless, but still resourceful enough to be useful companion "guides."

The Gungans marching out of the mist in TPM has been associated with Throne of Blood, but there's also a similar visual in Hidden Fortress that immediately had me thinking of that Gungan scene and how it was used in the TPM trailer. Lots of the hillside scenery also obviously served as a likely template for shots in the Naboo battle.

Some of the parallels to ANH are ones that I consider just as likely to be coincidence as anything else. For example, the Padme comparison with Yuki seems way more justified than a Leia comparison. And like I said, the Makabe character plays more to me as TPM Qui-Gon than ANH Kenobi.

I still put The Hidden Fortress a tier or two below Seven Samurai and Yojimbo, but the SW connections will always make it a fun Kurosawa watch. Good stuff either way, but probably more enjoyable for me just for the novelty of noting the inspirations for SW.

 

[ironwez20]

Not arguing here just asking with regards to the OT old men being the ones that hated TLJ Luke..

Are they though?

I can only go by Youtube and it seems that most of the videos that hate on TLJ are much younger then I am.. 20s and 30s

Even on here, the ones that seem most frustrated by Luke seem to be a bit younger.. The OT generation here on this board either are fine with it.. or they dont seem to get as upset they just choose to ignore it.

IDK...

Lets be honest here. The OT gen don't like making vids or technology all too much. Also, most people who make those vids are in there 20, 30s and 40s which means some lived during the 80s and 90s and hell maybe even the end of the 70s when the PT wasn't a thing yet and the OT was very prominent and the only star wars media they had. Especially 80s and 70s kids. So they fall into the OT category too. 90s and 00s kids, not so much.

Regarding this place. This is just a small little bubble, like I keep telling you guys. Khev and Jye don't make up the majority of opnion. Go onto various TLJ vids or reddit forums and you'll see many old school fans' distaste for Luke.

 

[Khev]

And so I did. It might be just a psychosomatic type of thing, but this time I even heard musical notes with a total vibe of JW's Jawa pieces when Tahei and Matashichi are doing their R2 & 3PO thing.

Overall, the TPM parallels stood out to me more than the ANH ones, even in addition to the Padme/Yuki comparison that you noted. Tahei and Matashichi are the conceptual model for R2 and 3PO as "narrators" in ANH, but I think their actual plot role with Makabe is more similar to Jar Jar with Qui-Gon in TPM. Bumbling and careless, but still resourceful enough to be useful companion "guides."

The Gungans marching out of the mist in TPM has been associated with Throne of Blood, but there's also a similar visual in Hidden Fortress that immediately had me thinking of that Gungan scene and how it was used in the TPM trailer. Lots of the hillside scenery also obviously served as a likely template for shots in the Naboo battle.

Some of the parallels to ANH are ones that I consider just as likely to be coincidence as anything else. For example, the Padme comparison with Yuki seems way more justified than a Leia comparison. And like I said, the Makabe character plays more to me as TPM Qui-Gon than ANH Kenobi.

I still put The Hidden Fortress a tier or two below Seven Samurai and Yojimbo, but the SW connections will always make it a fun Kurosawa watch. Good stuff either way, but probably more enjoyable for me just for the novelty of noting the inspirations for SW.

Yes, I totally agree on much of HF seemingly aligning more with TPM than ANH but didn't want to get into too many details on the off chance you hadn't actually seen HF before. I totally agree on General Makabe being much closer to Qui Gon than say Han or anyone from the OT (other than having the Ben Kenobi style duel with his "old friend" in front of his former allies troops.) I would say that Makabe also had a hint of TLJ Luke in him on account of him being an old war hero that spends much of the film coming across as a bit of a gruff jerk before appearing in all his glory at the end.

I think that people just got used to defaulting to Yuki being a precursor to Leia due to her being a "princess" and of course that famous moment of her sleeping on the rock in the exact same pose as Leia in the detention center. Otherwise her character overall is much more Padme-ish.

But yeah HF is just a fun watch all around. It even feels a bit "The Good the Bad and the Ugly" in parts due to the cinematography of the craggy terrain and individual duels set against the backdrop of war and gold.

 

[ajp4mgs]

I would say that Makabe also had a hint of TLJ Luke in him on account of him being an old war hero that spends much of the film coming across as a bit of a gruff jerk before appearing in all his glory at the end.

Yep! I got the exact same impression. Even when Tahei and Matashichi take note of his appearance and doubt that he could possibly be the legend they'd heard of when he told them his name. Didn't even carry a sword, as they noted.

I think that people just got used to defaulting to Yuki being a precursor to Leia due to her being a "princess" and of course that famous moment of her sleeping on the rock in the exact same pose as Leia in the detention center. Otherwise her character overall is much more Padme-ish.

Totally agree.

But yeah HF is just a fun watch all around. It even feels a bit "The Good the Bad and the Ugly" in parts due to the cinematography of the craggy terrain and individual duels set against the backdrop of war and gold.

I didn't get a "The Good the Bad and the Ugly" vibe from this one, certainly not like other Kurosawa films. The one film I did get a sense of was Treasure of the Sierra Madre when Tahei and Matashichi are willing to fight over the gold. An oft-repeated trope of sorts, but "Treasure" is the one that came to my mind immediately.

 

[JAWS]

Lets be honest here. The OT gen don't like making vids or technology all too much. Also, most people who make those vids are in there 20, 30s and 40s which means some lived during the 80s and 90s and hell maybe even the end of the 70s when the PT wasn't a thing yet and the OT was very prominent and the only star wars media they had. Especially 80s and 70s kids. So they fall into the OT category too. 90s and 00s kids, not so much.

Hmmm the only videos I see that are full ST hate fests tend to be late 20' early 30's I know Mauler (who has the epic long videos) is a PT fan.

Regarding this place. This is just a small little bubble, like I keep telling you guys. Khev and Jye don't make up the majority of opnion. Go onto various TLJ vids or reddit forums and you'll see many old school fans' distaste for Luke.

Oh I get that.. This is just a small group.

I just know that people my age who are SW fans that I know personally dont seem to get too upset by those movies. They tend to all thin that SW is kind of a mess after the OT. But we all watch and talk about them anyways


I don't hang out in Reddit.. Maybe I should go stir up the pot..


Nah... Too exhausting

 

[ironwez20]

Lol yea Reddit is to much sometimes and I don?t even wanna go into 4chan

 

[punisher1974]

If you thought you'd had sex with a projection it means you'd never had sex before.

Fair point but I think you get the meaning. Most of us were just let down with Luke being a projection instead of actual being there. The movie for me had bigger problems than that though. Although I prefer Luke actually being proactive.

 

[punisher1974]

It depends on the projection, lol.

Fair point Sir.

 

[The Buffinator]

Fair point but I think you get the meaning. Most of us were just let down with Luke being a projection instead of actual being there. The movie for me had bigger problems than that though. Although I prefer Luke actually being proactive.

I get where you're coming from but I for one wasn't let down by Luke's projection ruse. I thought it was amazing & showed that, even after having shut himself off from the Force for a significant period of time, he was still one formidable Jedi. I was let down by the decision to have him die immediately afterwards. I suppose his dying to save Leia & the remainder of the Rebels made it all the more heroic, but I still would have preferred to see him in the flesh playing the "Gandalf" role in TROS.

 

[ZE_501]

[...]but I still would have preferred to see him in the flesh playing the "Gandalf" role in TROS.

I don't remember seeing it put more succinctly. The archetype for Old Luke was *right there*. He was *literally a Space Wizard* and they made him into ... aaahhh ****** it.

 

[punisher1974]

I get where you're coming from but I for one wasn't let down by Luke's projection ruse. I thought it was amazing & showed that, even after having shut himself off from the Force for a significant period of time, he was still one formidable Jedi. I was let down by the decision to have him die immediately afterwards. I suppose his dying to save Leia & the remainder of the Rebels made it all the more heroic, but I still would have preferred to see him in the flesh playing the "Gandalf" role in TROS.

Luke was still powerful and I was glad to see him die a hero and become one with the force but the sequel trilogy is still a headscratcher for me. Some good bits in them for sure but not really anything i will revisit much. I do find alot of the discussions entertaining though.

 

[TheDucky]

Luke died like a *****.

 

[DiFabio]

Luke died like a *****.

Worse than Padme really.

Atleast Anakin choked her out a little. Luke? ***** was just sittin’ there meditating. It’s like c’mon bro, you survived getting raped by a trash compactor monster, sitting on a rock thinking up ways to troll your nephew should be a piece of cake.

 

[The Buffinator]

Worse than Padme really.

At least Anakin choked her out a little. Luke? ***** was just sittin? there meditating. It?s like c?mon bro, you survived getting raped by a trash compactor monster, sitting on a rock thinking up ways to troll your nephew should be a piece of cake.

I think we're supposed to conclude that it took all of his life force to project himself across the galaxy, which is why I think having him climb back onto the rock was a curious decision. Obviously done for dramatic effect with him looking off at the sunset or whatever, but IMO his dying/becoming one with the Force should have happened at the same time that his apparition disappeared on Crait. Instead the scene provides ammunition to those claiming that he simply "gave up", as it appears that while drained by the effort, he actually did survive the projecting.

 

[Khev]

I think we're supposed to conclude that it took all of his life force to project himself across the galaxy, which is why I think having him climb back onto the rock was a curious decision. Obviously done for dramatic effect with him looking off at the sunset or whatever, but IMO his dying/becoming one with the Force should have happened at the same time that his apparition disappeared on Crait. Instead the scene provides ammunition to those claiming that he simply "gave up", as it appears that while drained by the effort, he actually did survive the projecting.

Yes his death was confusing when seeing for the first time for sure. He did seem to expend *a lot* of his final energy just climbing back up onto that damn rock, lol. Which then led to him doing a lot of disappearing within just a couple moments of one another. Now if RJ *really* wanted to subvert expectations then when Luke climbed onto the rock they would have cut to him looking all trim and clean, holding a cup of cocoa on a posh balcony in Coruscant, eyes closed while he projected himself as a washed up old man on Ahch-To, which was projecting *another* projection onto Crait, lol.

Then the Ahch-To projection could have been all "See you 'round sunset."

Sun: "NOOOOOOO!"