1/6 Hot Toys BvS: Dawn of Justice-Wonder Woman

[GaryPool]

I'm confused. Isn't the theme of civil war about the human casualties and the complacency of the heroes over the deaths of innocent civilians? That movie had quite a bit of meaning behind the war even though it didn't take up the whole movie it's still the reason for the film.

Sure, but it doesn't really show the weight of it. Captain vs Iron Man seemed more at face value than feeling real. Compare Batman's reasons for wanting to kill Superman compared to theirs. It felt like Batman would follow through, whereas in Civil War it just seems like a hissy fit. I also feel like the DC films deal with civilian casualties in a more serious way. Prime example of Marvel films severely lacking in this regard is Age of Ultron floating mega city of unbelievable and pointlessly high 'stakes'.

I love the Marvel films, but they're becoming too much like they're telling you something is a threat or dangerous as opposed to actually showing it - for me DC films have highlighted this even more.

Not trying to ignite a Marvel vs DC, I just genuinely hope Marvel can look at Wonder Woman and understand that like DC perhaps needing a bit more light heartedness (although I personally don't feel it does), that Marvel needs a bit more weight.

 

[dario2739]

I'm confused. Isn't the theme of civil war about the human casualties and the complacency of the heroes over the deaths of innocent civilians? That movie had quite a bit of meaning behind the war even though it didn't take up the whole movie it's still the reason for the film.

Yes - the premise of the Accord is just that, and the amount of collateral damage they cause... the heroes then takes sides and proceed to lay waste to an international airport... I mean the damage they do makes a complete joke of the premise of the movie... millions upon millions of dollars worth of damage... also no regard whatsoever for human life!

 

[dario2739]

Sure, but it doesn't really show the weight of it. Captain vs Iron Man seemed more at face value than feeling real. Compare Batman's reasons for wanting to kill Superman compared to theirs. It felt like Batman would follow through, whereas in Civil War it just seems like a hissy fit. I also feel like the DC films deal with civilian casualties in a more serious way. Prime example of Marvel films severely lacking in this regard is Age of Ultron floating mega city of unbelievable and pointlessly high 'stakes'.

I love the Marvel films, but they're becoming too much like they're telling you something is a threat or dangerous as opposed to actually showing it - for me DC films have highlighted this even more.

Not trying to ignite a Marvel vs DC, I just genuinely hope Marvel can look at Wonder Woman and understand that like DC perhaps needing a bit more light heartedness (although I personally don't feel it does), that Marvel needs a bit more weight.

Funny thing I find with Marvel movies now is that the Disney influence is strong - Baby Groot and Dr Strange's cape felt like they should be in a Disney cartoon for example, that said I find it strange that the villains in the MCU are weak because Disney animated movies usually have strong villains.

 

[weisun79]

Ticket obtained..
Hype engine.. Initiated..
Tomorrow...

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[Romidar]

So that the opposite happens of what people say with DC - so that Marvel see it and actually try to add some gravity to their films and grit, all their threats so far have been so ungrounded that none of it feels like anyone is in danger, not even civilians of the world. The threats sometimes get real big, but there's no real weight to it. DC do it well, I think Marvel could benefit from it.

Most of them have been more personal stories than wanton destruction (tho Age of Ultron had an extinction level threat, Doctor Strange was the world being sucked into the dark dimension, etc,).

I liked Man of Steel but not because the stakes. BvS had too many plot and character issues to judge very well what it could have been (I just rewatched them in preparation for a Wonder Woman).

In terms of the stakes, I'd say the big difference so far is that the heroes in the MCU largely manage to succeed in stopping disaster and the DC ones haven't. Even BvS had to throw in multiple lines about the area being "mostly empty of civilians."

I agree with your premise that MCU will benefit from better competition, but disagree about what they'd take away from it.

I REALLY want to see the DCEU succeed simply because my first love if comics was DC. I want to be wowed by more than spectacle and Wonder Woman looks like it might do it (I'd kill for a GL reboot ;-)).

 

[sj2106]

Rotten Tomatoes is still a bag of ****!!!

I'm inclined to agree. I haven't seen GOTG2 but speaking to plenty of people who have it's nearly all negative. When checking out the WW reviews I was surprised to see it at 81%. Seems whatever the MCU puts out it's guaranteed to fresh.

It's nice to see WW doing well but I won't be surprised to see critics revert to type for JL later in the year. Pretty sure I'll love this movie and if the majority of fans do that's all that matters really.

 

[tworow2]

Rottentomatoes just collects information, it doesn't assign those numbers. 60% and up is positive.

 

[enzolt]

I think both Marvel and DC presented the theme of collateral damage.

I'm not really sure what "weight" means but we have to understand that Marvel films in general were made with a lighter tone than DC.

I think we shouldn't mispercieve the "weight" of the issue with the tone of the films.

They both presented human collateral but one did it in a serious tone while the other did it in a lighter tone.

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[Username]

Yes - the premise of the Accord is just that, and the amount of collateral damage they cause... the heroes then takes sides and proceed to lay waste to an international airport... I mean the damage they do makes a complete joke of the premise of the movie... millions upon millions of dollars worth of damage... also no regard whatsoever for human life!

The part where Vision chops down the airport's tower to stop the quinjet from leaving the hangar is laughable. Sure. It would only take them a year to build a new one, lol. Better to let the quinjet take off and disable the engines twenty miles away.

 

[Brobocop]

The part where Vision chops down the airport's tower to stop the quinjet from leaving the hangar is laughable. Sure. It would only take them a year to build a new one, lol. Better to let the quinjet take off and disable the engines twenty miles away.

Not to sound too critical, but you could argue that they should have just let them take off in the jet and then just followed it and taken them in custody. Instead, let's have a giant fight in the middle of a crowded airport on foreign soil. I love both DC and Marvel and see everything both put out. But I argue that the criticisms that people have DC often times appear in Marvel. How many people have Captain America, Iron Man, and everyone else killed? Not just aliens, but people.

 

[GaryPool]

I think both Marvel and DC presented the theme of collateral damage.

I'm not really sure what "weight" means but we have to understand that Marvel films in general were made with a lighter tone than DC.

I think we shouldn't mispercieve the "weight" of the issue with the tone of the films.

They both presented human collateral but one did it in a serious tone while the other did it in a lighter tone.

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Sure they do, but Marvel doesn't really show the tragedy of it, at least not on a deep level. That's what I mean by weight - BvS deals directly with that, the deaths it caused, the injuries it caused, the hatred it caused, the divide it caused, show the impact and real world repercussions it would have.

Even with Scarlet Witch doing what she does in Civil War only really scratches the surface of it. It's one of the complaints I hate against MoS, of course there would be collateral deaths, and the situation around it would be awful - DC doesn't shy away from it. You can't really deal with such themes in a light hearted manner and expect people to buy into the seriousness or levity of it, in the end the threats aren't really, the danger doesn't seem grounded. And as much as Civil War tried to address it, I think they were way, way of the mark

 

[ImABarRoomHero]

Not to sound too critical, but you could argue that they should have just let them take off in the jet and then just followed it and taken them in custody. Instead, let's have a giant fight in the middle of a crowded airport on foreign soil. I love both DC and Marvel and see everything both put out. But I argue that the criticisms that people have DC often times appear in Marvel. How many people have Captain America, Iron Man, and everyone else killed? Not just aliens, but people.

I just needed to let you know, I didn't read any of this. It could literally be filled with threats, racist remarks, and grammatical errors and I wouldn't bat an eye simply due to the fact that your username is that remarkable. Bravo sir, bravo.

P.S. I actually did read what you said and agree with it fully, but I am biased.... due to your amazing username.

 

[Username]

Not to sound too critical, but you could argue that they should have just let them take off in the jet and then just followed it and taken them in custody. Instead, let's have a giant fight in the middle of a crowded airport on foreign soil. I love both DC and Marvel and see everything both put out. But I argue that the criticisms that people have DC often times appear in Marvel. How many people have Captain America, Iron Man, and everyone else killed? Not just aliens, but people.

Yeah. I didn't mean to be critical of the Marvel movies. I love DC and Marvel and have no idea why people argue about what's the best. They are BOTH the best, lol.
Except Guardians. Biggest pile of horse manure ever, lol.

 

[weisun79]

Hope there will be a release tomorrow....

 

[guy66657]

Not sure if this is new or not

 

[weisun79]

Not sure if this is new or not

It's an old photo at secretbase when they opened for PO last year..

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[s6001]

Yeah, also Superman has the MOS headsculpt which made people lose their minds

 

[dario2739]

Sure they do, but Marvel doesn't really show the tragedy of it, at least not on a deep level. That's what I mean by weight - BvS deals directly with that, the deaths it caused, the injuries it caused, the hatred it caused, the divide it caused, show the impact and real world repercussions it would have.

Even with Scarlet Witch doing what she does in Civil War only really scratches the surface of it. It's one of the complaints I hate against MoS, of course there would be collateral deaths, and the situation around it would be awful - DC doesn't shy away from it. You can't really deal with such themes in a light hearted manner and expect people to buy into the seriousness or levity of it, in the end the threats aren't really, the danger doesn't seem grounded. And as much as Civil War tried to address it, I think they were way, way of the mark

 

[dario2739]

The part where Vision chops down the airport's tower to stop the quinjet from leaving the hangar is laughable. Sure. It would only take them a year to build a new one, lol. Better to let the quinjet take off and disable the engines twenty miles away.

I find the scene where Rhodey gets shot down laughable – IM tells Vision to shoot Falcon... I guy with only a set of wings... so he didn't mind him plummetting to his death, but when Vision misses and hits War Machine (a guy in protective, super duper armour) instead, it's suddenly terrible... you told him to take the shot!!!

 

[dario2739]

...Anyway - we no nearer to finding out if WW is gonna get released soon?