The Official "The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey" movie thread *SPOILERS*

[TURINS~BANE]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

Cant wait for next December, good times. Still no pic of Smaugy? I here rumers of the Great Brian Blessed, playing a goblin axe slaying Dwarf hope thats true. Cant wait to see Beorn in Action on battle field "AWESOME".

 

[Wetanut]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

Just watched Christopher Lee's holiday video on TORn. Great to see him but couldn't help but notice his thought processes seems to have slowed down considerably and that he looks VERY tired. Suppose it's to be expected at his age. His hope to be around to see at least the first Hobbit in December 2012 is shared by many of us I'm thinking.

 

[The Josh]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

Just watched Christopher Lee's holiday video on TORn. Great to see him but couldn't help but notice his thought processes seems to have slowed down considerably and that he looks VERY tired. Suppose it's to be expected at his age. His hope to be around to see at least the first Hobbit in December 2012 is shared by many of us I'm thinking.

Totally on point with what I was thinking.

 

[OSCORP]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

Just think, another trailer in Summer probably.

 

[The Josh]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

My guess if we get one it will be at comic-con. I'm packing a pillow to sleep on while I wait in line for that panel.

 

[pixletwin]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

Even before they started production I thought PJ's thoughts seem scattered when he was trying to communicate.

 

[FrodoEyes]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

Even before they started production I thought PJ's thoughts seem scattered when he was trying to communicate.

PJ? You mean Christopher Lee?

No doubt he's fragile, but he's hard as nails and will probably live to see both films

 

[tomandshell]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

I'm just glad they got him in front of a green screen before it was too late. I don't imagine that he'll have a large role, but even if it's just a cameo, it will be fantastic to see him involved for the sake of continuity.

 

[pixletwin]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

PJ? You mean Christopher Lee?

No doubt he's fragile, but he's hard as nails and will probably live to see both films

Nope I meant PJ. His manner of talking seems more disjointed to me somehow.

 

[Anzik]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

I have great hopes for the Hobbit films. I think what sets this apart from other films is Jacksons sincere love of the source material and I understand why he made some changes that he did. The only thing I can't stand is the Nazgul lord shattering Gandalf's staff. It completely makes him appear to be an old human wizard when he is more on par with Sauron himself.

 

[The Ween]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

I hate remixes.

I usually do too, but I thought this one was rather good, especially since he didn't have the whole song.

 

[Maglor]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

You're in good company with that opinion because Peter Jackson said the same thing in the commentary and that's why he originally cut the scene from the movie.

However I disagree. The suspense isn't needed IMO. It simply shows the deviousness of the enemy much like the Biblical story of Joseph when his jealous brothers sold him into slavery and then presented his tattered signature coat to their father with the story that he had been torn to pieces by wild animals.

I find that it becomes much more poignant when you know that in the characters' minds their endeavor is no longer a longshot but is actually a lost cause. Do they lay down and give up like Juliet when she received misinformation about Romeo's death? No. They look at each other with tears in their eyes and decide they're going to give Sauron hell with one final charge.

Its really quite heartbreaking and one of the most touching moments of the trilogy for me.

I totally agree. When Aragorn turns around to his troops with tears in his eyes and says "For Frodo", all knew they were going on a forlorn hope (suicidal charge) but did not hesitate. THAT was the reason my eyes turned into faucets.

The book does that too.

One of the sillier EE additions was showing just how far back the funeral pyre was at the top of Minas Tirith so that Denethor literally jogs for about a mile while totally engulfed in flame.

Yeah, that is a bit implausible to say the least. PB acknowledges how ridiculous it is in the commentary. He just liked they visual impact of him diving of the edge there.

 

[Maglor]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

I didn't like how overall the Gondorians were portrayed as weak and dense in the TE.

Well, they were a diminished race without a King.

I didn't have any problem with the treatment of Denethor. He's a coward nutcase in both the film and the book.

Still would like to hear tomandshell elaborate.

 

[DaveMac]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

Well, they were a diminished race without a King.

I didn't have any problem with the treatment of Denethor. He's a coward nutcase in both the film and the book.

Still would like to hear tomandshell elaborate.

Denethor was far from a coward and nutcase in the book. Gandalf warns that Denethor is a powerful man of great lineage and should not be trifled with as he is very knowledgeable and can see far off things (he didn't know about the palantir). Denethor was consumed by despair which took full hold when Boromir died, other than that he had defended Gondor for years.

Isildur's character was given a bad review, he was a true hero until the ring came into his possession (taken as were-gild for the loss of his father who died along with Gil-Galad killing Sauron). PJ did a good job condensing the main points and characteristics of the massive tale into exciting films

 

[The Josh]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

He was a great man before messing with the Palantir and before the news of Boromir's death. However, after both those things yes he becomes a bit of a nut and one to quickly throw in the towel. So while the movie plays that up a bit I do agree that he's not stoic either.

 

[Khev]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

The book does that too.

That's great but not what we were talking about.

 

[Maglor]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

Denethor was far from a coward and nutcase in the book. Gandalf warns that Denethor is a powerful man of great lineage and should not be trifled with as he is very knowledgeable and can see far off things (he didn't know about the palantir). Denethor was consumed by despair which took full hold when Boromir died, other than that he had defended Gondor for years.

Isildur's character was given a bad review, he was a true hero until the ring came into his possession (taken as were-gild for the loss of his father who died along with Gil-Galad killing Sauron). PJ did a good job condensing the main points and characteristics of the massive tale into exciting films

Agree with every word.


PJ distilled it down to the basics: Denethor had become a coward (despair = cowardice) and a nutcase. Sure he was once a great man. Yes, the palantir was largely to blame for his condition. But The Madness of Denethor was not an invention of the screenplay writers.

Personally, I think Denethor was handled perfectly for the film.

That's great but not what we were talking about.

I'm not trying to be difficult but I honestly don't know what you mean.


You said "I find that it becomes much more poignant when you know that in the characters' minds their endeavor is no longer a longshot but is actually a lost cause. Do they lay down and give up like Juliet when she received misinformation about Romeo's death? No. They look at each other with tears in their eyes and decide they're going to give Sauron hell with one final charge."

That sentiment is in both the book and the film. The book has the added element that we don't know whether Frodo is actually alive, so we feel what they feel more deeply. In the film, we know Frodo is alive.



(I hope I have that straight. It's been a few years since my last reading of the books. )

 

[Khev]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

I'm not trying to be difficult but I honestly don't know what you mean.

Well then you might want to go back and read the original exchange. Tomandshell mentioned that he didn't think the Mouth of Sauron worked in the movie, I replied with why I thought it did. How it went down in the book was irrelevant at that point.

If that still doesn't make sense then don't worry about it. Not really an issue worth belaboring.

 

[Maglor]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

Okay, I get it now!

2) We know it is Eowyn from the start. There is no way around this for a film so I'm not suggesting they should have done something different, but in the book we first know this character on the Pelennor Fields as Dernhelm. The reader has the realization at the same time as the Witch King that this is a woman. Powerful stuff the first time reading it.

Same reason that I don't think the Mouth of Sauron scene works. Reading the book, the last you heard of Frodo was his capture by the enemy, and then the Mouth comes out with his stuff and we have no idea what happened since. The movie cuts back and forth and we already know that Sam has rescued Frodo. The suspense created in the book doesn't translate to the film in the same way. Same thing with Dernhelm--Tolkien can limit the description of Dernhelm so that the reader doesn't realize it's Eowyn, but in the movie we can recognize Miranda Otto's face and voice, so there's just no way to preserve that surprise moment.

Some of Tolkien's tricks simply don't translate to film, but PJ did a good job bringing the book to the big screen. Some of his changes even improved on Tolkien and made the story more cinematic--showing Boromir's final battle instead of having Aragorn find him dying, or showing the ents march on Isengard instead of just hearing about it after the fact. I'm sure that there will be many changes with the two Hobbit films, and some might bug me while others will improve the material.

I think the scene with Eowyn and the Witch King, as well as the Mouth of Sauron scene both work quite well. They are just missing one of the elements from the book. Although the book is more dramatic because of the inherent suspense, the scenes still work for the reasons you have stated.

If tomandshell literally thinks those scenes don't work in any way then I retract my ""

 

[TURINS~BANE]

Re: The Official "The Hobbit" movie thread

Its like ten years since LOTR, and we are very lucky to have both Ian's and Mr Lee alive still to play there roles. Christopher lee fought in both world war's didnt he? Warrior.