WATCHMEN Movie Discussion (SPOILERS allowed)!

[Dusty]

Sadly, I can't really say I'm surprised that so many people apparently don't get WATCHMEN. Zach made about as accessible an adaptation as possible (while staying true to the source material) and still a lot of the reactions are so predictably banal that it's apparent it would never have worked for many, and especially the mainstream.

Not to start any arguments, it's just... didn't we already pretty much know that it wouldn't work for the mainstream and that NO adaptation was going to do it justice for the uninitiated? For example, I asked a guy I know, who hadn't read the book, if he liked the movie... he said it was okay, nothing special. I asked him if he understood the character motivation and plot, based on knowing NOTHING about it going in, and he said, and I quote:

"Well, I know the naked blue guy was banging the hot chick and then they had a fight, but I'm not sure what the fight was about, and then she was banging the owl guy. And I don't really know why the rich gay dude wanted to save the world but I guess that was pretty cool. And that guy with the moving mask was neat." (I can direct quote because it was through email exchange - and no, I will not tell you his name or email address - ha!)

Note: He didn't even know the names of the characters!

I assured him that the book was so much better and there were so many levels to the plot and character studies and that he should read it. But the sad fact is, he never will. And sadly, that's 90% of the movie-going American population right there (I'm not counting Freaks board members in that 90% - if you're posting on a board for collectibles, that doesn't count as 'mainstream movie-going audience' ), so this story, much less a dumbed-down movie adaptation (no matter how cool it is for fans of the original graphic novel) was NEVER destined for *mainstream* success, regardless of the EXTREME amount of marketing dollars they dumped into it... It's just too complex.

Eh, whatever. I'm more than happy with it and will be even moreso with the additional cuts. You guys can have all the Batman, Spider-Man and Iron Man flicks you want. They all pale in comparison and can't be taken seriously anymore (for me anyway).

The thing about the Iron Man, Batman, Spider-Man MOVIES is that they stand alone as really fun, interesting, character-driven FILMS. Watchmen *the movie* just doesn't - no matter how cool it looks you MUST be at least somewhat familiar with the back stories to fully understand and appreciate the subtleties, which are what make the story beautiful and worth remembering.

For the mainstream audience, the 'superheroes' of the Watchmen (which, dishonestly, is how they were marketed) look like cheap knock-offs of the more widely known and accepted superheroes... Nite Owl, Ozymandis, Dr. Manhattan, Silk Spectre, Rorschach... those are never going to be 'household names'. And in my opinoin, they SHOULDN'T be, so yes, part of me is happy that it's not going to be a blockbuster film, as selfish as that is - I'm in Moore's camp

 

[Darth Rage]

I sense a "Which Watchman character would be most likely to punch a baby" poll.

 

[Bannister]

Sadly, I can't really say I'm surprised that so many people apparently don't get WATCHMEN. Zach made about as accessible an adaptation as possible (while staying true to the source material) and still a lot of the reactions are so predictably banal that it's apparent it would never have worked for many, and especially the mainstream.

Eh, whatever. I'm more than happy with it and will be even moreso with the additional cuts. You guys can have all the Batman, Spider-Man and Iron Man flicks you want. They all pale in comparison and can't be taken seriously anymore (for me anyway).

We all just don't get it like you do.

 

[IrishJedi]

Not to start any arguments, it's just... didn't we already pretty much know that it wouldn't work for the mainstream and that NO adaptation was going to do it justice for the uninitiated? For example, I asked a guy I know, who hadn't read the book, if he liked the movie... he said it was okay, nothing special. I asked him if he understood the character motivation and plot, based on knowing NOTHING about it going in, and he said, and I quote:

"Well, I know the naked blue guy was banging the hot chick and then they had a fight, but I'm not sure what the fight was about, and then she was banging the owl guy. And I don't really know why the rich gay dude wanted to save the world but I guess that was pretty cool. And that guy with the moving mask was neat." (I can direct quote because it was through email exchange - and no, I will not tell you his name or email address - ha!)

I said that the book was so much better and there were so many levels to the plot and character studies and that he should read it. But the sad fact is, he never will. And sadly, that's 90% of the movie-going American population right there, so this story, much less a dumbed-down movie adaptation (no matter how cool it is for fans of the original graphic novel) was NEVER destined for mainstream success, regardless of the EXTREME amount of marketing dollars they dumped into it... It's just too complex.

I don't disagree with any of that at all. And your example just shows how dense the average person is. No offense to that guy, but WOW.

But, ultimately, it doesn't bother me. The film was made (and all of its ancillary tie-ins are also done). So whether it made just the $12.50 from me or a gazillion dollars doesn't matter. Because WATCHMEN is one-and-done regardless. That I love the movie after 3 viewings (and know it will only improve even more with time) makes it a resounding success. I find the mainstream (and even some "geek") reactions more amusing than anything. Because, like we said, it was pretty predictable and would have happened anyway.

The thing about the Iron Man, Batman, Spider-Man MOVIES is that they stand alone as really fun, interesting, character-driven FILMS. Watchmen the movie just doesn't - no matter how cool it looks you MUST be at least somewhat familiar with the back stories to fully understand the subtleties, which are what make the story beautiful.

WATCHMEN (the film) does stand alone. The back-story and other stuff those familiar with the book had going in surely add more density and color, but on its own it's still a damn solid deconstruction of the superhero archetypes, albeit this time their cinematic versions (Bruce Wayne, Tony Stark and Peter Parker are completely and utterly unrealistic characters when viewed through this lens).

"Fun"? Well, that's never what WATCHMEN was meant to be from the start... either in book or cinematic form. "Interesting" is purely in the eye of the beholder. Some people find MOBY ^^^^ interesting... others, a laborious bore.

I sense a "Which Watchman character would be most likely to punch a baby" poll.

Of course that would be Comedian.

 

[Bannister]

For the mainstream audience, the 'superheroes' of the Watchmen (which, dishonestly, is how they were marketed) look like cheap knock-offs of the more widely known and accepted superheroes... Nite Owl, Ozymandis, Dr. Manhattan, Silk Spectre, Rorschach... those are never going to be 'household names'. And in my opinoin, they SHOULDN'T be, so yes, part of me is happy that it's not going to be a blockbuster film, as selfish as that is - I'm in Moore's camp

I never understand why people get pissed when something becomes mainstream and popular. Just take comfort in the fact that you liked it when it wasn't.

 

[Bannister]

Of course that would be Comedian.

You obviously don't understand The Comedian. He would shoot the baby Irish.

 

[IrishJedi]

You obviously don't understand The Comedian. He would shoot the baby Irish.

Hurm... in the womb?

This is the most interesting WATCHMEN debate yet!

 

[tomandshell]

My mom saw it and she said she was turned off by the violence, particularly Rorschach taking a cleaver to the guy's head and the buzzsaw to the arms in the prison. I told her that was interesting because neither of those two things happened in the graphic novel.

 

[IrishJedi]

My mom saw it and she said she was turned off by the violence, particularly Rorschach taking a cleaver to the guy's head and the buzzsaw to the arms in the prison. I told her that was interesting because neither of those two things happened in the graphic novel.

True. But in the book, the prison cell sequence was actually bloodier (with the guy having his throat slashed open and blood literally gushing all over Rorschach and the cell). The buzzsaw is admittedly more grisly, though.

 

[Dusty]

I never understand why people get pissed when something becomes mainstream and popular. Just take comfort in the fact that you liked it when it wasn't.

Yeah, me too usually, if the movie is good... but in this case... I feel like they made a mistake by making it at all... meh, I don't even know why I care so much, I've only read the book a couple times in my life and am not a HUGE fan by any means

Ultimately, the film is forgettable, so this'll probably be the last time you hear from me about it, unless there are more baby punching comments

 

[Bannister]

Yeah, me too usually, if the movie is good... but in this case... I feel like they made a mistake by making it at all... meh, I don't even know why I care so much, I've only read the book a couple times in my life and am not a HUGE fan by any means

Ultimately, the film is forgettable, so this'll probably be the last time you hear from me about it, unless there are more baby punching comments

We have moved on to baby shooting. So no worries there Dusty.

 

[IrishJedi]

No more baby punching comments!

 

[Dusty]

You obviously don't understand The Comedian. He would shoot the baby Irish.

Rorschach would BITE the baby.

Hmmm, maybe Manhattan would punch the baby? because he just doesn't care

 

[Darth Rage]

 

[IrishJedi]

Rorschach would BITE the baby.

Hmmm, maybe Manhattan would punch the baby? because he just doesn't care

Okay, so...

Comedian would shoot the baby.

Rorschach would eat the baby (if it needed punishment).

Nite Owl II would gush over the baby.

Silk Spectre II would want to give the baby up for adoption.

Ozymandias would feed the baby to Bubastis.

And... Dr. Manhattan would teleport the baby to the Moon. Without oxygen.

 

[Bannister]

And... Dr. Manhattan would teleport the baby to the Moon. Without oxygen.

Not on purpose though. It would just be that he forgot.

 

[Darth Rage]

So who would punch the Watchman babies?

I guess Alan Moore?

 

[IrishJedi]

In Alan Moore's twisted mind "Watchmen Babies" = A-OK.... WATCHMEN movie = bane of all mankind.

 

[Bannister]

In Alan Moore's twisted mind "Watchmen Babies" = A-OK.... WATCHMEN movie = bane of all mankind.

Basically. I still can't believe he appeared in that episode.

 

[Dusty]

In Alan Moore's twisted mind "Watchmen Babies" = A-OK.... WATCHMEN movie = bane of all mankind.

Ultimately, the story is HIS baby... soooo... to him, the movie being made is like someone punching his baby.

I think we solved it... Zach Snyder is the baby puncher! (well, and the screenplay writers and the producers and the studios, etc etc - all baby punchers in Moore's mind)