The Dark Knight Rises *SPOILERS*

[thenammagazine]

Honestly, most of Tarantino's movies are over-acted. That's just his style.

Which is why some are hits and most are misses.

 

[intothevoid]

Honestly, most of Tarantino's movies are over-acted. That's just his style.

Pretty much.

I know but I'm just not feeling it from the trailers (Leo's performance I mean)

Which is why some are hits and most are misses.

Probably

 

[ExMem-LarjaThwei]

I wonder if we'll get a Nightwing movie instead of the Batman reboot....and he could be part of the JLA....?

 

[Sachiel]

I highly doubt it.

Not that I don't want to see 'The Batman Legacy' starring Joseph Gordon-Levitt. "There Was Never Just One Bat"

 

[ExMem-LarjaThwei]

psshh.....

 

[Desamo]

I saw this on last Saturday and it was epic.

Spoiler

first Bane vs Batman was excellent scene when Bane really broke Batman back.Robin Blake was nice surprise and Blake is going to be next Gotham City protector.

 

[AMAZEN]

Hey..... It could happen

 

[thenammagazine]

Hey..... It could happen

Doubtful. Blake as Batman or don't bother.

 

[Kamandi]

If Blake is Batman in the JLA film then why did the Justice League leave Gotham twisting in the wind for nearly six months in TDKR?

 

[thenammagazine]

If Blake is Batman in the JLA film then why did the Justice League leave Gotham twisting in the wind for nearly six months in TDKR?

The JLA film isn't scheduled until well after Man of Steel and the Batman reboot in 2014. So I'd imagine the JLA wouldn't exist until, at the very least, Superman and the new Batman are established.

 

[AMAZEN]

The JLA film isn't scheduled until well after Man of Steel and the Batman reboot in 2014. So I'd imagine the JLA wouldn't exist until, at the very least, Superman and the new Batman are established.

wow a batman reboot already in 2014 is that a fact? cause that's pretty quick!

 

[thenammagazine]

wow a batman reboot already in 2014 is that a fact? cause that's pretty quick!

Yup.

 

[meth head]

God help whoever takes up that mantle. On a hiding to nothing.

 

[MasterSafara]

Hey..... It could happen

This is cool but he's missing the cowl.

 

[thenammagazine]

God help whoever takes up that mantle. On a hiding to nothing.

If it were me, JGL as Batman would be a nobrainer. It'll piss off the casual/comic fans by Batman not being Bruce, but he'd be instantly recognizable to anybody who's seen the Nolan movies and keep the trilogy as loose continuity guaranteeing asses in seats.

 

[DarkArtist81]

If it were me, JGL as Batman would be a nobrainer. It'll piss off the casual/comic fans by Batman not being Bruce, but he'd be instantly recognizable to anybody who's seen the Nolan movies and keep the trilogy as loose continuity guaranteeing asses in seats.

Agreed entirely.

 

[Niltusk]

If JGL took over, I'd like to see him go more the Azrael route than a Robin route. Since he doesn't have the League training, he could be more reliant on the suit and go a little nuts tarnishing the Bat reputation along the way. Sure, this basically robs the Knightfall storyline, but I think it could make for some cool movies.

 

[Maglor]

First of all, I loved the movie. I found it to be totally engrossing, as well as a very satisfying conclusion to BW's journey. However, there are aspects I have some issues with.

I've only seen the film once on opening day, and I have pretty much stayed out of this thread, so I don't know what all has been discussed.

A lot of the problems that I had with the film the first time I saw it I have come to terms with, however I would like to address two things before I see it a second time this weekend.

First of all this post was quoted in the DC forums:

Dude, that's kind of what I'm saying, but I disagree that none of it makes sense:



But, like I also said, despite this:



On some level you think so too, because you're playing.



Maybe there is a solution to that problem...


You have a point here. This doesn't really contradict The Dark Knight taking place in 2008 as the on-screen evidence from DiFabio shows.

Bear with me a sec: Maybe Batman Begins from his first night out to defeating Ra's does actually take place over a couple years, as Zach suggested:



--and it is from:

2003 - 2005

Things that suddenly fit if we accept this, and assume that TDK takes place in 2008:

2003 - Bruce Wayne returns to Gotham City, has his first night out, begins prowling as the Batman.

2003 - Jimmy is a two year-old infant when Batman visits Gordon at home.

2005 - Batman defeats Ra's Al Ghul on the train. Remember this is on the SAME NIGHT that he has his 30th birthday party.

2005 - 2008 - Offscreen, Batman wages war on crime, working his way up to the big fish of the mob. Assuming this is true conveniently explains several things:

- (1) Like SnakeDoc suggests, it is not until a year before TDK that he is finally having an impact that is really hurting them and making them take notice.

- (2) All during this time, while Batman is building his reputation, Joker commits random crimes and builds up his own legend among criminals. This is where we get the "So why do they call him the Joker?" "I heard he wears makeup..to scare people...y'know, war paint" lines. It makes sense that it takes a while to build up that kind of rumormill/reputation. It also explains the "Two-bit wack job, cheap purple suit" line from Maroni and the "Him again" line from Batman. Joker wasn't wearing the purple suit during the bank robbery, so Maroni must have seen/heard of him before. Like Batman, dispite his crimes, he views him as just a minor nuisance to be dealth with later.

- (3) Guestimating this three-year gap between the films also neatly explains the line in The Dark Knight Manual that he was wearing the Original Suit for 5 years---he was---from 2003 to 2008.

- (4) Finally, this 3 year gap ages little Jimmy almost perfectly. If he is two years-old in 2003, then he is seven in 2008. It doesn't take much stretching in either direction to make him an 8 year-old, or to even just assume he is supposed to be seven in that film.

The Dark Knight Rises is eight years later.

2016 Now I know the Gotham Civil War poster contradicts this, with the date of the exhibit ending in 2014. But this is the only really hard-set date we know of (as of now anyway), and it's not really clear if it even appears noticeably on-screen or if a hard-set date of 2014 appears in the final film on screen, so I'm willing to overlook it. Also, I realize this is just an excuse, but that poster could be an "old" ad that was never taken down, or pasted over with something else newer that is peeling off. It certainly doesn't look like it's supposed to be in new condition. Just sayin'.

Working backward from the above dates, we can make the milestones in Bruce's life fit too.

2003 - Bruce Wayne returns to Gotham. Based on the above that he turns 30 in 2005, he turns 28 in 2003. Since we know he was away for seven years, he dropped out of Princeton at 21 (or 20, depending on his birthday) as an undergrad in his senior year, just shy of graduation.

Working farther back and using the casefile of the Wayne murders in The Dark Knight Manual

November 8, 1983 - The Waynes are gunned down. Bruce is 10 or 11 years old (again, depending on his birthday)

1972 or 1973 - Bruce Wayne is born.

I'm very impressed with this post. Nice work DarkMagic, it all really makes sense to me.

Is this timeline accepted for the most part, or are many contesting it?





Secondly, this really bothered me (before I found this article):

https://screenrant.com/dark-knight-...tm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=zergnet_27180


If you don't have the time/desire to read, this sums it up:

The Dark Knight basically said “Sometimes a lie that inspires is better than a truth that defeats,” while The Dark Knight Rises basically says, “Hope and inspiration cannot be falsely earned, they have to be fought for through blood, sweat, tears and sacrifice.” It’s not every day that a movie uses a sequel to contradict the thematic conclusions of its predecessor.

I have to say that the opening of TDKR really deflated TDK for me, for this reason.


Thoughts?

 

[intothevoid]

First of all, I loved the movie. I found it to be totally engrossing, as well as a very satisfying conclusion to BW's journey. However, there are aspects I have some issues with.

I've only seen the film once on opening day, and I have pretty much stayed out of this thread, so I don't know what all has been discussed.

A lot of the problems that I had with the film the first time I saw it I have come to terms with, however I would like to address two things before I see it a second time this weekend.

First of all this post was quoted in the DC forums:





I'm very impressed with this post. Nice work DarkMagic, it all really makes sense to me.

Is this timeline accepted for the most part, or are many contesting it?





Secondly, this really bothered me (before I found this article):

https://screenrant.com/dark-knight-...tm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=zergnet_27180


If you don't have the time/desire to read, this sums it up:




I have to say that the opening of TDKR really deflated TDK for me, for this reason.


Thoughts?

1. DMs timeline is generally accepted but it has to be said there ARE contradictions you can pick on, however, this is simply indicative of the FACT that Nolan made these films one at a time, without a full 3 story arc fleshed out before hand.

They developed the story as they went along - therefore the inconsistencies are bourne out of that.

2. The messages are not contradictory at all. I've been meaning to put down my thoughts on this in a properly written out way, but haven't been able to do so yet, so what I give you below is a late night rambling email I wrote to jyecat yesterday lol) to give him my thoughts on the story arc of the trilogy (which should hopefully demonstrate why it's not contradictory).

Pardon the lack of structure in this, but hope you get something out of it.

My thoughts on the story arc:

Bruce is faced a trauma as a child and that pain has directed the course of his life, he creates a batman persona with the intention to give Gotham a symbol of hope, a symbol that represents the notion that they don't have to lie down and accept the corruption and evil around them in society - in fact if people stand together against it, evil and darkness will inevitably recede and be defeated - if one man can bring about so much change, then surely there is hope

In TDK we find that Bruce has been waging his war on crime for over a year now with good results, the mob has taken a beating but now they're desperate - they turn to a guy even they don't understand - you can see in the mob scene that they are not keen on hiring this madman. Eventually though Batman pushes them into a corner and they turn to joker as a last resort

Big mistake

Joker isn't in it for helping the mob, he's in it for causing maximum chaos, just for fun!

At this point Batman realises that he has to go deeper into his darkness and deeper into Batman to be able to deal with guys like this - but he's not sure that he wants to, not sure if he can - theres a line he doesn't want to cross - he doesn't want to break his one rule which seperates him from the madness he vows to fight against. At a point in TDK he even considers turning himself in because he's reached the limit.

Thing is Bruce never intended to be Batman for more than a little while until the mob was defeated, but by defeating the mob - due to escalation, he's created bigger monsters. So he's forced deeper into Batman

The only logical end to TDK given the fact that batman couldn't bring himself to killing joker, was that joker would win in some way. And he does. Except for the fact that Batman and Gordon decide that it's better to feed people a lie to keep their faith in the system (Harvey) than to let them know the truth - that the system is broken..

This is very important - the system is broken - at the end of TDK, rather than help the system heal by facing up to facts and reality, they were naive and tried to paper over it with Batman taking the fall

Then we come to TDKR - Bruce has even more pain he's been dealing with now, the parallel lie that Alfred fed him - that Rachel was going to wait for him - in the hope that somehow this would make Bruce feel better (same as the lie fed to Gotham about Harvey).

TDKR is therefore about facing the truth

A quick aside here - lines from ras in BB - 'do you still feel responsible for your parents death?' Bruce: 'my anger outweighs my guilt' then on the ice, Ras: 'you have learnt to bury your guilt with anger, I will teach to confront it and face the truth '

Now continuing - TDKR is about facing the truth. Bruce still thinks Rachel was going to wait for him, so he's unable to move on and heal - in parallel Gotham thinks Dent was a hero, but it's unable to truly get rid of the evil eating away at its core because the city hasn't faced the truth yet.

Bruce sees only one end for himself - death. 'you either die a hero - or you live long enough to see yourself become the villain'

Bruce has seen Batman become the villain but now he wants to die a hero and be done with it. He wants to go out there and face Bane knowing in his heart he's not ready for it. So he gets beat to ____ and even hopes to get killed by Bane ('why didn't you just kill me')

However, before this happened - Alfred told him the truth about Rachel, yet Bruce didn't believe it - and it forced Alfred to leave because of the clash they had. Bruce was still being stubborn on his idea of dying a hero and feeling sorry for himself - still letting his pain direct his life -not letting himself heal

Now coming back to his beating. Gets beaten gets tossed in the pit.

Now this pit is both a physical and a metaphorical one. He needs to learn to pick himself up again, he needs to confront his pain and overcome it, he needs to move past Rachel, he needs to rise and save Gotham

While he's in the pit what I gather is he recognises that what Alfred told him about Rachel choosing dent was the truth, he faces this, accepts it, and reassesses what he wants out of his life.

Meanwhile Bane tells Gotham the truth about Dent - this throws them into chaos with the prisoners being freed but finally Gotham can face the truth. You can never heal until you face the problem first. Bane could not have done Batman a bigger favour than this, that's the irony of it. Now Gotham no longer hates Batman - they realize he was the hero they need and deserve, and they need him now more than ever. They've faced the truth -now Gotham is ready to heal and to rise just as Bruce is.

So when Bruce embraces his fear of death, and confronts his pain (both physical which is healed by training and emotional
By dealing with the truth about Rachel), he's finally able to rise out of the pit

When he arrives in Gotham - the cops there are also mentally freed from the lie of the last 8 yrs so they're ready to rise

When we get to the end, Batman realizes this is his chance to die a true hero, and to immortalize the symbol of the Batman as a beacon of hope. Batman can be anyone he told Blake - and he meant it - batman is bigger than Bruce Wayne - Bruce is too old now, he realizes Alfred's words were true, he needs to now move on, he's faced up to his pain and trauma, it can now finally have a chance to heal.

That's what the ending is all about - the end of the arc is Bruce healing from his pain, and Batman rising (in 4 different ways) in the process.

I find it beautiful ... Poetic

 

[wofford29]

That screenrant article is dumb as ____. Not only does it not make sense in the context of the themes being contradictory, but the fact that the story arc wasn't even completed with TDK makes the article completely illogical.