The Dark Knight Rises *SPOILERS*

[Maglor]

What does being a fan of "those movies" have to do with being a fan of the character? This film was 100% Batman because Batman can literally be whatever the writer wants him to be. You agree with Fab because you both have the same boxes that must be ticked or else you're on suicide watch and cry foul about it "not being the character." I say bull****, not only do you miss the mark on artistic and literary interpretation of a fictitional character, but you're ridiculous blinders are part of the reason we end up with the same rehashed **** over and over again until someone comes along in either medium and says **** the posers I'm going to step out and I'm going to pull from themes and make my own story. It's no coincedence that when that's happened you get the best Bat creations out there.

Heated post, but damn... well said.



I remember now why I had unsubscribed from this thread.

So anything is acceptable, even if it's not "good"? Not sure I understand the logic there? What if they made Bane and Batman twin brothers, Or Batman was paralyzed from for the rest of his life, but the story was still crap? Is that still good?

You. Personally. Believe. It. To. Not. Be. Good. Savy?




Doesn't make it not good.

 

[Adolfo]

Very good posts Maglor...very good.....agreed....I also like the fact your rebuttles were less than a million words...LOL

 

[DiFabio]

You are stuck on a certain version of Batman.

Yeah, the one that was ESTABLISHED in Batman Begins and The Dark Knight.

You. Personally. Believe. It. To. Not. Be. Good. Savy?


Doesn't make it not good.

That's why it was in quotations. Perceptions and feelings may vary. My view isn't law. I'm not going to end every sentence I make in, "my opinion".

Some think it's good, some think it's not so good. There's varying reasons as to why some may think it's good or not good. None of them are invalid.

 

[Adolfo]

Yeah, the one that was ESTABLISHED in Batman Begins and The Dark Knight.

Is a person/character not allowed to change after an important event?...is emotion for some out there so bad and not allowed for this film to be good...It was a plus for me....events in life happen and cause change....I know personally from experience at least for myself I am not the same man since 2001...Batman and company you could say are in the boat and a change happened to them

 

[ZaCHw117]

Yeah, the one that was ESTABLISHED in Batman Begins and The Dark Knight.

Oh, you mean the one where Bruce wanted to retire in the second movie?

 

[DiFabio]

Oh, you mean the one where Bruce wanted to retire in the second movie?

Yeah, that one where a killer clown executed the love his life (the reason he wanted to retire) for the sole purpose of proving a point.

That movie.

TDKR answers this with, "well, he's been a hermit for the past 8 years because of this", but I've posted my views as to why that shouldn't fly before.

 

[ZaCHw117]

Yeah, that one where a killer clown executed his girl friend for the sole purpose of proving a point.

That movie.

To turn Harvey and show that everyone's values and morals have a dark side?

Cause it sure as hell wasn't to stop Batman from retiring.

 

[DiFabio]

To turn Harvey and show that everyone's values and morals have a dark side?

Cause it sure as hell wasn't to stop Batman from retiring.

Why are you loling?

Bruce's desire to retire stemmed from his desire of being with Rachel.

Rachel's dead.

 

[Adolfo]

Yeah, that one where a killer clown executed the love his life (the reason he wanted to retire) for the sole purpose of proving a point.

That movie.

TDKR answers this with, "well, he's been a hermit for the past 8 years because of this", but I've posted my views on all that before as to why that shouldn't fly.

Lose your love in your life and tell me what should fly...nonsense...again the gospel according to Difabio..Wil E Coyote Super Genius...Emotion vs just the facts please just doesnt cut it all the time...not for me anyway

 

[Njits]

*takes a peek* Oh, ****, carry on.

 

[Adolfo]

Why are you loling?

Bruce's desire to retire stemmed from his desire of being with Rachel.

Rachel's dead.

Rachel was big yes, but other emotional important factors/events throughout his life also came into play no doubt and they should not be dismissed

 

[Adolfo]

*takes a peek* Oh, ****, carry on.

WELL SAID!

 

[DiFabio]

Lose your love in your life and tell me what should fly...nonsense...again the gospel according to Difabio..Wil E Coyote Super Genius...Emotion vs just the facts please just doesnt cut it all the time...not for me anyway

Uh, this is the guy that couldn't let the death of his parents go when he was a child and a man and pursued a life of crime fighting? He didn't live a life of exile when Thomas and Martha were murdered in cold blood before his vary eyes. Going by this, shouldn't the death of Rachel drive the Batman persona even further?

Rachel was the last good thing from his childhood (besides Alfred). She was as equally as important to him as his parents were. She had his number too,



- Your real face is the one that criminals now fear. The man I loved, the man who vanished, he never came back at all. But maybe he's still out there, somewhere. Maybe some day, when Gotham no longer needs Batman, I'll see him again.


- But now I'm sure the day won't come when you no longer need Batman. I hope it does, and if it does I will be there, but as your friend. I'm sorry to let you down. If you lose your faith in me, please keep your faith in people. Love, now and always, Rachel.


That to me says, that Batman in the end of Begins and at the end of TDK is the dominant persona, like most interpretations. With Rachel out of the picture, one would think that the Bruce Wayne persona would be completely engulfed by Batman.



Instead TDKR has not only Batman dormant and non-active, but Bruce Wayne also. Neither one exists.

 

[Adolfo]

Uh, this is the guy that couldn't let the death of his parents go when he was a child or a man and pursued a life of crime fighting? He didn't live a life of exile when Thomas and Martha were murdered in cold blood before his vary eyes. Going by this, shouldn't the death of Rachel drive the Batman persona even further?

Rachel was the last good thing from his childhood (besides Alfred). She was as equally as important to him as his parents were. She had his number too,



- Your real face is the one that criminals now fear. The man I loved, the man who vanished, he never came back at all. But maybe he's still out there, somewhere. Maybe some day, when Gotham no longer needs Batman, I'll see him again.


- But now I'm sure the day won't come when you no longer need Batman. I hope it does, and if it does I will be there, but as your friend. I'm sorry to let you down. If you lose your faith in me, please keep your faith in people. Love, now and always, Rachel.


That to me says, that Batman in the end of Begins and at the end of TDK is the dominant persona, like most interpretations.

TDKR has not only Batman dormant and non-active, but Bruce Wayne also.

Again...things change sometimes...some guys have a breaking point...about time that Bruce wayne acted human(or at least became normal)and actually had a breaking point...Is that really hard for you to see here?...I understand you want him to be like you want him to be, but...sometimes ***** happens to change that

 

[ironwez20]

Again...things change sometimes...some guys have a breaking point...about time that Bruce wayne acted human(or at least became normal)and actually had a breaking point...Is that really hard for you to see here?...I understand you want him to be like you want him to be, but...sometimes ***** happens to change that

batman has no limits.

 

[CelticPredator]

You guys suck. I posted the greatest thing ever, and you dismiss it to talk about intelligent things.

 

[jye4ever]

You guys suck. I posted the greatest thing ever, and you dismiss it to talk about intelligent things.

I just enjoy seeing folks get frustrated by DiFabio.

 

[CelticPredator]

Not as much as this!

https://peopledyinglikemarioncotillard.tumblr.com/

 

[DiFabio]

Again...things change sometimes...some guys have a breaking point...about time that Bruce wayne acted human(or at least became normal)and actually had a breaking point...Is that really hard for you to see here?...I understand you want him to be like you want him to be, but...sometimes ***** happens to change that

Just saying that event in his life should have really made the Batman persona more evident. I mean, another loved one dying? That was a second breaking point. A breaking point of destroying any ideas of retirement or second guessing the mission. This isn't cancer, this is losing another loved one to CRIME and evil. What does Batman do? He fights those things.

They seemed to really be establishing that with Rachel's letter, the Joker's speech, Batman's questionable use of the sonar technology and finally the end. Batman takes on a whole new meaning as a dark hero. Everything points to Bruce getting "lost" in the monster but while still having enough will from crossing the line.

TDKR turns it on it's head. It rewrites it's meaning and importance by depicting him in a completely different light. Knowing that it would contradict the previous films' end, they use the 8 year gap and Harvey Dent Act as a sort of curtain cushion for the audiences to accept the change with open arms.

Pay no attention to the man (or Joker) behind the curtain. Focus on this alternate scenario with a hobbling, bearded Howard Hughes who used to be that famous character from 4 years ago.

 

[jye4ever]