Star Wars: The Force Awakens (12/18/15)

Collector Freaks Forum

Help Support Collector Freaks Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (2015) Discussion Thread

Reemergence of the Sith negates everything leading up to Vader tossing Palpies into an abyss. It reduces Vader and Luke's victory to a mere vanity.

Luke is essentially a monk, like Ben and Yoda. No children, thank you very much. Aside from that, it is stupidly unimaginative and over sentimental for Luke to name his kid Ben or Leia to name her son Anakin. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid and sappy sentimental crap.

Some EU stories explain this better than what the movies made it seem. The Force is about balance, and it was seriously out of balance because of the Jedi--who for some reason were blindly supporting an extremely corrupt government, the prophecy was about bringing the Jedi down, not about getting rid of evil. Of course, after that the Sith tried to get rid of them entirely, which is why Luke came around to stop them.
The Sith are always going to come back. That's why I hope they don't just do Jedi Vs. Sith stories because that's getting a bit old.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (2015) Discussion Thread

I just want to see Hoth again.

2,000 Wampa vs 1,000 Taun Tauns.

Massive battle in the snow.

Wait, sounds so PT like, please disregard. :lol
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (2015) Discussion Thread

Some EU stories explain this better than what the movies made it seem. The Force is about balance, and it was seriously out of balance because of the Jedi--who for some reason were blindly supporting an extremely corrupt government, the prophecy was about bringing the Jedi down, not about getting rid of evil. Of course, after that the Sith tried to get rid of them entirely, which is why Luke came around to stop them.
The Sith are always going to come back. That's why I hope they don't just do Jedi Vs. Sith stories because that's getting a bit old.

The little bit of the mysterious croonies we saw in ROTJ chilling out with Palpatine was 100 x better than any senate related stuff we saw in the **** Trilogy.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (2015) Discussion Thread

Won't happen. I hope they completely disregard the 30 years of EU writing - and they will. :yess:

:exactly:
People need to jump off the EU fanboy fun wagon. Lucas didn't even cannonize 99% of the EU and now with Disney at the helm, I see them going their own way with maaaaaaaaaaybe minutia cherrypicked here and there.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (2015) Discussion Thread

Reemergence of the Sith negates everything leading up to Vader tossing Palpies into an abyss. It reduces Vader and Luke's victory to a mere vanity.

Luke is essentially a monk, like Ben and Yoda. No children, thank you very much. Aside from that, it is stupidly unimaginative and over sentimental for Luke to name his kid Ben or Leia to name her son Anakin. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid and sappy sentimental crap.

I can get that.. but to play devil's advocate....

Luke's victory is against Darth Bane's sith Order. The rule of two. he ended those. there is no depreciation of his victory in this sense.
Beyond that, the Galaxy at large at one time had entire civilizeations of Sith. Their teachings and ideas and artifacts liter the galaxy. It's entire;y possible for someone to find one of those, a holocron, a book, a temple, ETC, and become a self taught sith.

Additionaly. the new sith, the "lost tribe" in the novels who are the reemergence are from Exar Kun and Darth Revan's era. a good thousand years BEFORE Darth Bane's rule of two, and Sith purge.

You see, during the sith conquest of the known galaxy, a LARGE warship was exploring in the unknown regions. it got into a firefight, and lost, being forced to run. its engines failed, it fell out of hyperspace, and crashes into a world that has VERY LIMITED technology. Many of the sith on the warship do not survive. MOST of the technology dosn't survive the crash, and the ship is damaged beyond repair.
No shuttles, not any other Lightspeed capable vessels on this world.

The sith Take over using what advanced technology they have left, are embraced as gods by the fairly primitive people of this world, and carve out an old sith empire era civilizeation on this planet for 1000's of years, interbreeding with the indiginous people of the world.

Time passes, and eventualy the planet is rediscovered by a FTL capable vesstle, allowing the sith to re-enter the galaxy. they take up piracy, start stealing ships, and start to spread.


This is where the "New Sith" come from in the EU novels.





As for Ben skywalker....

Luke was "too old" to begin the training and indocternation. Yoda told us as much. He became a jedi spiritualist. Similar to Modern day Martial arts masters, and the like.... who have families. Luke was never taught the whole " Never Love, don't marry, the jedi are your family now etc" that the "younglings" are indoctornated with.
Hell, it was his Love for his father that saved him in the end.

I find it too unbelieveable that he would not seek companionship after the events of ROTJ... witnessing the death of his father seconds after he gets him back.

as for naming a child after a beloved freind.. well.. real people do that to.
Hell, my son share's my Father's name.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (2015) Discussion Thread

:exactly:
People need to jump off the EU fanboy fun wagon. Lucas didn't even cannonize 99% of the EU and now with Disney at the helm, I see them going their own way with maaaaaaaaaaybe minutia cherrypicked here and there.

this is essentialy what i'm advocating.

35 years of material about actors who are now in their 60's is alot of time to fill. Why reinvent the wheel, when you can throw a bone to the EU fans here and there, and simply give a wink and a nod to what's already there, unless you NEED to do otherwwise.

why?

becuase i'm sure disney and LFL like the lisencing dollars those EU novels and comics bring in.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (2015) Discussion Thread

The EU just isn't good enough to warrant being turned into feature film. Even if they borrowed some of it that would go too far.

If Disney wants to release animated versions of the EU novels, more power to them, but not part of the saga. The new films need to be unexpected and new.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (2015) Discussion Thread

I can get that.. but to play devil's advocate....

Luke's victory is against Darth Bane's sith Order.

I don't recall him ever being mentioned in the movies. Funny that.

As for Ben skywalker....

Luke was "too old" to begin the training and indocternation. Yoda told us as much.

Yet Yoda did train him... "Jedi spiritualist". Bah. All you ever do with all your paragraphs is convince me even more that the new movies should veer as far away as possible from that EU crap. :lol
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (2015) Discussion Thread

I don't recall him ever being mentioned in the movies. Funny that.[/U][/I][/B]


Allways two there are, a master and an apprentice.
Someone had to come up with the idea of there only being TWO sith. It didn;t spring fully formed from nothing. Untill the films contradict it, that's Darth Bane.

Yet Yoda did train him... "Jedi spiritualist". Bah. All you ever do with all your paragraphs is convince me even more that the new movies should veer as far away as possible from that EU crap. :lol



And nowhere during his training did he tell him NOt to have a family.
 
Last edited:
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (2015) Discussion Thread

And nowhere during his training did he tell him NOt to have a family.

That is an idiotic argument. Absence of evidence is not evidence. Yoda also didn't teach Luke that castration is also a part of the Jedi order, doesn't mean we should introduce Jedi Castrators in the next 3 movies.

No.

The creator of Star Wars has been consistent on one point: The Jedi are monks. Celibate monks.

No I don't think after Luke burned what was left of his father that he was feeling horny and needed "companionship". :lol The character of Luke had evolved beyond the need for stuff like that.

Every word you write makes me more solidly against anything you believe about the merits of the EU. It sounds so completely stupid and un-Star Wars.

They may cherry pick a few inconsequential things from the EU as some sort of coloring, but if you think they are going to acknowledge any of that crap in any kind of meaningful way you are in for a grand disappointment.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (2015) Discussion Thread

We will see where they take the Jedi lifestyle in the next three movies. They can do what they want. Anything else is conjecture and speculation.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (2015) Discussion Thread

How about this then.

They Skywalkers and ARE star wars. for there not to be a prominant NEW Skywalker in this film as a NEW character for the NEW trilogy would be a huge mistake as far as marketing and monitazation goes.

The OT has Luke Skywalker
the PT has Ben Skywalker
the NT has ???? Skywalker

We're going to see a new generation of SKywalker in this film. He or she might not even be the main character. and that could be cool too. have him or her be the Lando of this series. Present, but off doing their own thing.

Odd that you make the leap from burning vader to procreation. Though, for the record, I'm intentionaly "dumbing down" my answers and keeping them vague in an attempt to avoid "WALL OF TEXT"

To further the companionship idea.

There is a major difference between Romantic Love and physical love.

Think of it this way. NOt so much physical companionship, as someone to share his burdon. The ENTIRE future of the jedi has been placed at the feet of Luke . He has spent his ENTIRE LIFE wondering about his father, and either being lied to, or having the subject avoided. He FINALY finds the truth, and discovers his father has become a monster... a monster he believes he can save, and redeem.

In the end, his Love for his father is rewarded, he gets his father back for one breef moment... then he dies.

That, after YEARS of buildup is Going to be MASSIVELY TRAUMATIC. I don't care who you are, that is GOING to efect you.

Luke's only other family, his sister, has fallen in love, and is undoubtably a little shaken by learning luke is her brother.

It makes sense they would keep their distance from each other. following that revelation. Not to mention, Leia now learns she was tortured by HER OWN FATHER during her inprisonment about The Death Star.

Companionship can lead to romantic love, which would eventualy lead to consumation and procreation, but not right away.

Anakin dies, Luke cremates him. He mourns, he feels the loss, he moves on, he has larger tasks, he makes friends, forms relationships, and, to quote Ian Malcom "Life Finds a Way"

Yes, the Jedi order was celibate.. . the OLD jedi order. the one that Died in ROTS.

Introducing the Idea of a celibate life to a 20 year old who has never considered it before and having them embrace it fully?
Nope, don't buy it. Hell, the ORIGINAL SCRIPT had Luke's sister as a different character all together, and Luke and Leia ending up together at the end of the story.

Lets not forget the forshadowing of the ESB Kiss in the medbay.

But I digress. As I've said time and again, I'm not expecting any Meaningful inclusin to the EU in thenew films. but I'm not expecting it to be completely bulldozed either. Both the CLonewars series, and the PT included PT elements where they could, and erased them where they needed to due to the story they wanted to tell. I'm expecting the same here.

my only question lies with what gets kept, and what gets tossed.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (2015) Discussion Thread

Eh, the Cherry-picking in his reasoning is kinda fascinating to me.

The following is an oversimplification.
This is what was shown, so it's the only way it can be.

This wasn't shown, but it's the only way it can be, even though it contradicts common sense.

in his defense, A great deal of SW suffers from Tell don't show syndrome, which leaves a great deal of room of intrepratation.

end of the day, i'm more interested in understading his viewpoint, than converting him to mine.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (2015) Discussion Thread

Inside the mind of George Lucas:

1) The Force is what give a Jedi his/her power.
2) The Force runs in families. And it may be a virus. Or something.
3) Forbid the Jedi from having families to pass their bloodlines along. (Huh?)
4) ????
5) Profit!
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (2015) Discussion Thread

How about this then.

They Skywalkers and ARE star wars. for there not to be a prominant NEW Skywalker in this film as a NEW character for the NEW trilogy would be a huge mistake as far as marketing and monitazation goes.

The OT has Luke Skywalker
the PT has Ben Skywalker
the NT has ???? Skywalker

We're going to see a new generation of SKywalker in this film. He or she might not even be the main character. and that could be cool too. have him or her be the Lando of this series. Present, but off doing their own thing.

Odd that you make the leap from burning vader to procreation. Though, for the record, I'm intentionaly "dumbing down" my answers and keeping them vague in an attempt to avoid "WALL OF TEXT"

To further the companionship idea.

There is a major difference between Romantic Love and physical love.

Think of it this way. NOt so much physical companionship, as someone to share his burdon. The ENTIRE future of the jedi has been placed at the feet of Luke . He has spent his ENTIRE LIFE wondering about his father, and either being lied to, or having the subject avoided. He FINALY finds the truth, and discovers his father has become a monster... a monster he believes he can save, and redeem.

In the end, his Love for his father is rewarded, he gets his father back for one breef moment... then he dies.

That, after YEARS of buildup is Going to be MASSIVELY TRAUMATIC. I don't care who you are, that is GOING to efect you.

Luke's only other family, his sister, has fallen in love, and is undoubtably a little shaken by learning luke is her brother.

It makes sense they would keep their distance from each other. following that revelation. Not to mention, Leia now learns she was tortured by HER OWN FATHER during her inprisonment about The Death Star.

Companionship can lead to romantic love, which would eventualy lead to consumation and procreation, but not right away.

Anakin dies, Luke cremates him. He mourns, he feels the loss, he moves on, he has larger tasks, he makes friends, forms relationships, and, to quote Ian Malcom "Life Finds a Way"

Yes, the Jedi order was celibate.. . the OLD jedi order. the one that Died in ROTS.

Introducing the Idea of a celibate life to a 20 year old who has never considered it before and having them embrace it fully?
Nope, don't buy it. Hell, the ORIGINAL SCRIPT had Luke's sister as a different character all together, and Luke and Leia ending up together at the end of the story.

Lets not forget the forshadowing of the ESB Kiss in the medbay.

But I digress. As I've said time and again, I'm not expecting any Meaningful inclusin to the EU in thenew films. but I'm not expecting it to be completely bulldozed either. Both the CLonewars series, and the PT included PT elements where they could, and erased them where they needed to due to the story they wanted to tell. I'm expecting the same here.

my only question lies with what gets kept, and what gets tossed.

I agree, without the Skywalker lineage, you may as well stop making Star Wars movies. Besides, isn't the Jedi trait hereditary? If that's the case, it would practically be Luke's duty to procreate in order to continue the Order.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (2015) Discussion Thread

Inside the mind of George Lucas:

1) The Force is what give a Jedi his/her power.
2) The Force runs in families. And it may be a virus. Or something.
3) Forbid the Jedi from having families to pass their bloodlines along. (Huh?)
4) ????
5) Profit!

I agree, without the Skywalker lineage, you may as well stop making Star Wars movies. Besides, isn't the Jedi trait hereditary? If that's the case, it would practically be Luke's duty to procreate in order to continue the Order.

I purposly didn't go down that Avenu just yet. but it's an excelent point.

So the big question this brings up is, Who is Anakin's father/ Luke's Grandfather?
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (2015) Discussion Thread

That is an idiotic argument. Absence of evidence is not evidence. Yoda also didn't teach Luke that castration is also a part of the Jedi order, doesn't mean we should introduce Jedi Castrators in the next 3 movies.

No.

The creator of Star Wars has been consistent on one point: The Jedi are monks. Celibate monks.

No I don't think after Luke burned what was left of his father that he was feeling horny and needed "companionship". :lol The character of Luke had evolved beyond the need for stuff like that.

Every word you write makes me more solidly against anything you believe about the merits of the EU. It sounds so completely stupid and un-Star Wars.

They may cherry pick a few inconsequential things from the EU as some sort of coloring, but if you think they are going to acknowledge any of that crap in any kind of meaningful way you are in for a grand disappointment.



in the PT, the Jedi were indeed "monks"… flawed, naive monks that were brought down by the cunning of one man. Luke went beyond both Obi Wan's and Yoda's advice / guidance… he didn't conform to their narrow-mindedness and prevailed utilizing his own judgement. i wouldn't count on Luke feeling trapped by any former "Jedi Guidelines".
 
Back
Top