The Dark Knight Rises *SPOILERS*

[jye4ever]

Threads suck 50% more w/o DiFabio.

DiFabio is like Listerine, fresher breath.

 

[K07]

I can't seem to find it. Maybe I just guessed it. I swore I read it somewhere.

But it makes sense, wouldn't it? Nolan did something completely different with this movie. He wanted to change it up. And so he did. He had every right too. Batman was his character at that point. And i'm glad it's over.

TDK is a drastically different style/tone from BB. It makes sense this one was different from both of them. Not trying to be antagonistic at all either. This read hasn't seen much debate lately and I'm not trying to stir the pot

 

[CelticPredator]

I am.

Bane is a ****oo head.

 

[K07]

I am.

Bane is a ****oo head.

Fawr yoooou.

 

[CelticPredator]

 

[Deckard]

[ame]https://youtu.be/1A3WEMPZJD8[/ame]

 

[jye4ever]

 

[batfan08]

I rewatched this on HBO with some friends and I still have all the same problems.

There are giant blatant continuity errors like when he stops the motorcyclist on the Pod and is being surrounded by cops. He turns the Pod to fire at the tow truck and the camera angle changes about 3-4 times during which the position of the injured Biker and his motorcycle changes each time, at one point he's just blatantly not in the shot because I guess they forgot, and then when he goes to take off, his bike is convienantly on the other side of the pod and now out of Batman's way to a straight jump. I guess it goes to shooting with Imax and not being able to get another take but this isn't the technical proficiant director I know at work.

The final police/merc fight is just riddled with problems everywhere you look. The obvious being in a hail of automatic weapons fire about 3 cops actually go down. Then you have this scene where like 100 cops are beating up another 100 inmates all extras, and you look around and none of it is convinving. I mean it is really really bad stuff that shouldn't have made it into a scyfy channel original let alone a Chris Nolan film. Theres literally a point where as Batman is walking through the crowd watching cops get the **** beaten out of them and he's behind the criminals and could literally just give them a quick punch in the back and turn the tide for like a good dozen cops that way as he's walking but he just looks around for Bane. Now he finally comes face to face with Bane and you have far and away the most awkward shot Chris Nolan has ever put in any of his movies anywhere. Batman is standing completely still telling Bane about why hes back and its a full shot of Batman down to his legs and his stance isn't like poised and ready or detirmined, he's just sort of wavering back and forth to the left and right a little and carelessly there like it's not even being shot and just a practice read through. And to make this like a million times worse, you have this cop punching a merc to his left and it's clear this guys stopping short his punches a good foot and a half of the mercs stomach whos reacting a few seconds too late because he can't tell when the cops gonna pull his fake punch. It's such a Brett Ratnet level of awfulness it's not even so bad it's funny funny.

There are weaknesses like that everywhere, most of the mains are completely out of character as a result of being rushed along
to this place where everything sort of feels like it's ending way too prematurely. Nolan tries so hard to convince us Batman is tired but it's the most contrite stupid stuff like legitimately awful amatuer film school looking hair dye on Bail's wings. He looks like Pauli from The Sopranos, it's way too obvious and unblended. And other desperate things like the doctor who tells us he's broken everywhere. This scenes like another complete joke right down to the famous comedian playing the doctor. And that's thrown out the window 10 mins later when he can kick through concrete walls, or break his back and still come back and climb a sheer rock face. The Robin character is the biggest bastardisation of comic material this genre but I won't even get into that. I'll just say I was an orphan and I can assure you that we can't i.d. one another via eye contact.

The end chase scene is so vanilla, even with the Bat involved it feels like we've seen it before and a way less fun and interesting version of the TDK's Big Rig chase which had far more interesting events play out like Batman blocking a missle with the Tumbler, The Pod reveal, the chopper going down, the game of chicken with the Truck and Pod. Here the only clever piece of writing like that is when he leads the missle back to the Tumbler that fired it at him. And the whole time Fox does his best impression of the guy from Begins who keeps reminding us the pressures gonna blow! Miranda's death is another funny joke, combined with the Gordon revelation which is way too obviously spelled out for audiences, combining a flashback with him physically saying Wayne's name outloud just in case some dumbass watching still couldn't put two and two togeather. And then you have Batman able to blow a hole in a building with missles big enough to fly through when the very same missles couldn't penetrate a truck windshield a minute earlier. Combine that with the completely brainless police force, including Gordon who we've seen has some sort of alzheimers now to have forgotten that he already knew Batman was Wayne in TDK. His story isn't even wrapped up properly to boot, we see him on the roof next to the Bat signal but why? Is he commisioner again now? Even after the letter and admitting all this was his fault? Batman, the Mayor, Harvey Dent, Bruce Wayne, and Bane are dead, the country and world are going to want somebody to blame and he admitted that he illegally put hundreds of men in jail and broke his own laws. There seems to literally be zero blowback for the only man still alive to answer for the entire 8 month hell disaster. And what about his family who were in the other 2 films? Did it cost him his wife and kids? We don't know at all. And that Orphan house X-Men ending, just wow. Hey 60 kids are running around Wayne Manor now, kids who love to explore every nook and cranny surely won't find any hidden entrances to the Batcave. You know the thing every criminal in Gotham would want to blow up and that sits right below where they all sleep and play.

All in all it's not the worst movie ever made or even a terrible movie by comic book standards but when I factor in that it's the same team(writing, cinematographer, actors, director) for all 3 then it just doesn't live upto the rest of what we got. Theres some great stuff in there but alot of it just feels sloppy and rushed to me. Nolan also got caught up in all the typical third act crap that people are sick of. I don't get this idea that things can only be a trilogy and the hero's story needs to wrap up by the end of 3. I thought we we're past that, especially with Marvel but they too look like they will now end on IM3 which is the exact same formula we've seen time and again. Heres hoping that Spiderman planning 4 movies right away like this will be able to avoid that curse. Sorry about the long rant.

6/10

For starters, it seems like the first three paragraphs of this post are just nitpicks after nitpicks, and, to be completely honest, I have no idea how things that minute could mean so much to someone, unless they were looking for something to be upset about. Bale's hair dye and an extra pulling a punch? Really? I'm just curious, did you pay the same kind of attention to the details in The Avengers? On that note, did you know that, as the shot changes when Bale is holding Ledger up against the wall in the TDK Interrogation scene, he is holding him up with his right arm, even though he put his left arm up against his neck before the switch?

As far as the John Blake is an orphan thing, you just answered your own question:

Except he is Robin. They call him it outright which is like a million times cornier than if it was the exact same story but his name was **** Grayson from the get go. Except than they wouldn't have that little "ohhhhh" retard reveal when that secretary awkwardly and forcifully calls him "Robin".

I get why it's sloppy because of Imax, but the overall story and being afraid to embrace your source material is where I lose repsect for Nolan. He thinks **** Grayson is silly but an M. Night Shamalayan twist gimmick isn't.

I guess the biggest wtf for me, is how the hell do you go from making Inception to this and honestly convince yourself his heart was completely in it?

John Blake is clearly an amalgam of the various Robins. He's a police officer, like Dlck Grayson, he grew up on the streets like Jason Todd, and he managed to figure out Batman's identity, like Tim Drake. That's why they didn't call him Dlck Grayson, because he is the embodiment of Robin as a character, not just the first one. I've always found the "magic orphan look" argument to be extremely short sighted. For someone who was complaining about the revelation to Gordon being too spoon fed to people, you aren't doing a very good job of looking at some of the subtler things. Maybe I'm wrong, but I interpreted Blake's "look" as him finding out that Bruce Wayne isn't who he appears to be, not that he is Batman.

We know from his character, and, even, his profession that he is clearly an intuitive individual. Why is it so difficult for people to read between the lines when it comes to the "orphan look?" Blake got a whiff, and he followed a trail. Coleman Reese showed us that it isn't particularly difficult to piece the puzzle together if you know where to find all of the pieces.

As for Gordon, I'll start with the family thing. For someone paying such close attention to how many extras should've gone down in a hail of gunfire, I'm a bit surprised that you missed the line in the first 15 minutes of the film in which the Congressman (whom Catwoman later kidnaps) tells Foley about how Gordon's wife divorced him and moved the kids to Cleveland. With that out of the way, let's talk about the other issues you had with Gordon's character.

As far as his "confession," let's remember where it came from. It was read to the public by Bane. A man who just blew up the mayor, most likely killed a bunch of professional athletes, trapped much of Gotham's police underground, brought a bomb into a packed football stadium, snapped a man's neck on national television, and, following his dramatic reading of "confessions" by Jim Gordon, blew up a prison and led all of the inmates in a war on Gotham. I don't know about you, but that would certainly cast a shadow of doubt on the case in my courtroom, if I were the judge. Particularly, if we couldn't even find the alleged confession letter.

As for Wayne Manor, I think it goes back to what Blake said about "the details depending on you." Bruce can no longer concentrate his philanthropic efforts, as he's supposed to be dead, and Wayne Enterprises still would be dealing with the blowback from Bane's stock market takeover. Donating his house would provide a home for those boys, and the utilities would no doubt be put into the hands of the city.

As far as the Robin revelation, I've already addressed that; he was the embodiment of Robin, not just Grayson. I'm not calling you out, or anything, I'm just offering a different perspective, for argument's sake.

 

[chewblacca]

This movie's been on HBO more than a few times. I got caught watching one night when nothing else was on the other 99 channels on my tv. I watched it once. I still think that Nolan went in the wrong direction. after Rachel was killed and the Joker was arrested Batman should of been everywhere. You shouldn't be able to jay walk without a bat shadow being on top of you. Then the remaining crime element in Gotham should get together and hire Bane to take him out. That would of been nice!

 

[jye4ever]

This movie's been on HBO more than a few times. I got caught watching one night when nothing else was on the other 99 channels on my tv. I watched it once. I still think that Nolan went in the wrong direction. after Rachel was killed and the Joker was arrested Batman should of been everywhere. You shouldn't be able to jay walk without a bat shadow being on top of you. Then the remaining crime element in Gotham should get together and hire Bane to take him out. That would of been nice!

He was too busy limping.........for 8 years.

That's 2 Presidential elections, enough time to get your PhD, have a child and watch them grow up until the 3rd grade.

He was limping..........for 8 years.

 

[chewblacca]

He was too busy limping.........for 8 years.

Yeah, what's up with that? And if his leg was so hurt how did he manage to scale that wall, and make that jump? I was so hoping that he would fall.

 

[crows]

This movie's been on HBO more than a few times. I got caught watching one night when nothing else was on the other 99 channels on my tv. I watched it once. I still think that Nolan went in the wrong direction. after Rachel was killed and the Joker was arrested Batman should of been everywhere. You shouldn't be able to jay walk without a bat shadow being on top of you. Then the remaining crime element in Gotham should get together and hire Bane to take him out. That would of been nice!

that sounds too much like Dark knight with Joker though, it would be a repeat.

I do like Bane, But I wish Nolan Never made Bruce retire. Specially when he was going to retire at the end anyways. He retired twice basically.

 

[batfan08]

This movie's been on HBO more than a few times. I got caught watching one night when nothing else was on the other 99 channels on my tv. I watched it once. I still think that Nolan went in the wrong direction. after Rachel was killed and the Joker was arrested Batman should of been everywhere. You shouldn't be able to jay walk without a bat shadow being on top of you. Then the remaining crime element in Gotham should get together and hire Bane to take him out. That would of been nice!

That's the thing, though. It's not just about Rachel. Batman took the rap for Dent. If he went back to busting heads, when he was accused of blowing them off, that would've raised some red flags and put Gordon at risk. The secret, for all intents and purposes, did work, and all that it accomplished, even if it was based on a lie, would've been undone far sooner than 8 years. It did come tumbling down, eventually, as we saw, but what's the better deal, here? The secret being discovered after a month with virtually no effects, other than some that were harmful to Jim Gordon, or the secret being discovered 8 years later. 8 years of peace in a city like Gotham is pretty good, when you think about it.

 

[Deckard]

For starters, it seems like the first three paragraphs of this post are just nitpicks after nitpicks, and, to be completely honest, I have no idea how things that minute could mean so much to someone, unless they were looking for something to be upset about. Bale's hair dye and an extra pulling a punch? Really? I'm just curious, did you pay the same kind of attention to the details in The Avengers? On that note, did you know that, as the shot changes when Bale is holding Ledger up against the wall in the TDK Interrogation scene, he is holding him up with his right arm, even though he put his left arm up against his neck before the switch?

They are not nitpicks, they are obvious technical errors and serious problems, the extras aren't buried way back in the background somewhere behind 30 other guys, they are standing right next to Batman and the only thing in the scene moving so they draw your eye right to them and you realise they look like two 5 years olds playing cops and robbers. Watch it and see for yourself. Nitpics are in fact the opposite, like what I think of Blake which is why I didn't even go into that.

As far as the John Blake is an orphan thing, you just answered your own question:



John Blake is clearly an amalgam of the various Robins. He's a police officer, like Dlck Grayson, he grew up on the streets like Jason Todd, and he managed to figure out Batman's identity, like Tim Drake. That's why they didn't call him Dlck Grayson, because he is the embodiment of Robin as a character, not just the first one. I've always found the "magic orphan look" argument to be extremely short sighted. For someone who was complaining about the revelation to Gordon being too spoon fed to people, you aren't doing a very good job of looking at some of the subtler things. Maybe I'm wrong, but I interpreted Blake's "look" as him finding out that Bruce Wayne isn't who he appears to be, not that he is Batman.

We know from his character, and, even, his profession that he is clearly an intuitive individual. Why is it so difficult for people to read between the lines when it comes to the "orphan look?" Blake got a whiff, and he followed a trail. Coleman Reese showed us that it isn't particularly difficult to piece the puzzle together if you know where to find all of the pieces.

As for Gordon, I'll start with the family thing. For someone paying such close attention to how many extras should've gone down in a hail of gunfire, I'm a bit surprised that you missed the line in the first 15 minutes of the film in which the Congressman (whom Catwoman later kidnaps) tells Foley about how Gordon's wife divorced him and moved the kids to Cleveland. With that out of the way, let's talk about the other issues you had with Gordon's character.

Nope. They are not divorced or at least it is not stated that way which I would take as intentional, she simply "took off with the children". So they are married the entire time Gotham is under seige and he is trapped their after she thinks he's hospitalised and sees cops being murdered on the news and yet there is no resolution. But forget her, what about the kids? Mommy and Daddy fought so you can never see daddy again. No phone calls from a character worthy of screen time and a major plot device (kidnapped by Dent) that was part of the reason Batman left for 8 years to ask if Daddy was ok? Poor, rushed writing.


As far as his "confession," let's remember where it came from. It was read to the public by Bane. A man who just blew up the mayor, most likely killed a bunch of professional athletes, trapped much of Gotham's police underground, brought a bomb into a packed football stadium, snapped a man's neck on national television, and, following his dramatic reading of "confessions" by Jim Gordon, blew up a prison and led all of the inmates in a war on Gotham. I don't know about you, but that would certainly cast a shadow of doubt on the case in my courtroom, if I were the judge. Particularly, if we couldn't even find the alleged confession letter.


As for Wayne Manor, I think it goes back to what Blake said about "the details depending on you." Bruce can no longer concentrate his philanthropic efforts, as he's supposed to be dead, and Wayne Enterprises still would be dealing with the blowback from Bane's stock market takeover. Donating his house would provide a home for those boys, and the utilities would no doubt be put into the hands of the city.

As far as the Robin revelation, I've already addressed that; he was the embodiment of Robin, not just Grayson. I'm not calling you out, or anything, I'm just offering a different perspective, for argument's sake.
I'm not unfamilar with Batman, you don't have to explain to me what they did with his character. I just think it's kinda stupid and I can reinforce that with the writing like his name actually being Robin. Is the implication that if they ever fought crime togeather now, they'd be Batman and Robin and he would use his first name as his alias because that seems to go way against what Bruce is telling him the entire film. It's like if the news covered the Justice League saving Metropolis and referred to them as Bruce, Clark, and Jon. Theres no indication he would take up the name Batman or Nightwing and every indication he would probably go with the name of Robin or else that line is truely pointless.

..........

 

[intothevoid]

I'm not unfamilar with Batman, you don't have to explain to me what they did with his character. I just think it's kinda stupid and I can reinforce that with the writing like his name actually being Robin. Is the implication that if they ever fought crime togeather now, they'd be Batman and Robin and he would use his first name as his alias because that seems to go way against what Bruce is telling him the entire film. It's like if the news covered the Justice League saving Metropolis and referred to them as Bruce, Clark, and Jon. Theres no indication he would take up the name Batman or Nightwing and every indication he would probably go with the name of Robin or else that line is truely pointless.

LOL there is EVERY indication he is the next Batman.

Batman is a symbol. Robin Blake is just the next incarnation. If you didn't understand that, you pretty much didn't understand the story arc of Bruce Wayne.

There's NO suggestion he would take up the mantle as 'Robin'. Naming him John Blake for the course of the film was just a way to keep his role in the film and the possible ending of the film secret. Had they cast him as Tim Drake or **** Grayson it'd be a dead giveaway what the ending was going to be.

And they would never fight crime together. Bruce is done. Robin is the new Batman like I said. Ties up things perfectly.

 

[thundergod]

Never say exactly about your own post. Dat's taboo.

I don't know about "taboo" or not , but the "exactly" was a mistake ! I actually meant to put something else !

 

[Deckard]

LOL there is EVERY indication he is the next Batman.

Batman is a symbol. Robin Blake is just the next incarnation. If you didn't understand that, you pretty much didn't understand the story arc of Bruce Wayne.

There's NO suggestion he would take up the mantle as 'Robin'. Naming him John Blake for the course of the film was just a way to keep his role in the film and the possible ending of the film secret. Had they cast him as Tim Drake or **** Grayson it'd be a dead giveaway what the ending was going to be.

And they would never fight crime together. Bruce is done. Robin is the new Batman like I said. Ties up things perfectly.

I get it just fine. Batman wanted someone to take up the mantle in TDK. But that's before he's disgraced and gives up or straight up dies publicly and is commemorated in statue form. IMO Blake would take up that mantle as Gotham's protector but there is no actual indication he would call himself Batman. The same way Harvey Dent wouldn't start referring to himself as Batman if that had worked out. The fact that he is referred to so blatantly as Robin tells me he'll likely call himself that. She even says something like "you should use that name" to him as he walks out. So that's just the way I personally see it, he passed on the mantle to what would become Robin. Batman and then Robin, and you don't know for a fact Bruce would never ever come back. He's still very young and clearly the nonsense about his body being broken was just that nonsense since he managed to recover from a broken back, climb a 90 degree angle, and beat Bane which he couldn't do before. So he's in fact stronger than ever it would seem. And that's my point all along was they couldn't call him **** Grayson or Jason Todd or Tim Drake why? Because it'd ruin the gimmick that works the one first time you watch it and never again. M. Night would be proud.

And in that the end is actually open to interpretation in a few ways, heres what I really prefer to pretend happens after the credits role.

Blake has found the cave and is excited but he also still thinks Bruce is dead and gone. So being the "hot head" he is he suits up right there and then with no idea that Bruce could even come back and help him train further as an option the fanboys love to put out because Bruce is still on Vacation in france. And so is Alfred. But Gotham is still in bad shape because of all the dead cops and the rest being malnourished. Plus Gotham's roads are a wreck so it'd be hard to get around and alot of the Blackgate criminals would still be lose. So he suits up and goes out but he doesn't have the necassary training so he jumps off a roof and lands in the midst of a dozen thugs. He slowly begins to rise to deliver his first "I'm Batman"(or Robin or knowing him "Hey I'm John Blake!") but before he gets it out he's beaten to death by them with lead pipes. Bruce sees it and comes back and is Batman again the end.

 

[K07]

Of all of Deckard's issues with the film, I am in total agreement about the name "Robin" at the end. It's dumb. It's bad. It's just plain cheesy. The motorcycle helmet in BF was more subtle and grounded in reality. If I could change one thing from the whole film, it's be that name reveal at the end.... Batman fans understood who he represented. He didn't need that name "Robin." Maybe his name should have been Rob Blake and when he went to get that stuff, the lady should have clarified "Rob N. Blake?" It's sad when a corny proposal like that sounds better than what we got....

Anyways, that's just a nitpick.

 

[EVILFACE]

"All right boys, it's a wrap." - Christopher Nolan

 

[K07]

That doesn't bother me as much as it does other people. It makes for a funny Internet joke but when I saw the film the first few times, I didn't even think anything of her death.