X-Men: Apocalypse - May 27, 2016

[SNIKT1950]

Well, I agree with him that FC and DOFP are great movies, not just great superhero movies, he's not wrong there.

Where he is wrong is that CW is just as great.

To snobbishly label CW as only "cheap excitement" and shrug it off as less sophisticated than FC and DOFP is not only a gross misinterpretation of the movie it also stinks of bad taste lol.

Nah, my taste is fine.

There is no sophistication in CW. At all. Its a good action movie at best. There's nothing cerebral about it.

Incredibly overrated and sadly, because TWS is so much better.

CW is perfect for MCU standards though, with its never-ending supply of jokes, action and crossover gimmicks.

 

[Sweet Rabbit]

X2, FIRST CLASS & DOFP are miles ahead of anything from the MCU.

That's coming from a guy who loves TWS, GOTG, IRON MAN (2008) & THE AVENGERS (2012).

FIRST CLASS & DOFP in particular just put Feige's popcorn antics to shame. Those films just weren't worried about cheap excitement to drive the story home and rather relied on the impact of the relationships between their characters. Good cinema begins and ends with character exploration. Not fight choreography or trailer moments. FIRST CLASS & DOFP are simply better films because of their commitment to character. They're not just great CBMs. They're great films, period.

The closest the MCU got was TWS in allowing it to be a journey for Cap and Bucky (which CW dumped in favor of crossover spectacle).

 

[YoNoSe]

Bad taste CONFIRMED.

 

[SNIKT1950]

Bravo, on such a well articulated retort.

 

[Sweet Rabbit]

Bravo, on such a well articulated retort.

That's about all I can do with that golden nugget

 

[SNIKT1950]

Bad taste CONFIRMED.

Inability to support your argument CONFIRMED.

 

[jye4ever]

The impact of relationships, character exploration and commitment to character journey are just as great in CW as they were in FC and DOFP.

Then because CW was able to deliver thrilling SUPERHERO action in their you know...SUPERHERO movie, it actually exceeded the high quality that was already present in TWS and has now drawn the line on what should be expected from other movies in this genre.

Even the weakest of the MCU movies help with all of the individual character journey that are taking place.

 

[YoNoSe]

inability to support your argument confirmed.

snova2016 confirmed.

 

[SNIKT1950]

The impact of relationships, character exploration and commitment to character journey are just as great in CW as they were in FC and DOFP.

Then because CW was able to deliver thrilling SUPERHERO action in their you know...SUPERHERO movie, it actually exceeded the high quality that was already present in TWS and has now drawn the line on what should be expected from other movies in this genre.

What it actually did, was demonstrate how audiences would rather have popcorn instead of drama.

CW is an action movie. You loved it? That's fine, but to say it accomplished something in the genre, or better yet the medium, is absurd.

This is a movie in which the dialogue is 60% jokes. Not sure if you overlook that because you just love the franchise so much, but that's a fact. I can post a transcript here of the film's dialogue if you like.

There was a way of doing CW as a serious thriller like TWS, but Feige had his way and what we got instead was a plot designed to lead up to a 10 minute skirmish between the heroes in the Marvel stable. There's no weight to that. The highlight of the film is literally a friendly fight at an airport. Did Steve get closure? Did Tony get closure? Did Bucky get closure? No. The outcome of the film was literally non-existent but that's a given with the nature of the MCU - uneventful movies that culminate in more expensive eventful movies.

Again, there's nothing wrong with loving CW, but to champion it as something transcendent in the genre is ludicrous.

Tony Stark reading Steve Rogers' apology letter is the epitome of everything wrong with the MCU. That scene showcases the utter lack of teeth in those movies and corporate commitment to churning out sequel after sequel with little interest in the long lasting effect of the individual films.

 

[YoNoSe]

What it actually did, was demonstrate how audiences would rather have popcorn instead of drama.

There's loads of drama in the MCU. It continues to intertwine the relationships of the characters. The reason people respond to the humor that you seem to loath is because the humor stems from character. People get the jokes because they know the characters.

CW is an action movie. You loved it? That's fine, but to say it accomplished something in the genre, or better yet the medium, is absurd.

The MCU model has absolutely advanced the superhero genre. To deny it is obtuse. The X-Men movies are great, but they are LITERALLY going backwards with their characters and storylines.

This is a movie in which the dialogue is 60% jokes.

That's straight nonsense. You're just making up statistical nonsense.

FEIGE FEIGE FEIGE FEIGE

Your obsession with the blog-informed fictional version of Kevin Feige you've created is unhealthy. And tiresome.

Stark reading Steve Rogers' apology letter is the epitome of everything wrong with the MCU. That scene showcases the utter lack of teeth in those movies and corporate commitment to churning out sequel after sequel with little interest in the long lasting effect of the individual films.

That's kind of funny coming from a FOX-Men fan. Can't wait to watch Wolverine escape the Alkali Lake facility for the...what, 5th time?

Enjoy what you like, man. But if you can't discuss things without referring to it's superiority to something else you sound pretty desperate.

 

[jye4ever]

Marvel has always said that with these MCU movies their goal was to make it all build up towards IW1/2, just like a big comic event.

Keep using teeth in every movie that are on a journey towards their big climax will dull the teeth that are supposed to be the sharpest, which are IW1/2.

Sure some MCU movies are obviously better than others, but overall they all will serve the greater good.

Many fans are going to be in shock over those sharp teeth come IW.

 

[Khev]

Well, I agree with him that FC and DOFP are great movies, not just great superhero movies, he's not wrong there.

Where he is wrong is that CW is just as great.

To snobbishly label CW as only "cheap excitement" and shrug it off as less sophisticated than FC and DOFP is not only a gross misinterpretation of the movie it also stinks of bad taste lol.

Every great film is dismissed by somebody on the internet so SNIKT's bad taste when it comes to CW isn't this huge shocking thing, especially in an X-Men thread. But First Class and DOFP are indeed great cbm's (especially FC). I'm still inclined to give "best all around movie" title to Batman Begins. To me that was Nolan at his best firing on all cylinders. But unless the Russos surpass themselves yet *again* with Infinity War I have a feeling that Civil War just might be my all time fave. We'll see. Everyone can argue their favorite but at the end of the day every single fan of comics or superheroes really has their respectable movie that they can fall back on save the poor Fantastic Four fans. Even the much maligned Punisher fans finally have Netflix Frank.

 

[a-dev]

Yeah I really don't see how the X-men movies have had more teeth than anything in the MCU. The Xavier/Magneto relationship is the same in each and every film and it always seems to end the same no matter what transpired in between. YoNoSe has already mentioned Wolverine. No other character has been of any real note. Mystique is probably the next in line of importance and no one even likes how they've written her or or how she's being played by JLaw.

And if 'teeth' is killing characters off - I give you X-men 3....arguably the least-liked movie in the franchise and so they wrote DOFP to bring everyone back to life.

There's still some excellent films in there, I don't debate that, but I don't see how they're braver movies.

 

[YoNoSe]

I still rank X2 as one of my all time favorite CBMs. I went to see Cabaret on Broadway because I wanted to get Alan Cumming to sign my Nightcrawler doll.

My wife said no.

But the show was great!

 

[SNIKT1950]

Your obsession with the blog-informed fictional version of Kevin Feige you've created is unhealthy. And tiresome.

What's tiresome is Feige's unhealthy obsession with safe summer fare.

Then again, we're talking about a man who loves Michael Bay and the Transformers franchise.

 

[jye4ever]

Every great film is dismissed by somebody on the internet so SNIKT's bad taste when it comes to CW isn't this huge shocking thing, especially in an X-Men thread. But First Class and DOFP are indeed great cbm's (especially FC). I'm still inclined to give "best all around movie" title to Batman Begins. To me that was Nolan at his best firing on all cylinders. But unless the Russos surpass themselves yet *again* with Infinity War I have a feeling that Civil War just might be my all time fave. We'll see. Everyone can argue their favorite but at the end of the day every single fan of comics or superheroes really has their respectable movie that they can fall back on save the poor Fantastic Four fans. Even the much maligned Punisher fans finally have Netflix Frank.

Ohh, maxi big da Internet. Well dat smells stinkowiff.

Yeah I really don't see how the X-men movies have had more teeth than anything in the MCU. The Xavier/Magneto relationship is the same in each and every film and it always seems to end the same no matter what transpired in between. YoNoSe has already mentioned Wolverine. No other character has been of any real note. Mystique is probably the next in line of importance and no one even likes how they've written her or or how she's being played by JLaw.

And if 'teeth' is killing characters off - I give you X-men 3....arguably the least-liked movie in the franchise and so they wrote DOFP to bring everyone back to life.

There's still some excellent films in there, I don't debate that, but I don't see how they're braver movies.

Damn that's some real fine analysis right there.

 

[kryptonianmutie]

Can you guys who put FC in the upper echelon of the X-Men movies tell me why you feel that way. It's a good one, but I just can't put it up there with X2 or DoFP.

 

[jye4ever]

I still rank X2 as one of my all time favorite CBMs. I went to see Cabaret on Broadway because I wanted to get Alan Cumming to sign my Nightcrawler doll.

My wife said no.

But the show was great!

 

[SNIKT1950]

Can you guys who put FC in the upper echelon of the X-Men movies tell me why you feel that way. It's a good one, but I just can't put it up there with X2 or DoFP.

Magneto's relationship with Shaw is cinematic perfection. There are so many layers to it and it basically redefines Magneto as a character.


What FC did with Magneto and Shaw is what Nolan did with Batman and The Joker in TDK. They really went the distance with a comic book character onscreen and pulled it off spectacularly.

 

[YoNoSe]

What's tiresome is Feige's unhealthy obsession with safe summer fare.

Then again, we're talking about a man who loves Michael Bay and the Transformers franchise.

They're no more or less "safe" than any other PG-ish CBMs.

Shall we compare Kevin Feige's guilty pleasures with Bryan Singer's? I'd rather not.