I absolutely loved this movie. I'm a real sucker for dragons so I might be a little biased. The whole interaction between Smaug and Bilbo was easily one of the coolest things I have ever seen in a movie. PJ could have literally made that into a 3 hour movie, and I would of watched the hell out of it. Smaug has to be the greatest realization of a dragon in film and I honestly can't wait to see this again.
The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug
- Thread starter The Josh
- Start date
Help Support Collector Freaks Forum:
Centurion
Super Freak
Biojex
Super Freak
- Joined
- Aug 25, 2008
- Messages
- 23,682
- Reaction score
- 173
Just got back. Holy crap...Smaug was brilliant. One of the best CGI characters in a while.
Here is something that is has me worried. Now I am not sure what direction the third film is going in and I don't know about Tolkien's appendices but
Can anyone more familiar with the books explain?? Or is this all PJ made up BS??
Here we have Gandalf going face to face with Sauron but in FOTR Gandalf acts like life is so Hunky Dory. He seems surprised that Sauron might be coming back. I mean it was just 60 years ago he was face to face with the Great Eye Unless they pull a Star Wars and wipe his memory clean he in know way reacts like he should in FOTR... He knows about Bilbo's Ring.... I mean I would think that Ring would really make him nervous with Sauron being so close to coming back.
Basically I just don't think it adds up.
Basically I just don't think it adds up.
Can anyone more familiar with the books explain?? Or is this all PJ made up BS??
Where in DOS does Gandalf know about the ring?
OK I am going to have to go back and read again because it seems someone has already asked the same question and there may be some answers out there.
He does not..... But at some point between the beginning of the third film and FOTR he knows about it.
As far as i know he don't know about it till FOTR when Bilbo pulls his disappearing act. Am i missing something?
Watch FOTR again when Gandalf tells Bilbo to leave the ring behind.... He seems familiar with the fact that Bilbo has owned a "Ring of Power" There was no.... Where did you get that???
No. He knew he had a "magic" ring. Wasn't sure it was the ring of power. Remember he had to throw it into the fire to figure out what it really was.
Agree 100%..... They seems to only think there is a Shadow and a theat... Not that the Ruler of the One Ring is back.
My wife asked the same question when the film ended.... Here Gandalf knows about a growing Orc army and the return of Sauron yet he is lighting fireworks and smoking Old Toby....
Well that make him the dumbest Wizard in Middle Earth... Here you know that Sauron is trying to come back and that Bilbo found a Ring of Power.... Yet....... He does not become suspicious until he sees how Bilbo acts...... Calling it his Precious... Which he already knows that Gollum called it.. (It has been called that before).
Again I Love LOTR and very much enjoyed the first Hobbit film and thought the 2nd was still good.... So I am not trying to pick the films apart... But I am worried that PJ is walking into some.. "How come Ben did not know who R2 and 3PO were" territory.
I liked how it ended... One of my biggest gripes about TTT is that everything ends all happy... The people of Middle earth should be at an all time low... Not just won the battle.... FOTR ended much better giving us the feeling that all is lost.... A more Empire Strikes Back ending if you will.
Well Gandalf should have had more then General Knowledge.. And like I said before he should have been a little more suspicious of the Ring Bilbo had.... I mean Sauron is attempting to return and a Ring of Power just happens to show up.
I hope PJ makes this all make sense in the third film.. Something like this can make ruin some of my enjoyment of the LOTR films and I will have to try and ignore all this made up stuff.
Heres some "expert" answers to the ring deal
Alchir said: He didnt know it was the one ring till frodo was about 50(in the books) he had some suspisions but saruman fooled him saying it was lost forever in a meeting of the white council and he let the matter be when bilbo just gets the ring thinking it was one of the lesser rings, only when bilbo got ****ed up in the head when he tried to leave the ring behind before going to rivendell did gandalf start to have suspicions again and started to investigate, it took him about 17 years to learn the truth.
https://www.thetolkienforum.com/sho...did-Gandalf-take-so-long-to-identify-the-Ring
Alchir said: He didnt know it was the one ring till frodo was about 50(in the books) he had some suspisions but saruman fooled him saying it was lost forever in a meeting of the white council and he let the matter be when bilbo just gets the ring thinking it was one of the lesser rings, only when bilbo got ****ed up in the head when he tried to leave the ring behind before going to rivendell did gandalf start to have suspicions again and started to investigate, it took him about 17 years to learn the truth.
https://www.thetolkienforum.com/sho...did-Gandalf-take-so-long-to-identify-the-Ring
Like I said in the post above.... This would make him the dumbest Wizard in Middle earth.... He should have more of a suspicion then just Bilbo getting angry and calling it Precious.... Gandalf acts like that is a clue that tips him off.... yet he knows how Bilbo got the ring and the story of Bilbo and Gollum..
Those seem like weak answers... Are they basing it on the books or just the movies??... Saruman "fooled" Gandalf? Was saruman on his way to being evil at this time... I mean..... the Ring of Power can only be destroyed in Mt Doom... Why would anyone believe that it had been lost forever??
I would have no issue with Gandalf not thinking the Ring was anything other then a Ring f Power.... If he had not just 60 years ago delt with Sauron...
Like I said he in no way behaves like someone should with the knowledge that Sauron is trying to or has come back.
I just went to the page you linked and there seems to be some problems with Tolkien's logic (per them not me)
But I can accept all of it.... If Gandalf does not know for certain that Sauron is back. And that seems to be a PJ movie thing.... Not a book thing.
From the site you posted
Gandalf to Frodo:
" Let me see - it was in the year that the White Council drove the dark power from Mirkwood, just before the Battle of Five Armies, that Bilbo found his ring. A shadow fell on my heart then, but I did not know yet what I feared. I wondered often how Gollum came by a Great Ring, as plainly it was "
So right from the start (2941) Gandalf rules out the lesser rings. Its therefore either one of the 7, or its the One. The 7 are supposedly all accounted for, although we never here the full story. So lets assume they are an outside chance.
Many years later, he and Aragorn spend years looking for Gollum, to try and get some gen on the origin of the ring. Without success.
Gandalf at the Council of Elrond:
"And then again in my despair I thought again of a test that might make the finding of Gollum unnecessary. The ring itself might tell if it were the One. The memory of words at the Council came back to me: words of Saruman, half-heeded at the time. I heard them now clearly in my heart.
"The Nine the Seven and the Three," he said, had each their proper gem. Not so the One. It was round and unadorned, as it were one of the lesser rings; but its maker had set marks upon it that the skill, maybe, could still see and read."
This suggests Gandalf hadn't been paying attention in class. He has only to spot the absence of a gem, to know its not one of the 7, and therefore it is the One. This meeting of the White Council is probably 2953 (the last one, where Saruman asserts the Ring has rolled into the sea).
It then takes 48 years for Gandalf to 'suspect' according to Appendix B. His suspicion is aroused by Bilbo's longevity, and unwillingness to relinquish the ring. He starts to do something in 3001: the search for Gollum.
The hunt for Gollum takes 16 years. In 3017 Gandalf talks to Gollum and reads Isildur's scroll.
He arrives in Hobbiton in April 3018 and throws the ring into Frodo's fire. Now he knows with absolute certainty.
Lets all pause for a moment and admire the thoroughness of Gandalf's research..... before noting that a bit of logic and paying attention at the White Council would have got him to the same conclusion fully 65 years earlier.
Gandalf Greymantle, not Gandalf Greymatter.
So again this seems to be a bit of an issue in the books.... Made a 1000 times worse by the fact that Gandalf does a bit of a battle with Sauron.
Gandalf to Frodo:
" Let me see - it was in the year that the White Council drove the dark power from Mirkwood, just before the Battle of Five Armies, that Bilbo found his ring. A shadow fell on my heart then, but I did not know yet what I feared. I wondered often how Gollum came by a Great Ring, as plainly it was "
So right from the start (2941) Gandalf rules out the lesser rings. Its therefore either one of the 7, or its the One. The 7 are supposedly all accounted for, although we never here the full story. So lets assume they are an outside chance.
Many years later, he and Aragorn spend years looking for Gollum, to try and get some gen on the origin of the ring. Without success.
Gandalf at the Council of Elrond:
"And then again in my despair I thought again of a test that might make the finding of Gollum unnecessary. The ring itself might tell if it were the One. The memory of words at the Council came back to me: words of Saruman, half-heeded at the time. I heard them now clearly in my heart.
"The Nine the Seven and the Three," he said, had each their proper gem. Not so the One. It was round and unadorned, as it were one of the lesser rings; but its maker had set marks upon it that the skill, maybe, could still see and read."
This suggests Gandalf hadn't been paying attention in class. He has only to spot the absence of a gem, to know its not one of the 7, and therefore it is the One. This meeting of the White Council is probably 2953 (the last one, where Saruman asserts the Ring has rolled into the sea).
It then takes 48 years for Gandalf to 'suspect' according to Appendix B. His suspicion is aroused by Bilbo's longevity, and unwillingness to relinquish the ring. He starts to do something in 3001: the search for Gollum.
The hunt for Gollum takes 16 years. In 3017 Gandalf talks to Gollum and reads Isildur's scroll.
He arrives in Hobbiton in April 3018 and throws the ring into Frodo's fire. Now he knows with absolute certainty.
Lets all pause for a moment and admire the thoroughness of Gandalf's research..... before noting that a bit of logic and paying attention at the White Council would have got him to the same conclusion fully 65 years earlier.
Gandalf Greymantle, not Gandalf Greymatter.
So again this seems to be a bit of an issue in the books.... Made a 1000 times worse by the fact that Gandalf does a bit of a battle with Sauron.
This made for an interesting read...
https://www.unleashthefanboy.com/editorial/does-gandalf-fight-sauron-in-the-hobbit-trailer/22742
Sound like PJ is doing a lot of tinkering but perhaps it will make more sense in the third film. Meaning... It's not really Sauron. Perhaps a trick?? Yet a pretty great trick pulled off by a Dwarf.
https://www.unleashthefanboy.com/editorial/does-gandalf-fight-sauron-in-the-hobbit-trailer/22742
Sound like PJ is doing a lot of tinkering but perhaps it will make more sense in the third film. Meaning... It's not really Sauron. Perhaps a trick?? Yet a pretty great trick pulled off by a Dwarf.
TheProcrastinator
Super Freak
I haven't seen the movie yet, but isn't it obvious that haggard figure Gandalf's fighting against is simply crazed Thrain?
There's even official merchendise about that guy.
There's even official merchendise about that guy.
Last edited:
Irvy
Super Freak
Most of the set pieces in this were like watching cutscenes from a game, the last battle with Smaug should have had some button hammering quicktime events 
TheProcrastinator
Super Freak
I actually like the color enhanced look of these films. It fits the more "fairy tale" nature of The Hobbit, in a way. Though I do agree that Jackson is showing an over reliance on cgi.
Similar threads
