Star Wars: The Last Jedi (Dec 15th, 2017)

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Female SW fan explains how TLJ is insulting to women.



Her intro about having both badass females and males in the movie is exactly what my idea of Rey and Luke fighting side by side in the throne room would have achieved. That would have been so epic and mind-blowing, and really powerful to see him come around in such a way.
Showing the audience that Luke had finally accepted her for who she was (his potential padawan, and the future), even if he were to fall at the hands of Snoke and Kylo a few minutes later. What a ****ing wasted opportunity. I'll never forgive Ruin Johnson for this.
 
That sounds like a terrible ending for Luke. I really don’t think they should have killed him off in this flick. Especially with Fisher dying unexpectedly.
 
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Nah, here ya go...

 
That sounds like a terrible ending for Luke. I really don’t think they should have killed him off in this flick. Especially with Fisher dying unexpectedly.

It's crazy. They had an opportunity to kill Leia in a 'great' way. Instead they kept her alive and killed Luke. Clearly they didn't want to have to do massive reshoots after Carrie Fisher died, but now they find themselves having to recast her, or kill her off screen. So no major actor from the OT in IX (we'll probably get Force ghost Luke...).
 
It's crazy. They had an opportunity to kill Leia in a 'great' way. Instead they kept her alive and killed Luke. Clearly they didn't want to have to do massive reshoots after Carrie Fisher died, but now they find themselves having to recast her, or kill her off screen. So no major actor from the OT in IX (we'll probably get Force ghost Luke...).

You have the choice of keeping Luke alive - and Hamill doing a pretty great performance - versus keeping Leia alive with CF's mouth and facial movement a bit - limited (not sure what that was about) - and you choose to kill Luke and have Leia live on to the next one?

All other creative choices in TLJ aside, why wouldn't you keep Luke around for - something - in Ep IX? A ST movie without any OT cast member is a PT movie to me.:dunno

The major part of the appeal of the ST was to see the OT heroes in action again, but they ditched that after the 2nd movie. Unfortunately for me, I'm not all that engaged with Ren, Finn and Kylo, and there's so few questions posed in TLJ that need answering - all the questions posed in TFA got an "LOL" subversion answer anyway.
 
It's crazy. They had an opportunity to kill Leia in a 'great' way. Instead they kept her alive and killed Luke. Clearly they didn't want to have to do massive reshoots after Carrie Fisher died, but now they find themselves having to recast her, or kill her off screen. So no major actor from the OT in IX (we'll probably get Force ghost Luke...).

I can't wait for Hamill to go on a rant about how he fundamentally disagrees with force ghost Luke. #notmyghost
 
These corporate movie critics are defacto PR specialists working for Disney.

"'Star Wars: The Last Jedi' is the divisive Star Wars reboot fans need right now"

"Some diehards claim the latest Star Wars "killed their childhood." And guess what? They’re right."

https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opini...ivisive-star-wars-reboot-fans-need-ncna834061



I get the same feeling when I see NeoMcCarthyism being propagated by the corporate media. Russia Russia Russia!
 
Eventually, the OT characters will all be gone. That’s the way of things. As fans, we all have to kinda get over it. :dunno
 
These corporate movie critics are defacto PR specialists working for Disney.

"'Star Wars: The Last Jedi' is the divisive Star Wars reboot fans need right now"

"Some diehards claim the latest Star Wars "killed their childhood." And guess what? They’re right."

https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opini...ivisive-star-wars-reboot-fans-need-ncna834061

I get the same feeling when I see NeoMcCarthyism being propagated by the corporate media. Russia Russia Russia!

That NBC piece is so clueless it's funny. I love how it calls RO "a mess." And... pic of bearded obsessive fan with lightsaber - check! That's the guy we're gonna take down...:lol

"When the original trilogy came out in the 1970s and 1980s, many current fans were children. Childhood was a time for simple answers. Good and bad were unequivocal, wins were forever, and everyone lived happily ever after.

But that’s not the way life works. Good people do terrible things, and bad people do small acts of kindness. Heroes aren't perfect — they can be as weak and small as everyone else. There is no such thing as happily ever after.


Ummm. Like ZERO understanding of how Star wars grew out of the moral quagmire of the Vietnam War and Nixon's impeachment - some of the darkest, most morally messed up days ever. It's one of Star Wars' KEY APPEALS.

And...

"The Chosen One was finally female, heralding a wave of women taking the forefront in long-standing fantasy properties."

Heralding? Say what? Does this author go to the movies - at all? It's this thing I've heard over and over in the past few weeks: as if Rey was the first major female lead in a big studio movie... seemingly oblivious to the dozens of huge movies and many franchises (mythic, fantasy, sci-fi) with female leads of the past 15 years.

The level of sophistication and analysis/insight in these articles is shocking; blogger-level stuff, yet they crop up in major news outlets.:slap


Eventually, the OT characters will all be gone. That’s the way of things. As fans, we all have to kinda get over it. :dunno

Really? But... why?
 
That NBC piece is so clueless it's funny. I love how it calls RO "a mess." And... pic of bearded obsessive fan with lightsaber - check! That's the guy we're gonna take down...:lol

"When the original trilogy came out in the 1970s and 1980s, many current fans were children. Childhood was a time for simple answers. Good and bad were unequivocal, wins were forever, and everyone lived happily ever after.

But that’s not the way life works. Good people do terrible things, and bad people do small acts of kindness. Heroes aren't perfect — they can be as weak and small as everyone else. There is no such thing as happily ever after.


Ummm. Like ZERO understanding of how Star wars grew out of the moral quagmire of the Vietnam War and Nixon's impeachment - some of the darkest, most morally messed up days ever. It's one of Star Wars' KEY APPEALS.

And...

"The Chosen One was finally female, heralding a wave of women taking the forefront in long-standing fantasy properties."

Heralding? Say what? Does this author go to the movies - at all? It's this thing I've heard over and over in the past few weeks: as if Rey was the first major female lead in a big studio movie... seemingly oblivious to the dozens of huge movies and many franchises (mythic, fantasy, sci-fi) with female leads of the past 15 years.

The level of sophistication and analysis/insight in these articles is shocking; blogger-level stuff, yet they crop up in major news outlets.:slap




Really? But... why?

The author and his ilk don't really believe what they're saying. Like with corporate "reporters" generally, it's all about access to the powerful.

"It is a bitter irony of source journalism that the most esteemed journalists are precisely the most servile. For it is by making themselves useful to the powerful that they gain access to the ‘best’ sources."

-Walter Karp, former editor of Harper's Magazine, 1989
 
Yea that's a real sophisticated take on the reasons for the outrage.
There was no reason to sugar coat what I said. I was being blatantly honest. And it’s not even a direct response to the outrage. It’s something I feel a lot of people don’t get, when throwing out these glorious ideals for how character arcs “should” have been handled. It’s all just hopes and dreams.

These actors are old. And this isn’t a team up of highly dedicated 80s action stars. If you stop and think about it, we’re lucky we got more than simple cameos. They didn’t have to give us an anchor for these new films.

Harrison Ford was, mostly, only on board so that he could finally have his character killed off. Mark Hamill barely had a scene in the first film and in this one they gave him some hefty material. Mark always had this cheesy feeling to him and in this one, it’s only mildly present. Dunno if that’s because he was pissed off all the time, in character and out. He certainly voiced his concerns about Luke’s chosen path.

The point is, we’ve gotten a lot of content from the old cast. Sure, it’s not all been perfect, but it is what it is. This is the story that’s been placed before us. Now, I’m not a fan of the Mary Poppins thing with Leia, but trust me, I’ll live.

Anyway, the future of these films is meant to transcend a group of characters and their actors. I think too much focus has been placed on old characters, by both the fans and the studios, at this point. Not to reverberate a tone from the film, but sometimes you have to let old things die.
 
They all died a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away...

Having abandoned the holy texts we're left with apocrypha.

You can take them, or leave them.

Or take what you want from them.
 
There was no reason to sugar coat what I said. I was being blatantly honest. And it’s not even a direct response to the outrage. It’s something I feel a lot of people don’t get, when throwing out these glorious ideals for how character arcs “should” have been handled. It’s all just hopes and dreams.

These actors are old. And this isn’t a team up of highly dedicated 80s action stars. If you stop and think about it, we’re lucky we got more than simple cameos. They didn’t have to give us an anchor for these new films.

Harrison Ford was, mostly, only on board so that he could finally have his character killed off. Mark Hamill barely had a scene in the first film and in this one they gave him some hefty material. Mark always had this cheesy feeling to him and in this one, it’s only mildly present. Dunno if that’s because he was pissed off all the time, in character and out. He certainly voiced his concerns about Luke’s chosen path.

The point is, we’ve gotten a lot of content from the old cast. Sure, it’s not all been perfect, but it is what it is. This is the story that’s been placed before us. Now, I’m not a fan of the Mary Poppins thing with Leia, but trust me, I’ll live.

Anyway, the future of these films is meant to transcend a group of characters and their actors. I think too much focus has been placed on old characters, by both the fans and the studios, at this point. Not to reverberate a tone from the film, but sometimes you have to let old things die.

Yeah, but... enjoy it, don't enjoy it... it is all immaterial in the larger context of time, humanity and the stories that define us. In fifty years, a hundred years, the OT will still be classic and everything else will be... everything else. Not to say there aren't some good things in that everything else.

All I'm saying is that what has become clear is that the OT was indeed lightning in a bottle - for whatever reason; the moment in time, the people involved, whatever. And whether you like it or not, your great-grandkids will be watching the OT because it is a deeply resonant, mythic and utterly timeless story. The rest will fade, be dated... then long forgotten. Like a sun-faded video box in a 1990's video store that hasn't been rented since 1987.

The rest was always an attempt to graft onto that intangible of the OT... for all the various reasons: because people always want more of a good thing, because there's huge money to be made, because there is merchandise to sell and stock prices to prop up. I don't mean it cynically - films are art, but they are more a business. That's Disney's job.

But then there is just the story - the thing that taps deeply into humanity, where it has been and where it is going. Stories that know us and haunt us. And in SW, that is just the OT.

Forget the billion, forget the two billion, forget Rotten Tomatoes, forget bots and alt right conspiracies of ponytailed too-old nerds who should die. Time... that's the ultimate reviewer. And all of this stuff including the ST - the everything else - will be washed away by the relentless tide of time and the OT will still be like a rock. Forever. That's what you're up against.

So don't talk about old things needing to die. You're willing the impossible with only a huge pile of money and the will of an entertainment conglomerate to back you up. This - Disney's ST - will die with time, and OT will stand like an ancient over its grave.
 
Disrespect to the Lore/Mythos and Old Characters aside for a moment, ask youself why this is the 5th movie to be about the Empire Vs Rebels? Please don't give me their new stupid ****ing names, we all know they are offshoots/remnants of the old orginizations.

If this film and or the franchise wanted to really subvert expectations then why does it feature Jedi/Sith or Empire Vs Rebels, is that the only story in the whole Galaxy??? If someone mentions that the former is a staple of the series, my rebuttal is so are light saber on light saber battles and we didn't see that.

The very fact that this movie has been so devisive speaks volumes about its worth, it wouldn't be a strech to say its a close 50/50 loved and or hated it. Everyone that likes the movie defends it to death, and says this is a Star Wars for the future and new generation, ****ers you wouldn't have Star Wars if it wasn't for a loyal and dedicated fanbase who supported it through the years.
 
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