The Mandalorian (Star Wars Live Action Series)

[ironwez20]

I would say the words from the actor who played the role might be a bit more believable then a guy who does youtube videos and makes claims from sources and then reminds us they are all rumors. I have not seen the comments Jye is talking about.. I did read that the actor is open to coming back.. Something some people said he would never do. Its all about the $$$$ baby.


Either way.. I believe nothing till its announced by Disney.


Popcorn planet said that Disney is looking at making a Luke series that takes place during the Mandalorian timeline... And the Grogu will return much later but he will return..

That is all rumor also... But he seems more level headed the Doomcock. Plus other entertainment sites seem to run with his scoops... So he might have some inside info.. He called out what's her face fro trying to say there was issues on Mandno and the main actor.


Ahhhhhh SW Rumors.. Nothing better to get SW fans going at each others throats.

I mean doomcock is crazy . It?s just khev in a mask driven crazy by how crap the ST was so he?s pulling a fight club. I thought we confirmed this as canon?

 

[Khev]

My contentions have always been that I expect that character arc from George R. R. Martin, not Star Wars.

See what you call "Game of Thrones" I simply call the promise of ESB. I loved ROTJ when it came out but when I later learned of the expanded bittersweet war with main characters like Han and/or Lando dying tragically at the end I always felt a bit robbed by what we ended up with. George went positively "Walt Disney" with this entire galactic civil war being wrapped up in a tidy bow with zero tragedies at the end capped off by teddy bears and a dance party.

Now granted, nothing ever has to go to either extreme and there are indeed levels of tragedy or "Game of Thrones" style content that I too would say is "going too far" (Luke turning evil and not being redeemed, gratuitous violence, nudity, etc.) but they didn't cross my lines with the ST. They just gave me a bittersweet finale with some genuine twists and turns that had real emotional punch. Sure there were some bumps along the way with certain characters, situations, and designs but everything that was important *to me* they hit out of the park.

 

[ajp4mgs]

We have no argument as to their end, Khev. Disney gave them 'heroic' deaths as they were cynically disposing of their characters to make way for Disney Wars.

But that breakdown shows miserable lives and their inability to prevent the deaths of billions, their friends, their families, or even the opportunity to enjoy victory.

Obi Wan and Yoda were mentors and plot devices in the OT, they weren't protagonists. Who cares if they died defeated? Somebody had to, along with all the Red Shirts.


My contentions have always been that I expect that character arc from George R. R. Martin, not Star Wars. That Disney ****ed it all up via a combination of greed, real-world constraints (old actors), lack of planning and extraordinarily poor writing. I even allow that the ST in this day and age was almost guaranteed to be a fool's errand, they were almost painted into a corner from the start.

Some fans tie themselves in knots to give them a pass, to keep enjoying more Star Wars. Some fans just accept it and roll with it. I see it as a load of crap.

Han, Luke and Leia cleaned up the mess of the past generation by Return of the Jedi. They won at great personal cost.

Then the Mouse wanted cash so they ****ed them. All of them.

I know that you've remarked about how you tried to come up with a sequel scenario that played out better than the ST and found it difficult. Is it your contention that ROTJ's happily-ever-after ending means that sequels should never be attempted? Or do you think a happily-ever-after Luke, Leia, and Han is still compatible with a sequel conflict that threatens them without making them look like they failed to allow another threat in the first place?

 

[a-dev]

I know that you've remarked about how you tried to come up with a sequel scenario that played out better than the ST and found it difficult. Is it your contention that ROTJ's happily-ever-after ending means that sequels should never be attempted? Or do you think a happily-ever-after Luke, Leia, and Han is still compatible with a sequel conflict that threatens them without making them look like they failed to allow another threat in the first place?

The 'legends' EU seemed to be doing alright with it - granted, those books had the benefit of not having to work with 70 year old actors.

So my contention - and I know I'm channeling South Park's Captain Hindsight here - would be that it was already way too late, shoulda just left it alone. Pay Hamill, Ford and Fisher for the use of their likenesses/voices for hypothetical endeavors such as we've just seen in Mandalorian.

 

[Khev]

I mean I *hate* Khev but I'd get drunk with him and talk Star Wars anytime.

Exclusive footage of me and ZE_501 after watching the season finale of Mandalorian, lol.

 

[hellgrammite00]

See what you call "Game of Thrones" I simply call the promise of ESB. I loved ROTJ when it came out but when I later learned of the expanded bittersweet war with main characters like Han and/or Lando dying tragically at the end I always felt a bit robbed by what we ended up with. George went positively "Walt Disney" with this entire galactic civil war being wrapped up in a tidy bow with zero tragedies at the end capped off by teddy bears and a dance party.

This. ROTJ has not aged well at all to me. It carries good-will from the previous 2 movies, but it basically is a fusion between PT and ST. Lucas I think would defend this as saying having Han Solo die would not be ideal in a kids movie....but the Phantom Menace spends chunks of the movie talking about treaties and political shenanigans.

ROTJ has some great scenes, but they are filled inbetween by some really boring and weird choices. THIS is probably why the first movie had to be edited multiple times and creatively restructured.

The behind the scenes for the Phantom Menace are telling as well. I love it when Lucas realizes the movie needs some work, but can't be edited well because of how over-lapped things were. Great documentary.

 

[jye4ever]

One just has to look at real life conflicts to show the rebirth of old threats because of complacency.

While it doesn?t erase past heroic events one hopes that braver and wiser people will step up to confront these old new threats head on.

Just because the old threat is new again does it mean the accomplishments from the prior conflict should be erased from history.

 

[abake]

I think Lucas is the kind of guy who hates it when people tell him what he should do... like, "Oh, you think we should make the final film more grown up and dark? Hold my beer while I make it even more kid-friendly!" or, "Oh, you think I should do the prequels about a grown up Anakin killing Jedis? Hold my beer while I make movies about little kids and teenagers!".

Never tell George what to do...

 

[hellgrammite00]

I think Lucas is the kind of guy who hates it when people tell him what he should do... like, "Oh, you think we should make the final film more grown up and dark? Hold my beer while I make it even more kid-friendly!" or, "Oh, you think I should do the prequels about a grown up Anakin killing Jedis? Hold my beer while I make movies about little kids and teenagers!".

Never tell George what to do...

If you watch the behind the scenes of Prequels, you see a guy that has a bunch of yes-men, at least when it comes to story. He did not ask nor receive criticism. I mean yes he didn't like anybody telling him what to do, but he literately is lucasfilms. He believed he did not need to solicit advice.

 

[a-dev]

I think Lucas is the kind of guy who hates it when people tell him what he should do... like, "Oh, you think we should make the final film more grown up and dark? Hold my beer while I make it even more kid-friendly!" or, "Oh, you think I should do the prequels about a grown up Anakin killing Jedis? Hold my beer while I make movies about little kids and teenagers!".

Never tell George what to do...

 

[ZE_501]

I know that you've remarked about how you tried to come up with a sequel scenario that played out better than the ST and found it difficult. Is it your contention that ROTJ's happily-ever-after ending means that sequels should never be attempted? Or do you think a happily-ever-after Luke, Leia, and Han is still compatible with a sequel conflict that threatens them without making them look like they failed to allow another threat in the first place?

Good questions.

Hang on, gonna pour a Scotch...

Sequels can certainly be attempted; art of any type, even mass-market entertainment, *should* take risks. In this case, a sequel trilogy was in and of itself a risk, and then came (IMO) a strange combination of risk aversion (ANH re-hash) and reckless tinkering (TLJ) without a plan or respect for the fiction that came before.

I think your latter point is possible. Displaying heroes who have fulfilled their destiny, providing guidance and hope to a new generation facing a new kind of threat.

Yoda was pivotal to the OT, but he never left Dagobah.

Your elderly father may not be able to help you lift that couch anymore, but he can tell you how to do it without wrecking your back.

That would have set up certain challenges. For example, when you put Luke Skywalker on the screen, fans only want to look at him and expect him to save the day. But if Disney had the hubris to make our heroes miserable and grant them pyrrhic victories, to allow Johnson to 'subvert expectations' in the fashion that he did, then surely they could have had the minerals to instead set up the heroes as guides and helpers without rendering their greatest accomplishments undone and their lives as miserable as Jyn Erso's albeit longer?

Setting aside charges of 'agendas' and poor writing and lack of planning, some of which are debatable, others less so -- what I see is a profound lack of respect for what made the OT great. The people in that writer's room weren't fans, no matter what anyone tells you.

Where others saw a legacy, they saw inconvenience.

 

[a-dev]

Sigh. Anyone I want to give rep to anymore ''you must spread reputation around before...''

 

[hellgrammite00]

Setting aside charges of 'agendas' and poor writing and lack of planning, some of which are debatable, others less so -- what I see is a profound lack of respect for what made the OT great. The people in that writer's room weren't fans, no matter what anyone tells you.

Where others saw a legacy, they saw inconvenience.

The original SW is kind of a beautiful thing. You take a vision that is a melting pot of different influences, great special effects and editors who could make it all into a sensible thing. You lose one of those and we have a lesser movie. The movie by the end comes full circle. Characters are developed with solid arcs.

ESB is an even greater fluke. You take a story, and put it into the hands of guys not in love with Star Wars. But they know how to film and edit a movie. An unnecessary sequel that arguably exceeds its predecessor as a brilliant movie. It has no right to be a great movie, and it somehow pulls it off. An unplanned sequel that delivers.

ROTJ is....not really these things. It is a movie where the creativity and sharp filmmaking aspects start developing holes. It starts feeling a bit forced. But as a wrap up to 2 great movies we let thing slide.

Most everything afterwards Star Wars related starts getting far worse. It becomes about a product, and some aspect of the filmmaking suffers.

 

[JAWS]

I mean doomcock is crazy . It?s just khev in a mask driven crazy by how crap the ST was so he?s pulling a fight club. I thought we confirmed this as canon?

See what you call "Game of Thrones" I simply call the promise of ESB. I loved ROTJ when it came out but when I later learned of the expanded bittersweet war with main characters like Han and/or Lando dying tragically at the end I always felt a bit robbed by what we ended up with. George went positively "Walt Disney" with this entire galactic civil war being wrapped up in a tidy bow with zero tragedies at the end capped off by teddy bears and a dance party.

Now granted, nothing ever has to go to either extreme and there are indeed levels of tragedy or "Game of Thrones" style content that I too would say is "going too far" (Luke turning evil and not being redeemed, gratuitous violence, nudity, etc.) but they didn't cross my lines with the ST. They just gave me a bittersweet finale with some genuine twists and turns that had real emotional punch. Sure there were some bumps along the way with certain characters, situations, and designs but everything that was important *to me* they hit out of the park.

I have said this before.. I think SW is always a little sad.. The PT is a tragedy, Ben dies, Empire is a downer, I always feel a bit sad at the end of ROTJ. Vader's death and Luke always seems a bit sad at the end.. Of course the ST is filled with tragedy. Its "Epic" storytelling. There is good and there is bad.. Tragedy is very important to this type of storytelling.

IDK the tragedy works for me. Could it have been handled better.. Yep without question!

 

[ajp4mgs]

Good questions.

Hang on, gonna pour a Scotch...

Sequels can certainly be attempted; art of any type, even mass-market entertainment, *should* take risks. In this case, a sequel trilogy was in and of itself a risk, and then came (IMO) a strange combination of risk aversion (ANH re-hash) and reckless tinkering (TLJ) without a plan or respect for the fiction that came before.

I think your latter point is possible. Displaying heroes who have fulfilled their destiny, providing guidance and hope to a new generation facing a new kind of threat.

Yoda was pivotal to the OT, but he never left Dagobah.

Your elderly father may not be able to help you lift that couch anymore, but he can tell you how to do it without wrecking your back.

That would have set up certain challenges. For example, when you put Luke Skywalker on the screen, fans only want to look at him and expect him to save the day. But if Disney had the hubris to make our heroes miserable and grant them pyrrhic victories, to allow Johnson to 'subvert expectations' in the fashion that he did, then surely they could have had the minerals to instead set up the heroes as guides and helpers without rendering their greatest accomplishments undone and their lives as miserable as Jyn Erso's albeit longer?

Setting aside charges of 'agendas' and poor writing and lack of planning, some of which are debatable, others less so -- what I see is a profound lack of respect for what made the OT great. The people in that writer's room weren't fans, no matter what anyone tells you.

Where others saw a legacy, they saw inconvenience.

So, creating (or accepting, even perhaps enjoying) the portrayal of these characters as done with the ST makes those people (both creators and audience) unsuited to be called fans.

Okay then. Good to know.

 

[ZE_501]

I was compiling a response to that same post in another tab but you've just said it better than I was managing. Agreed with all.

Has anyone ever pointed out that George R.R Martin's initials sound an awful lot like the word Grim....that's the set-up of the Disney ST. As you say, some people liked that, a great many didn't.

Sometimes I think I'm talking to myself.

I mean doomcock is crazy . It?s just khev in a mask driven crazy by how crap the ST was so he?s pulling a fight club. I thought we confirmed this as canon?

See what you call "Game of Thrones" I simply call the promise of ESB. I loved ROTJ when it came out but when I later learned of the expanded bittersweet war with main characters like Han and/or Lando dying tragically at the end I always felt a bit robbed by what we ended up with. George went positively "Walt Disney" with this entire galactic civil war being wrapped up in a tidy bow with zero tragedies at the end capped off by teddy bears and a dance party.

Similar to Jye, when I think of Star Wars I'm thinking first and foremost of ANH/ESB. ROTJ got a pass from me because I was a child, but it's hard to deal with now.

While I didn't need Han to die, I think that Luke walking away as a haunted, war-weary 'lone-gunslinger' (lone lightsaber wielder?) figure would have been enough. They could have ended it on that bittersweet note, open-ended, with mystery and the same sense of expansive loneliness that Tattooine had in ANH (before it became 'Cheers') ... just a little restraint, just a little haunting.

Now granted, nothing ever has to go to either extreme and there are indeed levels of tragedy or "Game of Thrones" style content that I too would say is "going too far" (Luke turning evil and not being redeemed, gratuitous violence, nudity, etc.) but they didn't cross my lines with the ST. They just gave me a bittersweet finale with some genuine twists and turns that had real emotional punch. Sure there were some bumps along the way with certain characters, situations, and designs but everything that was important *to me* they hit out of the park.

Fair enough, I won't be changing your mind. But refer to my post about what happened in the writer's room. I think they lacked respect and it shows.

Exclusive footage of me and ZE_501 after watching the season finale of Mandalorian, lol.

[...]

...accurate.

One just has to look at real life conflicts to show the rebirth of old threats because of complacency.

While it doesn?t erase past heroic events one hopes that braver and wiser people will step up to confront these old new threats head on.

Just because the old threat is new again does it mean the accomplishments from the prior conflict should be erased from history.

Everything you just said is true. From a certain point of --

What I mean is, you're not wrong, but that logic could have been applied with much more restraint and respect when Disney took over. It was not.

 

[JAWS]

So, creating (or accepting, even perhaps enjoying) the portrayal of these characters as done with the ST makes those people (both creators and audience) unsuited to be called fans.

Okay then. Good to know.

I dont think that is what he is saying.. Would any of us come up with those storylines for the OT characters in the ST ? probably not.. We are all geeks and would have had Han, Luke, and Leia tell the new cast to hold their beers as they went out and saved the say

I dont agree with his assessment though

 

[ZE_501]

So, creating (or accepting, even perhaps enjoying) the portrayal of these characters as done with the ST makes those people (both creators and audience) unsuited to be called fans.

Okay then. Good to know.

I didn't say that.

I said the creators didn't respect the legacy.

Fans are not responsible for that. As I said in an earlier post, there are many kinds of fans, some twist themselves in knots to give anything Star Wars a pass. YouTube is filled with them. Others roll with it and accept what the Canon has served. I'm neither of the former.

I don't let Lucas off the hook for what I see as his screw-ups either, they're just different screw-ups.

 

[TheDucky]

Savage lol

Holy christ Khev these doomcockers literally want to watch 25 straight movies of Luke being 100% heroic 100% of the time.

Like ZERO character growth thru changes. ZERO!

Just do the same thing over and over and over again.

Zzzz Zzzz

I got 3 consecutive OT movies of straight heroic Luke and now Mando bad ass Luke plus the ST Luke character downfall and redemption i'm good!

You know I think you are 100% correct when you said had we got Mando bad ass Luke FIRST before the ST things might've turned out differently for those doomcockers lol

And yet when they changed Fett you cried about it. Hypocrisy at its finest.

 

[ZE_501]

I have said this before.. I think SW is always a little sad.. The PT is a tragedy, Ben dies, Empire is a downer, I always feel a bit sad at the end of ROTJ. Vader's death and Luke always seems a bit sad at the end.. Of course the ST is filled with tragedy. Its "Epic" storytelling. There is good and there is bad.. Tragedy is very important to this type of storytelling.

IDK the tragedy works for me. Could it have been handled better.. Yep without question!

It's a story of war. Even though it's not Saving Private Ryan it should contain sadness or it would have no gravitas.