Zack Snyder's Rebel Moon

[Otomofan]

Yeah you say that, but in the very next post you called the rest of us the kids that murdered Piggy with a rock in "Lord of the Flies" implying that we're some kind of mental midgets for not liking a movie.

I haven't read all the posts here, but has anyone been out and out rude or insulting to you? As far as I could tell, everyone is happy for you that you enjoy the movie.

 

[Khev]

Netflix definitely needs to have a PG-13 cut so that kids/families can watch it, and then take part in watching the growth of the franchise and its saga and worldbuilding, etc.

I disagree. If John Wick can grow into a massive franchise with fleshed out world-building comprising four mainline films, an upcoming spin-off film and a prequel television series all with hard-R ratings then a super cool space opera can absolutely due the same without needing a sanitized cut to pave the way.

The R-rated extended versions of the films are going to show just how sanitized Star Wars is with respect to war and people actually having sex.

With all due respect Terminator, Matrix, and Starship Troopers did that decades ago. All showed a harsher reality of futuristic war, all showed people having sex.

 

[Alatar]

For a PG-13 I’m surprised they kept the line from the squad commander at the barn “First i’m going to split her wide open!”

Enjoy that kids lol

Yeah, it’s an attempted rape scene. And it’s emotionally very intense. That is curious to make the cut for PG-13 one would think. But then again, 13 y/o is not too young to understand what sex is, and that rape is violence.

 

[Alatar]

I disagree. If John Wick can grow into a massive franchise with fleshed out world-building comprising four mainline films, an upcoming spin-off film and a prequel television series all with hard-R ratings then a super cool space opera can absolutely due the same without needing a sanitized cut to pave the way.


With all due respect Terminator, Matrix, and Starship Troopers did that decades ago. All showed a harsher reality of futuristic war, all showed people having sex.

Yeah, maybe so. For a franchise that hopes to rival Star Wars that’s planning on toy sales, you want kids in the audience though.

I mean there will probably be some high-end collectibles for adult nerds like us. And this 1/6 hobby is a more socially acceptable form of nerdism these days than ever. But the real toy revenue comes from marketing to kids.

 

[Alatar]

Yeah you say that, but in the very next post you called the rest of us the kids that murdered Piggy with a rock in "Lord of the Flies" implying that we're some kind of mental midgets for not liking a movie.

I haven't read all the posts here, but has anyone been out and out rude or insulting to you? As far as I could tell, everyone is happy for you that you enjoy the movie.

In this analogy Piggy is the film itself. Not me or my comments.

You’re taking umbrage that I made a snarky comparison to the tendency of those that disliked or hated the film to basically gang up when slamming the film. And stating it in a butthurt way! As if you are you all are being hurt and offended for criticizing that. It’s amazing to watch.

When I checked out of the thread earlier it was because I had decided that I didn’t want to expend valuable time and energy defending a position that I wasn’t likely to sway anyone about. I mean, not here, anyway. But I wasn’t doing it because I was “hurt.” I’ve been a Snyder fan for years so I already know the drill. It was because this isn’t a venue where those sorts of ideas can expect to get much traction. Unless there are lurkers who agree with me or are at least curious about what I’m proposing. But now I’m here to the bitter end, lol. I now feel compelled to fill the gadfly role. Someone should imo.

 

[Otomofan]

Hardly. I just think it's weird that you take personal offense on behalf of a movie.

It's not like we're insulting your family or friends or something. It's a movie. And it's a pretty lousy one. So yes, I see that in this case, if Rebel Moon were Piggy, I would indeed smash his head open with a rock.

Bad movies tend to get bad reviews. People that all feel the same way and agree that it was a **** movie are just agreeing that it was a **** movie. We aren't "ganging up" to to "bully" the movie. IT'S A MOVIE.

You are defending this movie like it's your lady love and she's in danger, and you're going to slay all the dragons and win her fair hand in marriage. It's strange, but it's entertaining to watch.

I have an idea! Say something bad about my favorite movie. Say anything. Be real mean, as mean as you can. Then watch my reaction.

 

[Alatar]

Hardly. I just think it's weird that you take personal offense on behalf of a movie.

Show me where you think I have taken "personal offense" to criticism of the movie.

 

[The Buffinator]

I disagree. If John Wick can grow into a massive franchise with fleshed out world-building comprising four mainline films, an upcoming spin-off film and a prequel television series all with hard-R ratings then a super cool space opera can absolutely due the same without needing a sanitized cut to pave the way.

Therein lies the difference - JW is super cool while RM is not, and it's unlikely that the addition of the R-rated content will correct where it falls short. It has some cool elements but unless Part 2 is markedly better in terms of originality, storytelling and character development any hope of a sustainable franchise is already dead and buried.

The R-rated extended versions of the films are going to show just how sanitized Star Wars is with respect to war and people actually having sex.

With all due respect Terminator, Matrix, and Starship Troopers did that decades ago. All showed a harsher reality of futuristic war, all showed people having sex.

Agreed, although I'm assuming you included Starship Troopers to demonstrate that it could be done while making a bad film as well.

 

[Otomofan]

This review feels more open and honest than the Lord of the Flies kind of reaction to Piggy that I’ve been seeing. I mean versus the reflexive piling on, etc.

That seems to me like you're very offended on behalf of the poor, bullied movie that everyone is "dogpiling" on.

Only "open and honest" criticisms are valid. If anyone dares to proclaim it's simply a lousy movie, it MUST be cause they hate Snyder or are just participating in groupthink. No way that anyone just doesn't like a bad movie for the sake of it being bad.

Anyway. We're talking in circles now, and @Mandible already made this point more eloquently than I have.

I'm glad you like the movie.

 

[Khev]

Agreed, although I'm assuming you included Starship Troopers to demonstrate that it could be done while making a bad film as well.

Lol, yes. And both Terminator and Matrix show that a sprawling IP can be created without any need to cater to children's toy aisles.

 

[Wor-Gar]

The franchises that Khev brings up -- and all others -- also proves another thing: all of them eventually end up where Rebel Moon already is.

 

[Khev]

The franchises that Khev brings up -- and all others -- also proves another thing: all of them eventually end up where Rebel Moon already is.

People criticized the DCEU for jumping right to their version of Civil War (BvS) and Infinity War (JL) without laying the necessary groundwork so are you saying that RM did the same thing by jumping right to Terminator Dark Fate without first giving us T1 and T2...

 

[Wor-Gar]

Precisely.

In that sense, Zack is ahead of the curve.

 

[The Buffinator]

The franchises that Khev brings up -- and all others -- also proves another thing: all of them eventually end up where Rebel Moon already.

So stale imitations of their earlier entries, whereas Zack went the stale imitation route on Day 1 lol…

 

[Wor-Gar]

If it is deliberate, then RM2 should be much improved. RM3 could be excellent. And RM4 a legendary masterpiece.

 

[Alatar]

That seems to me like you're very offended on behalf of the poor, bullied movie that everyone is "dogpiling" on.

Only "open and honest" criticisms are valid. If anyone dares to proclaim it's simply a lousy movie, it MUST be cause they hate Snyder or are just participating in groupthink. No way that anyone just doesn't like a bad movie for the sake of it being bad.

Anyway. We're talking in circles now, and @Mandible already made this point more eloquently than I have.

I'm glad you like the movie.

Yeah, of course people are naturally going to develop personal emotional investments in things that are important to them. To what they care about, what matters to them, etc. To become attached and protective, etc. I'm no different.

What I see Snyder attempting (and for me succeeding with) is something I care about a great deal. It does strike a deep chord inside me. So in that sense I guess I do feel compelled to defend it. So that's a fair observation about me behaving like... what? I'll be kind to myself and think of it as a knight. Well, based on your description, that is--although you see it as Don Quixote, I get that!

But anyway, that response is not pearl clutching because I was offended that others appreciate things differently than I do. That's sort of answering a call to try to voice the perspective that at the end of the day, yes, is personally meaningful to me. I do hold out the hope that it has potential be to others as well. But when that isn't the popular opinion culturally it can get exasperating, and tiring, sure.

The whole question about what is groupthink in a situation like this is a bit tangled and thorny, imo. But I think it's fair to say that Zack Snyder's style doesn't cater to the mainstream. Or as some here have suggested, it simply may not be in him to make a surefire crowd-pleaser type of film, for a number of reasons. (And of course Snyder fans and dislikers/haters will disagree about what those reasons are.)

 

[JacktheRipper]

Hell, I don't get all the love for the MCU! I hate all this world-building. Just give me a freakin' good movie! They don't have to tie together. I only enjoyed Godzilla Minus-One, but based on the talk it's the second coming. I guess I'm not in-touch with my inner Godzilla.

 

[Alatar]

Hell, I don't get all the love for the MCU! I hate all this world-building. Just give me a freakin' good movie! They don't have to tie together. I only enjoyed Godzilla Minus-One, but based on the talk it's the second coming. I guess I'm not in-touch with my inner Godzilla.

There's room for both obviously. It's just so glorious and mindblowing when we get something on the order of what Tolkien pulled off. But do I appreciate a movie like Taxi Driver in its own way every bit as much? Yes I do.

 

[Wor-Gar]

pearl clutching

 

[Khev]

Precisely.

In that sense, Zack is ahead of the curve.

Savage, lol. Despite its shortcomings I definitely put it miles above the lesser Terminator entries, though I'm not sure I'd rank it above a single Matrix entry, so take that as you will.