Documents say detainee in Guantanamo near insanity

[Bannister]

F'n terrorists.

 

[Mesa]

He means if you were one of the few who you said are probably innocent.

OH! Well, if the suspected terrorists said the pictures of the layout of the stadium, bridges, and Disney Land found on their digital camera weren't theirs and the chemical formula to C4 and the dirty shoe bomb making instructions found on their laptop along with the 2 tons of fertilizer found in their van from their internet online order weren't theirs, then by all means, let them go. After all, innocent until proven guilty, or thousands more civilians are murdered, right?

Silly me.

 

[Mesa]

Shoot, after we let them go from Gitmo, let's allow them to become a professor at a university and teach our angry and confused youth. I'd even go so far as to allow them to make financial campaign contributions to someone running for president.

 

[Bannister]

OH! Well, if the suspected terrorists said the pictures of the layout of the stadium, bridges, and Disney Land found on their digital camera weren't theirs and the chemical formula to C4 and the dirty shoe bomb making instructions found on their laptop along with the 2 tons of fertilizer found in their van from their internet online order weren't theirs, then by all means, let them go. After all, innocent until proven guilty, or thousands more civilians are murdered, right?

Silly me.

You said yourself that there are probably innocent people there as we are human and make mistakes. He was saying, how would you feel if you were one of those mistakes? I don't see why that pisses you off so much.

 

[Mesa]

You said yourself that there are probably innocent people there as we are human and make mistakes. He was saying, how would you feel if you were one of those mistakes? I don't see why that pisses you off so much.

I agree with that. It is unfortunate that there is probably a small percentage of people that are being detained that maybe shouldn't be. And as I mentioned, the same could be said for our own criminal justice system. We make mistakes. There's no avoiding it. And unless we want to allow potential enemies that mean harm to your family, your friends, to go free while the initial incriminating evidence that was gathered through phone taps, emails, etc. (Freedom of Information Act) is determined to be sufficient to imprison an individual in an inefficient and costly, and possibly sympathetic court system, while our nation's security is at risk, I'd just as soon keep our suspected enemies in prison. At least we aren't beheading them, which is what many of those extremists would do to us infidels.

 

[Kabukiman]

I really doubt anybody living in the US has forgotten 9/11. The problem is, we cannot forever point to that as an excuse for embarrassments like gitmo.

All we (the people complaining about gitmo) want is *some* sort of transparency with this whole process. US citizens are being taken out in the middle of the night and thrown into prison. According to our own laws, they must be charged and tried. Our government is set up with checks and balances to prevent tyranny, if those checks and balances are circumvented, how do we know we're still free?

I don't pretend to know what goes on in the mind of a terrorist. But if their goal was to disrupt our way of life enough to a point where we are stripped of basic rights which our country was founded on, they succeeded, and continue to succeed, thanks to the fear mongering of people who point to 9/11 as an excuse for inhumane acts.

 

[Darthrazz]

Many detainees who were let go , have later been captured or killed in Afghanistan , still running with around with the Taliban. I can't find the CNN article that outlined this, but I'm looking for it.

 

[Kabukiman]

Many detainees who were let go , have later been captured or killed in Afghanistan , still running with around with the Taliban. I can't find the CNN article that outlined this, but I'm looking for it.

Here's one from a while ago: https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A52670-2004Oct21.html

 

[DarkArtist81]

I really doubt anybody living in the US has forgotten 9/11. The problem is, we cannot forever point to that as an excuse for embarrassments like gitmo.

All we (the people complaining about gitmo) want is *some* sort of transparency with this whole process. US citizens are being taken out in the middle of the night and thrown into prison. According to our own laws, they must be charged and tried. Our government is set up with checks and balances to prevent tyranny, if those checks and balances are circumvented, how do we know we're still free?

I don't pretend to know what goes on in the mind of a terrorist. But if their goal was to disrupt our way of life enough to a point where we are stripped of basic rights which our country was founded on, they succeeded, and continue to succeed, thanks to the fear mongering of people who point to 9/11 as an excuse for inhumane acts.

That's exactly what I was trying to say. Well put bro.

Mesa, again, I understand a bit of where you are coming from. But your answer is to use extreme methods on possibly innocent people, simply because we were wronged on 9/11. What they were trying to tell you on the last page was that if you had even known someone that was a suspected terrorist... even if you turned them in... You could be taken to GITMO.

And while there, you would have absolutely NO rights of due process, and they could hold you indefinitely without any proof that you were in on your friend's plan. Even though you are a US Citizen and probably only met your friend once back in college.

If that's not scary to you, or at least morally skewed... Then something is wrong bro.

 

[Mesa]

I really doubt anybody living in the US has forgotten 9/11. The problem is, we cannot forever point to that as an excuse for embarrassments like gitmo.

All we (the people complaining about gitmo) want is *some* sort of transparency with this whole process. US citizens are being taken out in the middle of the night and thrown into prison. According to our own laws, they must be charged and tried. Our government is set up with checks and balances to prevent tyranny, if those checks and balances are circumvented, how do we know we're still free?

I don't pretend to know what goes on in the mind of a terrorist. But if their goal was to disrupt our way of life enough to a point where we are stripped of basic rights which our country was founded on, they succeeded, and continue to succeed, thanks to the fear mongering of people who point to 9/11 as an excuse for inhumane acts.

That's exactly what I was trying to say. Well put bro.

Mesa, again, I understand a bit of where you are coming from. But your answer is to use extreme methods on possibly innocent people, simply because we were wronged on 9/11. What they were trying to tell you on the last page was that if you had even known someone that was a suspected terrorist... even if you turned them in... You could be taken to GITMO.

And while there, you would have absolutely NO rights of due process, and they could hold you indefinitely without any proof that you were in on your friend's plan. Even though you are a US Citizen and probably only met your friend once back in college.

If that's not scary to you, or at least morally skewed... Then something is wrong bro.

I would like to see an article or two where the US government is coming and taking a completely innocent person away in the middle of the night simply for knowing of terrorism. I honestly do not think that sort of thing is happening. What you're suggesting is that we, the US, is behaving similarly to Nazi Germany during WWII with their concentration camps.

And there's some information that the average US citizen should never know. It's up to our commander in chief to decide how to process the most sensitive information. I certainly wouldn't want top secret information be known to the general public and media so the enemy can use that against us as well. We elect people to protect us, and seeing as how there hasn't been another terrorist attack on domestic soil since 9/11, I think our president has done a good job in that regard. A second attack is inevitable, but at least we are actively trying to prevent it.

And I certainly don't want to wait for a red-taped court system left to decide the fate of these prisoners. I'm sure these suspected terrorists will sit patiently at home awaiting their trial while the lawyers get through the evidence to build a case. No, they would just dissapear and continue their goal of trying to kill Americans. And as a tax payer, I don't want my money going to provide the funds to pay a defense lawyer for a suspected terrorist.

 

[Entropy]

That's exactly what I was trying to say. Well put bro.

Mesa, again, I understand a bit of where you are coming from. But your answer is to use extreme methods on possibly innocent people, simply because we were wronged on 9/11. What they were trying to tell you on the last page was that if you had even known someone that was a suspected terrorist... even if you turned them in... You could be taken to GITMO.

And while there, you would have absolutely NO rights of due process, and they could hold you indefinitely without any proof that you were in on your friend's plan. Even though you are a US Citizen and probably only met your friend once back in college.

If that's not scary to you, or at least morally skewed... Then something is wrong bro.

But didn't you know we're justified doing whatever we want to whoever we want because of 9/11. Court of law? Due process? screw it, we're America, the shining city on the hill that can do what it wants. We got attacked so the gov should torture and detain whoever they feel like and the American people should just take it and not ask questions. Our tax dollars should not be used to defend anyone suspected to be guilty of any terrible crime.

 

[Mesa]

We got attacked so the gov should detain whoever they feel [to be a viable threat to national security] and the American people should not ask questions. Our tax dollars should not be used to defend anyone suspected to be guilty of any terrible crime.

There, fixed.

 

[Entropy]

There, fixed.

I totally agree. string 'em up man. I certainly trust our government. They should be able to lock up anyone they feel like without any charges or proof of wrongdoing. That pesky Constitution doesn't mean anything. Squashing human rights is patriotic, it's what this nation was founded on.

 

[DarkArtist81]

Ok, Scott... How about this?

July 21, 2008, New York -- Today, for the first time, a federal court ordered the release into the United States of 17 innocent Uighur men who have been imprisoned at Guantánamo Bay for nearly seven years. The men are refugees who would face persecution and imprisonment, if not death, if returned to their native China.

"In the history of our Republic, the military never imprisoned any man so harshly, and for so long, let alone men who are not the enemy. We have broken faith with the rule of law, and been untrue to the generosity of spirit that is our national character," said Sabin Willett, Partner at Bingham McCutchen who argued the case for the detainees today.

"This is a historic day for the U.S. Finally, we are beginning the process of taking responsibility for our mistakes and fixing them," said CCR Attorney Emi MacLean. "For years, the United States has begged other countries to clean up the mess we made in Guantánamo, but the hypocrisy of this appeal was evident abroad. Perhaps now other countries will be less reluctant to come to our aid." MacLean continued, "Allowing these wrongfully detained men a fresh start would also provide the U.S. a fresh start -- an opportunity to turn a page and finally take a position of leadership in closing Guantánamo."

Religious and community leaders from both Tallahassee, Florida and the Washington D.C. area offered to the court detailed plans for the support of the men, from housing and counseling to employment and car insurance. In this stunning show of goodwill and solidarity, 20 leaders from faith-based communities in Tallahassee, Florida, and a network of refugee resettlement agencies and other religious groups, have pledged to help settle the men in local communities. Many members of the Uighur community came to court today to lend support.

Said Mr. Willett: "The volunteers who come to court today from church and community, from synagogue and mosque to offer sanctuary to these men bear true faith to that character, and give us hope that the better angel of our nature can yet return."

On the day of the hearing, Congressmen Bill Delahunt (D-MA) and Dana Rohrabacher (R-CA) also reiterated their June call for the U.S. to grant protection to the imprisoned Uighurs.

The 17 men currently imprisoned at Guantánamo left China amid increasing political oppression and found their way to Afghanistan, where they lived in small Uighur communities. In late 2001, they were forced to flee the aerial bombardment of the surrounding areas. Eventually, they made their way to Pakistan in the belief that they would be safer there. After crossing into Pakistan, the Uighurs were welcomed and fed by Pakistani villagers who then turned them over for generous bounties offered by the United States.

Last week, after years of litigation, the U.S. government finally conceded that none of these men would be treated as "enemy combatants." All were cleared for release long ago. However, because of the stigma of their detention at Guantánamo and for fear of offending China, no other country had agreed to offer these men safe haven. Despite this failure to find a third country to take them, the government argued that the court could not release them into the U.S. and, therefore, that the men would have to stay at Guantánamo indefinitely.

For more information on the Uighurs' story, click here.

CCR has led the legal battle over Guantánamo for the last six years -- sending the first ever habeas attorney to the base and sending the first attorney to meet with a former CIA "ghost detainee." CCR has been responsible for organizing and coordinating more than 500 pro bono lawyers across the country in order to represent the men at Guantánamo, ensuring that nearly all have the option of legal representation. CCR represented the detainees with co-counsel in the most recent argument before the Supreme Court in 2007.

I guess just because we got wounded nationally, that it's ok to allow tyranny to set roots in our country. I guess that the terrorists DID win.

If we allow things like this to happen, we incite MORE terrorism and hate across the world. We look like insane hypocrites at the moment, thanks to idiotic things like GITMO. If you are in support of such radical means of securing our freedoms, well... you're lost... and I don't think you'll ever change your mind.

 

[Mesa]

Ok, Scott... How about this?



I guess just because we got wounded nationally, that it's ok to allow tyranny to set roots in our country. I guess that the terrorists DID win.

If we allow things like this to happen, we incite MORE terrorism and hate across the world. We look like insane hypocrites at the moment, thanks to idiotic things like GITMO. If you are in support of such radical means of securing our freedoms, well... you're lost... and I don't think you'll ever change your mind.

thanks for the link, it is apprciated.

Stories like this are unfortunate. I'm glad to see these men who appear to have very little involvement are finally being granted asylum. I never said the system was perfect. I still think they represent a very small minority of the majority of detainees at Guantanamo. To suggest that the US is the new gestapo that goes around in the middle of the night and rounds up innocent civilians simply because they are of arabic descent is ludicrous. When I googled "Uighurs and guantanamo" it looks like this group of individuals were turned in to the US by their own camp they were staying at in Afghanistan for reward money, and the men had admittedly received some small level of training that could be considered terrorist in nature provided by the Taliban and Afghanistan. I for one am glad that our government is erring on the side of caution when it comes to protect its people.

I would much rather the enemy's civil rights be "slightly ignored" while trying to prevent another mass murder of US citizens.

I wish we lived in a world where everyone loved one another and no one wanted to harm us. But reality is, we don't, and we must take whatever measures are necessary to protect ourselves. A terrorist still wants to kill Americans, regardless of whether they are treated fairly or not while be detained at Guantanamo.

 

[Wanderer]

DA you're a shining light bro. I wish there were more people like you with a balanced and informed view of REALITY. Total respect for you as an artist and human being...

Mesa and Entropy Chicken ^^^^?...you two are just a couple of xenophobes...i'm totally disgusted, yet again by your extremist and ill informed views.

 

[Mesa]

DA you're a shining light bro. I wish there were more people like you with a balanced and informed view of REALITY. Total respect for you as an artist and human being...

Mesa and Entropy Chicken ^^^^?...you two are just a couple of xenophobes...i'm totally disgusted, yet again by your extremist and ill informed views.

You think Entropy and I share the same opinion?

But you're right, I need to change my extremist view. because flying planes into buildings isn't extremist and should be tolerated. Same with sawing off a living human beings head and taping the act and airing it for the world to witness. That's not extremist, and we should try and work with these people.

 

[barbelith]

But you're right, I need to change my extremist view. because flying planes into buildings isn't extremist and should be tolerated. Same with sawing off a living human beings head and taping the act and airing it for the world to witness. That's not extremist, and we should try and work with these people.

Actually that's why you're an extremist, because you apparently have no room for middle ground between those two extreme positions.

 

[Kuzeh]

I would much rather the enemy's civil rights be "slightly ignored" while trying to prevent another mass murder of US citizens.

I agree on this, I hope someday Bush's civil rights are ignored and he gets what he deserves...


Sorry dude... you don't seem to have the slightest idea of U.S. foreign policy...
or what they do all over the world in the name of "democracy", "god", "peace" and "war on terror"... that's as extreme as it gets...

 

[Wanderer]

You think Entropy and I share the same opinion?

But you're right, I need to change my extremist view. because flying planes into buildings isn't extremist and should be tolerated. Same with sawing off a living human beings head and taping the act and airing it for the world to witness. That's not extremist, and we should try and work with these people.

Go back to polishing your shotgun son yeeha