WATCHMEN Movie Discussion (SPOILERS allowed)!

[BadMoon]

Well I would love to stay up and chat but I will have to continue tomorrow. Good night fellow Watchmen lovers. I needs to eat some beans and go to bed.

 

[endless1]

Can you explain this, especially re: Dan and Laurie in the alley vis a vis the thematic relevance of Rorshach?

Can someone also explain that how the COMEDIAN, 6FT 2inches, 225lbs, trained killer, get beaten and thrown out a window and no one can think of a suspect that can do that to him. Clue... SUPERMAN?? IRONMAN?? HULK MAYBE??

 

[barbelith]

When you elevate the level of violence strictly for the "coolness" factor, you confuse and mute the effect and purpose of real violence.

Absolutely. And then to make matters worse, Snyder shoots the rape like pornography (just look at Sally after Hooded Justice comes in; or prior to the assault, when the camera virtually leers at her undressing). It's as if Snyder just can't help himself; a woman in underwear is "hot" and that takes precedence to that actual underpinning of the scene. But then that's my chief complaint across the board; he seems to be assembling a Cliff's Notes without any actual comprehension of what these scenes and interactions mean nor why Alan Moore put them there in the first place.

I found Manhattan's origin story to be brilliantly told.

I have to agree. It's easy to talk about the negatives, but I don't think the film "sucked" or anything like that. I'd give it a 6/10 based primarily on its rare moments of real power, like this segment. The strongest part of the film.

 

[BadMoon]

Can someone also explain that how the COMEDIAN, 6FT 2inches, 225lbs, trained killer, get beaten and thrown out a window and no one can think of a suspect that can do that to him. Clue... SUPERMAN?? IRONMAN?? HULK MAYBE??

I wondered that while reading the book. I didn't like the whole fight sequence. Someone comes in, punches him and out the window he should have gone.

Ok really I am going to be.

 

[Entropy]

Ok just got back....


I could write papers and papers about different aspects, what works what doesn't, themes, motifs, acting, style etc.

My review: It's a Ferrari with square wheels.

This movie, and indeed any Watchmen movie, shows so clearly why Moore was against making it into a film. The nature, structure and density of the story just don't translate well to a 3 hr film. It was fun and flashy but ultimately rough, jerky and a bit frustrating.

 

[barbelith]

The alley sequence never even crossed my mind when watching the movie and thinking of possible flaws to be honest. I just knew that Rorshach was a level far beyone theirs and so did the audience. At least in the theater I was in. They still had a far enough seperation to make it work for me.

So no, in other words.

 

[BadMoon]

Absolutely. And then to make matters worse, Snyder shoots the rape like pornography (just look at Sally after Hooded Justice comes in; or prior to the assault, when the camera virtually leers at her undressing). It's as if Snyder just can't help himself; a woman in underwear is "hot" and that takes precedence to that actual underpinning of the scene. But then that's my chief complaint across the board; he seems to be assembling a Cliff's Notes without any actual comprehension of what these scenes and interactions mean nor why Alan Moore put them there in the first place.



I have to agree. It's easy to talk about the negatives, but I don't think the film "sucked" or anything like that. I'd give it a 6/10 based primarily on its rare moments of real power, like this segment. The strongest part of the film.

Wow after all that we are actually pretty close on our assessments. I would give it 7 out of 10.

 

[barbelith]

I wondered that while reading the book. I didn't like the whole fight sequence. Someone comes in, punches him and out the window he should have gone.

The idea is that Ozymandias, as the smartest person in the world, is also its best athlete and most skilled fighter. This is made much more obvious in the book. Maybe the director's cut will restore those explanations. It's a little more problematic in the film, of course, because Snyder apparently decided all the superheroes had super strength. It's less of a problem in the book, because Blake is just a guy. Sometimes even Marines get the jump on them.

 

[YoNoSe]

Absolutely. And then to make matters worse, Snyder shoots the rape like pornography (just look at Sally after Hooded Justice comes in; or prior to the assault, when the camera virtually leers at her undressing). It's as if Snyder just can't help himself; a woman in underwear is "hot" and that takes precedence to that actual underpinning of the scene.

Now that you mention it, it comes back to me (as Mike pointed out). It's almost as if Snyder can't resist a bit of boy-fantasy. A lady getting undressed must be sexy.

 

[Entropy]

Absolutely. And then to make matters worse, Snyder shoots the rape like pornography (just look at Sally after Hooded Justice comes in; or prior to the assault, when the camera virtually leers at her undressing). It's as if Snyder just can't help himself; a woman in underwear is "hot" and that takes precedence to that actual underpinning of the scene. But then that's my chief complaint across the board; he seems to be assembling a Cliff's Notes without any actual comprehension of what these scenes and interactions mean nor why Alan Moore put them there in the first place.

Agreed!

I have to agree. It's easy to talk about the negatives, but I don't think the film "sucked" or anything like that. I'd give it a 6/10 based primarily on its rare moments of real power, like this segment. The strongest part of the film.

I also agree that it's the strongest part of the movie. Mainly because they took the time to tell this bit and the narrative flow, pauses and punctuations were most like the comic. That's what irritated me the most, that the flow of events was a mess. But that's going to happen when you cram a dense story into such a truncated form. All the connective tissue was sliced away and the Cliff Notes plot points were all that remained.

 

[barbelith]

But that's going to happen when you cram a dense story into such a truncated form. All the connective tissue was sliced away and the Cliff Notes plot points were all that remained.

The most glaring point in the entire film for me was actually something rather subtle. But it was the perfect summation of how Snyder, for all his visual flair, doesn't actually seem to understand the language of film. It's on Mars, when Dr Manhattan asks Laurie whether the landscape would be greatly improved by an oil pipeline...

...in a medium shot that scarcely shows the surface of Mars. Way to actually think about what's happening in your scene, Zack.

 

[BadMoon]

The idea is that Ozymandias, as the smartest person in the world, is also its best athlete and most skilled fighter. This is made much more obvious in the book. Maybe the director's cut will restore those explanations. It's a little more problematic in the film, of course, because Snyder apparently decided all the superheroes had super strength. It's less of a problem in the book, because Blake is just a guy. Sometimes even Marines get the jump on them.

Oh I get it. Just think in the book he almost gave up. Like he was waiting for him and didn't even intend to fight becuase he knew it would only delay a serious and deadly outcome.

 

[The Mike]

.....oh how fitting this actually is.....isn't it?

 

[Entropy]

The most glaring point in the entire film for me was actually something rather subtle. But it was the perfect summation of how Snyder, for all his visual flair, doesn't actually seem to understand the language of film. It's on Mars, when Dr Manhattan asks Laurie whether the landscape would be greatly improved by an oil pipeline...

...in a medium shot that scarcely shows the surface of Mars. Way to actually think about what's happening in your scene, Zack.

Yuppers. I was actually thinking the same.

Still, the visuals were gorgeous and the acting (with the exception of a few scenes - craptastic 'I know Comedian was my father' scene) solid. The in your face soundtrack and score were irritating at times and the narrative flow irked me as did the lame alley fight and the cutting of some choice lines and scenes. Overall though it was as close as Hollywood could probably come in 2 hr 45 min.

 

[YoNoSe]

I actually sat next to the wheelchair void tonight!

 

[Darth Rage]

And then to make matters worse, Snyder shoots the rape like pornography (just look at Sally after Hooded Justice comes in; or prior to the assault, when the camera virtually leers at her undressing). It's as if Snyder just can't help himself; a woman in underwear is "hot" and that takes precedence to that actual underpinning of the scene. But then that's my chief complaint across the board; he seems to be assembling a Cliff's Notes without any actual comprehension of what these scenes and interactions mean nor why Alan Moore put them there in the first place.

I couldn't disagree more. That scene was as disturbing to me as it should have been. Of course the camera was leering at her, we're seeing her through the lustful eyes of the Comedian. Once he enters the room though, it is sheer fear on her part and brutaliy on his. Other than the "superheroic" punch Silk Specter threw, this scene translated very well from the book, and was I think, very effective. Forgive me if I am misunderstanding your use of the word pornography, but I believe the intention of pornography is to arouse people. There was absolutely nothing arousing about this scene.

Snyder seems to so totally get it thorughout much of the movie (Commedian and Roshack for the most part) and other times seems to have no clue what the book is about (Dan and Laurie). I'm hardly against violence in movies, but there are so many cases of using violence just to be gratuitous in this film, rather than when necessary to the plot and character development. Grindhouse should have gratuitous violence, Dan and Laurie's killing spree in the alley reminded me more of a scene from Natural Born Killers.

I'm not surprised to hear about people leaving the theatre. I had a baaaad feeling a lot of people just weren't going to understand this movie, and came in thinking they were seeing just another typical Hollywood superhero flick.

Honestly overall I liked it, but was hardly blown away the way I thought I would be. Too many "300" moments if you ask me.

 

[barbelith]

.....oh how fitting this actually is.....isn't it?

Only one person seems to have done that, actually.

 

[The Mike]

'Watchmen' On Track For $25M Friday; Opens Huge With $4.5M Midnight Shows

FRIDAY 4PM UPDATE: This weekend marks the most anticipated superhero movie opening since last summer's The Dark Knight. Maybe even more since this isn't a sequel or remake but a long-awaited big screen retelling of a widely admired and highly creative graphic novel. Yet questions remain: Is the complicated story accessible? Will the pic have legs? Sources now tell me that Warner Bros' Watchmen is looking to make $25M today, including the $4.5M from Thursday's 1,600 midnight shows including all 124 sold-out Imax screenings. IMAX even added about 20 more 3 AM shows to accomodate the big demand. (That's way more moolah than the $2.5 million that Zack Snyder's 300 made for its midnight shows. Then again they numbered only 656.) Shortly before its midnight release, Watchmen had already scored more advance tickets at MovieTickets than 300 did in 2007 -- and that pic became the highest March opener of all time at $70.9M. Today, the movie is expected to shatter the record for an R-rated opening because Watchmen has the highest location count ever for an R-rated feature at 3,611. Overseas, Paramount is distributing it day and date in the major territories (excluding Japan) for $35M in grosses there. (Warner Bros was targeted in a lawsuit by 20th Century Fox to gets its legal piece of Watchmen's proceeds, while Paramount owns 25% and has international distribution)

Rest of article here: Watchmen could do 70 Million...

 

[The Mike]

Only one person seems to have done that, actually.

True...but I just wanted an excuse to post it.

 

[Darth Rage]

'Watchmen' On Track For $25M Friday; Opens Huge With $4.5M Midnight Shows

Initial numbers don't surprise me, I wonder if these numbers will hold for long though.