Star Wars Saga (OT/PT/ST) Discussion Thread

[ZE_501]

[...]

Hysterical breakdown of Vader's armor.

I remember reading that on Wookiepedia or wherever once. What I call stupid, overwrought, pointless and childish, other fans call dramatic depth and world-building. What can you do?

(Avoid conventions and large swathes of the Internet.)

It's no wonder Lucas disavowed any of that fiction being canonical.

Maybe I just don't feel like there is a need for the Kennedy trilogy to exist. [...]

Bingo. I was open to enjoying it at first because why not? But they worked hard to make it impossible.

 

[Prime Clone]

On another note, while I enjoyed RO the Vader sequence was jammed in, and now makes this scene disingenuous:

What I *will* say about RO is that it's more of a prequel in the style of the cliffhanger serial, in that it leads directly into ANH.

But SW in general is suffering from too much explaining, connecting and fan service.

(Oh, and for those who don't think there should be politics in SW, it's right there in some of the first few lines ever heard - plus the Imperial conference room later in the same film.)

 

[xipotec]

On another note, while I enjoyed RO the Vader sequence was jammed in, and now makes this scene disingenuous:

What I *will* say about RO is that it's more of a prequel in the style of the cliffhanger serial, in that it leads directly into ANH.

But SW in general is suffering from too much explaining, connecting and fan service.

(Oh, and for those who don't think there should be politics in SW, it's right there in some of the first few lines ever heard - plus the Imperial conference room later in the same film.)

What they mean is they don?t want politics they feel are against their own politics.

Although I am not quite sure how someone sides with the Empire.


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[Prime Clone]

What they mean is they don?t want politics they feel are against their own politics.

Although I am not quite sure how someone sides with the Empire.

Actually I was referring to the trade negotiations and general politicking of the PT - which never bothered me as they're alluded to in the original ANH novelisation.

 

[ZE_501]

On another note, while I enjoyed RO the Vader sequence was jammed in, and now makes this scene disingenuous:

[...]

Yeah, that was unnecessary IMO, and problematic for later situations.

Also, for me at least...he went from this looming, dark presence to a Terminator or Clone Wars outtake or something. Then again, this is the same Vader that hopped into his TIE to engage rebel pilots personally, so there is that.

But SW in general is suffering from too much explaining, connecting and fan service.[...]

That's really the heart of the matter right there, and canon or not, it started long before the Mouse got its paws on Lucasfilm.

What made it so magical in the beginning was a sense of vast space and deep time, cloaked in mystery. Can't catch lightning in a bottle when you're hell-bent on labeling the bottle.

What they mean is they don?t want politics they feel are against their own politics.

Although I am not quite sure how someone sides with the Empire.


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...a diverse alliance of activists fighting for rights and freedoms against a monolithic conformist empire...

 

[Khev]

On another note, while I enjoyed RO the Vader sequence was jammed in, and now makes this scene disingenuous:

How so?

 

[Prime Clone]

How so?

He says it's a consular ship on a diplomatic mission when Vader has just chased it from the Battle of Scarif.

 

[Bravomite]

He says it's a consular ship on a diplomatic mission when Vader has just chased it from the Battle of Scarif.

I just re-contextualise that as obvious posturing on the side of the rebels. They know they have been caught out but are sticking to their story to avoid giving away any further information that will assist Vader... that and they are buying Leia time to conceal the plans.

 

[xipotec]

Actually I was referring to the trade negotiations and general politicking of the PT - which never bothered me as they're alluded to in the original ANH novelisation.

Seriously? Trade negotiation and import export taxes and routes are the life blood of the world.

Wall Street controls everything !!!!!!

Fans should have been grateful to GL for showing us the true way wars start.....

It?s the best drama!



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[Khev]

He says it's a consular ship on a diplomatic mission when Vader has just chased it from the Battle of Scarif.

And why would you expect the Rebels to come clean and admit that they were the same ship Vader chased from Scarif when he discovers them in a completely different system? Though clearly Vader wasn't buying the ruse as he strangled Antilles without even waiting to hear his answer.

If the Rebels weren't supposed to lie "Scarif? Never heard of it..." then what should Ben have told the Stormtroopers in Mos Eisley? "Yes these ARE the droids you're looking for," lol.

 

[Prime Clone]

I just re-contextualise that as obvious posturing on the side of the rebels. They know they have been caught out but are sticking to their story to avoid giving away any further information that will assist Vader... that and they are buying Leia time to conceal the plans.

And why would you expect the Rebels to come clean and admit that they were the same ship Vader chased from Scarif when he discovers them in a completely different system? Though clearly Vader wasn't buying the ruse as he strangled Antilles without even waiting to hear his answer.

If the Rebels weren't supposed to lie "Scarif? Never heard of it..." then what should Ben have told the Stormtroopers in Mos Eisley? "Yes these ARE the droids you're looking for," lol.

I get that, and I wouldn't expect them to say or do otherwise. It just seems all the more absurd in light of prior events!

Maybe it's Vader's lines that need to change: "Several transmissions were *hand-delivered* to this ship by Rebel spies. *I saw it myself!*"

 

[Wor-Gar]

Well, if you have problems with the choices of words, it must drive you crazy in RO to wonder... 1) how the hell did Vader know which ship was receiving the transmissions from... 2) why was he hiding in the dark.... 3) he never saw any plans, just a bunch of guys shooting and running... 4) why he was pursuing the men and that ship is only clear because WE see the plans being handed off (Vader doesn't).



Oh... but the Force.


Lucas' greatest excuse ever made.

Hey, let's run super-fast, but then never again.... the Force.

Hey, let's 'feel' everything, except when we really need to.... the Force.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

The force sure trolled the hell out of Annie.

 

[Khev]

Rogue One isn't a perfect fit with the OT but as has been discussed before the OT itself doesn't all fit perfectly together with itself either. RO does make a valiant effort though and I can appreciate that. Even SW had that weird inconsistency with the plans being "beamed transmissions" according to Vader and "stolen data tapes" according to Motti. So I thought that RO did an admirable job of showing Jyn steal tapes that she later beamed to the Rebels.

 

[xipotec]

The force sure trolled the hell out of Annie.

ROTFL....

He was the chosen one......


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[Wor-Gar]

but as has been discussed before the OT itself doesn't all fit perfectly together with itself either.

True... it is the father of the greatest Star Wars story debacle of all.... [Vader] betrayed and murdered your father.

 

[The Buffinator]

True... it is the father of the greatest Star Wars story debacle of all.... [Vader] betrayed and murdered your father.

...from a certain point of view....

 

[Wor-Gar]

...from a certain point of view....

That's what led to the "certain point of view" bit... an excuse almost as magical as the Force itself.

I also blame that for giving us a generation that sees anything they don't like as Fake News.

 

[The Buffinator]

That's what led to the "certain point of view" bit... an excuse almost as magical as the Force itself.

I also blame that for giving us a generation that sees anything they don't like as Fake News.

It's revisionist history at its best/worst, but I don't think we can blame GL for the Fake News b.s. we have today. And it's not an entire generation. As I would tell my daughter when she was younger and couldn't comprehend how some people could be so stupid: Someone has to populate the other tail of the bell curve.

 

[Khev]

That's what led to the "certain point of view" bit... an excuse almost as magical as the Force itself.

When all he had to do was just have Ben say "You were meant to discover the truth yourself as part of your training to be a Jedi Knight. It was not my place to tell you" or something like that. But no he had to take that opportunity to promote moral relativism instead, lol.