To protect our precious sculptor : Regarding TLJ sculpt matter

[pixletwin]

To me, there's not really a gray area...if I am understanding this correctly. If a dude sculpts for the love of a character, has no license to do so and charges for it, what does it make him?

It all depends on the amount of the charge and the intent.

If I am being charged $35 for a head sculpt, that is clearly a charge which basically covers the cost to get it made.

If I am being charged $90 for a head sculpt, that is clearly someone trying to mooch from a license which they don't possess.

Seems like a pretty clear and reasonable line to draw for me.

 

[intothevoid]

He probably doesn't charge as much because he is making a high five or maybe even six figure income from Sideshow. Some artist who do customs are trying to suppliment their income or just to survive.

While I won't comment or guess what Trev earns from Sideshow, I agree with this post, to compare Trev offering casts of sculpts of characters he loves as a side thing in addition to his main gig with SS is totally different to a sculptor offering his work as his primary source of income.

 

[yruh8n]

What can they do? Spend $100,000s in legal to nail a handful of people?

Also, its arguable that the customs industry is beneficial to them in terms of helps them sell base bodies, etc.

These companies also have been known to actually hire people who refine their chops in the custom industry.

This. How can movie studios NOT know that customs exist? How much is Warner Brothers really "losing" by Rainman making a Willie Wonka figure? Their attorneys probably charge more per hour than they could ever recover in a law suit.

 

[Jimmy C]

So Grove, Rainman, etc. are all basically offering things they have no right to offer. Interesting. And SSC's, HT and the other companies that spent millions on licenses don't do anything about it?

Funny, the 2 names you mention here. I don't believe Rainman has created any figures who are licensed to SSC or HT or any other toy company. So only violation is of original studio license and I don't believe Grove has offered any sculpts on the side of characters licensed to Sideshow. If he did, I sure would like his original proto of Indy. --- so same here maybe problem with studios or actors, but the Toy companies who pay Grove for his work have no problem.

 

[ProgMatinee]

He probably doesn't charge as much because he is making a high five or maybe even six figure income from Sideshow. Some artist who do customs are trying to suppliment their income or just to survive.

I doubt that he's making more near what you think. And plus, thats sorta irrelevant anyway.

I'd say he's probably pricing his sculpts fairly because he knows if he doesn't that somebody will rip it and sell for the price.

 

[pixletwin]

Prosecution is up to the owner. IE LFL chooses not (in most cases) to prosecute fan made creations (in some cases they even encourage it). On the other hand you have companies like Showtime with a stick up their butt when a fan created object doesn't even touch on anything they offer and the effect on their profit margin is nil.

 

[TheObsoleteMan]

This. How can movie studios NOT know that customs exist? How much is Warner Brothers really "losing" by Rainman making a Willie Wonka figure? Their attorneys probably charge more per hour than they could ever recover in a law suit.

Just to play devil's advocate, once you say it's okay for one group to steal from you, where does it stop?

 

[ProgMatinee]

Really? So I can go out and start writing Star Wars books and sell them and the law isn't going to look at them as copyright infringement?

I think you misinterpreted my post. I am saying the law doesn't distinguish between $35 value sculpts and $100 rip off sculpts. If they are both illegal they are both illegal.

Maybe the total $$ amount would make the difference between misdemeanor and felony...i don't know.

 

[pixletwin]

Just to play devil's advocate, once you say it's okay for one group to steal from you, where does it stop?

When it cuts into the companies profit margin.

 

[CollectorNC]

Funny, the 2 names you mention here. I don't believe Rainman has created any figures who are licensed to SSC or HT or any other toy company. So only violation is of original studio license and I don't believe Grove has offered any sculpts on the side of characters licensed to Sideshow. If he did, I sure would like his original proto of Indy. --- so same here maybe problem with studios or actors, but the Toy companies who pay Grove for his work have no problem.

I'm just asking about licensing and right to produce sculpts. Not just SSC's and HT's. I see the defense team is out in full force and I can respect your liking of their sculpts etc. I've just always been curious as to how members on here and professional sculptors could offer stuff, when the actual companies like SSC's or HT have to spend millions for licenses.

 

[Doctor Who]

I think it's derailing here. We're talking about HP recasting existing sculpts and not licensing and who made what. What does for example Trev's Marty sculpt not being made by a company have to do with HP recasting?

 

[yruh8n]

While I won't comment or guess what Trev earns from Sideshow, I agree with this post, to compare Trev offering casts of sculpts of characters he loves as a side thing in addition to his main gig with SS is totally different to a sculptor offering his work as his primary source of income.

Exactly. A good mold of a 1/6th scale head sculpt should only use less than $5 worth of silicone. Depending on how much resin you buy at a time the casting shouldn't cost more than $3 to produce. There aren't many people who can do this kind of work, so how much they feel they need to be compensated for their time and talent is up to them. As a consumer you can chose to buy or not.

 

[TheObsoleteMan]

I'm just asking about licensing and right to produce sculpts. Not just SSC's and HT's. I see the defense team is out in full force and I can respect your liking of their sculpts etc. I've just always been curious as to how members on here and professional sculptors could offer stuff, when the actual companies like SSC's or HT have to spend millions for licenses.

Because customizer's produce on a much, much lower scale and tend to fly under the radar. If they were producing in the same numbers as SSC and HT, they would get shut down in hurry.

 

[CollectorNC]

I think you misinterpreted my post. I am saying the law doesn't distinguish between $35 value sculpts and $100 rip off sculpts. If they are both illegal they are both illegal.

Maybe the total $$ amount would make the difference between misdemeanor and felony...i don't know.

And that's the point of this thread apparently. One sculptor with no license to produce a product complaining about another ripping off his non-licensed sculp.

 

[ProgMatinee]

When it cuts into the companies profit margin .

add to that...."enough to where prosecution is cost effective."

Companies don't go after small potatoes just for the fun of it. If the cost of doing so outweighs the benefit they won't.

 

[Doctor Who]

I think the TLJ case is pointless/a grey area argument. What isn't, is his recast of the HT and Blitzway sculpt. Those were made with a license, and HP recasted those for own profit.

 

[CollectorNC]

I think it's derailing here. We're talking about HP recasting existing sculpts and not licensing and who made what. What does for example Trev's Marty sculpt not being made by a company have to do with HP recasting?

How is a recasting any worse than casting something you don't have the legal right to cast in the first place. That's what I was wondering.

 

[Doctor Who]

How is recasting a licenced sculpt not worse than a fight between the unlicenced? That's I still am wondering.

 

[TheObsoleteMan]

How is recasting a licenced sculpt not worse than a fight between the unlicenced? That's I still am wondering.

It is. If you've got solid, incovtrovertible proof this is happening, you should inform the proper company.

 

[Doctor Who]

It is. If you've got solid, incovtrovertible proof this is happening, you should inform the proper company.

"Proof" is in the original HP thread, while the proof isn't 100% proof, it's still 95%. They even got the seam in the skunk stripe on the HT Todd sculpt.