1/6 Hot Toys - MMS 320 - Star Wars Ep.VII - Kylo Ren

[xenowolf]

But Maul couldn't even beat wee padawan Obi.

Qui Gon talked a lot of **** but in the end had no real skills.

Maul was incredibly skilled, he took on obi and qui gon at the same time. Qui gon had lots of skill and was also extremely tuned into the force, mauls fighting skill just got the better of him. Obi wan is arguably the greatest Jedi when you look at overall accomplishments, so I don't think maul losing to him after he just lost his master is anything to complain about. Darth maul is one of my top three favorite sith of all time and qui gon is one of my top three Jedi of all time and they are why I like the phantom menace, it's just a damn shame they were both killed off so early (as much as I like the clone wars, I hate what they did with maul so I don't count that)

 

[xipotec]

Good fight. Even the PT-haters love Maul.

He was the only thing I really loved about PT

Love that gif xipotec, I can't wait to go see this again!

Yeah I keep watching it and cant figure out exactly what hes doing....but that florish is bada$$

 

[SNIKT1950]

Maul was incredibly skilled, he took on obi and qui gon at the same time. Qui gon had lots of skill and was also extremely tuned into the force, mauls fighting skill just got the better of him. Obi wan is arguably the greatest Jedi when you look at overall accomplishments, so I don't think maul losing to him after he just lost his master is anything to complain about. Darth maul is one of my top three favorite sith of all time and qui gon is one of my top three Jedi of all time and they are why I like the phantom menace, it's just a damn shame they were both killed off so early (as much as I like the clone wars, I hate what they did with maul so I don't count that)

As far as skills with a lightsaber go, here's my take:

1. Obi-Wan Kenobi (peaked in ROTS)
2. Darth Sidious/Palpatine
3. Yoda
4. Darth Vader/Anakin Skywalker (peaked in ROTS)
5. Mace Windu
6. Darth Tyranus/Count Dooku
7. Luke Skywalker
8. Kylo Ren/Ben Solo
9. Darth Maul
10. Qui-Gon Jinn

 

[ronri]

As far as skills with a lightsaber go, here's my take:

1. Obi-Wan Kenobi (peaked in ROTS)
2. Darth Sidious/Palpatine
3. Yoda
4. Darth Vader/Anakin Skywalker (peaked in ROTS)
5. Mace Windu
6. Darth Tyranus/Count Dooku
7. Luke Skywalker
8. Kylo Ren/Ben Solo
9. Darth Maul
10. Qui-Gon Jinn

From what little we've seen of Kylo Ren, he's at least below Maul. I love the character, but Kylo still hasn't finished his training and it shows. Honestly, I'd wait for later films so we can actually see his full potential. Hell even Grievous is shown to have better lightsaber skills and he only got owned because he fought Obi-Wan "I beat Darth Vader in his prime" Kenobi (and that's beside the fact that Obi-Wan had to force push him to even end the lightsaber fight which would result in a brawl that Obi-Wan barely won anyway).

Also Obi-Wan is way too high up there. I'd place the Emperor, Yoda and even Windu above him.

 

[xenowolf]

As far as skills with a lightsaber go, here's my take:

1. Obi-Wan Kenobi (peaked in ROTS)
2. Darth Sidious/Palpatine
3. Yoda
4. Darth Vader/Anakin Skywalker (peaked in ROTS)
5. Mace Windu
6. Darth Tyranus/Count Dooku
7. Luke Skywalker
8. Kylo Ren/Ben Solo
9. Darth Maul
10. Qui-Gon Jinn

Not sure how you can put Luke on that list, he was never impressive with a saber to me and I loved Kylo ren but he struggled fighting Finn so I don't know how you could possibly put him ahead of maul, maybe with force powers but not with a saber right now. Also I would put plo koon and ventress on that list before Kylo and Luke. Here would be mine for the movie/clone wars characters...
1.Yoda
2.palpatine
3.mace windu
4.obi wan
5.anakin
6.plo koon
7.dooku
8.maul
9.ventress
10.qui gon
Now this is just based off saber skill if force powers were included my list would change and i think Rey and Kylo may make the top 10 eventually for me but they aren't there yet

 

[ZE_501]

Sometimes using big words to show a level of education makes you look stupid!! Have Great Day!!!

 

[ronri]

Also I would put plo koon and ventress on that list before Kylo and Luke.

It might not seem like it, but Luke is ridiculously strong as a lightsaber combatant at least by ROTJ anyway. Sure he's not the most flashy, but it's no small feat that he bested Vader based on pure lightsaber skills.

 

[xenowolf]

It might not seem like it, but Luke is ridiculously strong as a lightsaber combatant at least by ROTJ anyway. Sure he's not the most flashy, but it's no small feat that he bested Vader based on pure lightsaber combat.

By the time he faught Vader, vader was more robot then man and he was out of practice too, it wouldn't have been like fighting anakin in his prime. You have to look at experience and realize that Luke faught a few light saber duels and his predecessors fought them on a daily basis. Now if Luke had grown up and been trained in the Jedi academy and fought during the clone wars i'm sure he would have possibly topped that list but from what we saw in the movies I wasn't impressed.

 

[subzro]

 

[xenowolf]

 

[Asta]

Then the Rancor pit trapdoor opens.

He didn't see that coming.

 

[Veil1]

Kylo Ren is powerful, but unfocused and immature. When he finishes his training he should be pretty damn powerful. Maul is one of my favorites of franchise. A shark looking for his next meal. But the character was totally ruined in CW when he begged for his life after his defeat by Palpatine. He totally pussed out. There is no way the Maul in PM would cry and beg for his life. Pfft. He effectively went out like a Fett.

 

[momaw]

Don't confuse less flashy saber duels in 1983 with highly choreographed action packed ones 20-30 years later as being any indication of skill. Luke was supposed to be the most powerful Jedi ever and had the OT been filmed now the duels would have shown that.

 

[xenowolf]

Kylo Ren is powerful, but unfocused and immature. When he finishes his training he should be pretty damn powerful. Maul is one of my favorites of franchise. A shark looking for his next meal. But the character was totally ruined in CW when he begged for his life after his defeat by Palpatine. He totally pussed out. There is no way the Maul in PM would cry and beg for his life. Pfft. He effectively went out like a Fett.

Maul is one of my favorites too and I agree I hated what they did with him in the CW it did not fit his character at all!

Don't confuse less flashy saber duels in 1983 with highly choreographed action packed ones 20-30 years later as being any indication of skill. Luke was supposed to be the most powerful Jedi ever and had the OT been filmed now the duels would have shown that.

How could the duels have been as good, nobody used light sabers by the time Luke used one. He never trained in saber combat and Vader was old/out of practice/and mostly robot, ya Luke was extremely strong with the force but he wasn't a seasoned saber user like the Jedi of the republic so it's not a fair comparison, it takes years of training to become a proficient swordsman and you have to have people to train with and even that is different then actual combat experience which Luke had neither of. Luke was powerful and he had the ability but he just didn't have the training or experience and that's why he would never make my list, maybe by episode viii or ix if we get to see him in action.

 

[momaw]

How could the duels have been as good, nobody used light sabers by the time Luke used one. He never trained in saber combat and Vader was old/out of practice/and mostly robot, ya Luke was extremely strong with the force but he wasn't a seasoned saber user like the Jedi of the republic so it's not a fair comparison, it takes years of training to become a proficient swordsman and you have to have people to train with and even that is different then actual combat experience which Luke had neither of. Luke was powerful and he had the ability but he just didn't have the training or experience and that's why he would never make my list, maybe by episode viii or ix if we get to see him in action.

TFA has already proven this to be untrue. Rey with no training took on Ren and bested him. Skills with the blade are all the more potent with greater force sensitivity. Even without training Luke would have been a master blade smith just through his insight and sensitivity with the force. Luke filmed for modern cinema would have combined blade and force in a dazzling manner. Think Vader using the force during his battle with Luke at Bespin and amp that up 1000.

 

[xenowolf]

TFA has already proven this to be untrue. Rey with no training took on Ren and bested him. Skills with the blade are all the more potent with greater force sensitivity. Even without training Luke would have been a master blade smith just through his insight and sensitivity with the force. Luke filmed for modern cinema would have combined blade and force in a dazzling manner. Think Vader using the force during his battle with Luke at Bespin and amp that up 1000.

I partially agree with what you are saying, if you are skilled with the force you could use that to help you be a better swordsman but you would still need practice, look at qui gon, he was extremely strong with the force but he was definitely not one of the best swordsman. I'm not saying Luke wasn't good but definitely not top ten with a saber when we saw him in the movies, he wasn't even as good as qui gon with a saber and qui gon is one of my favorites and he barely made my top ten list. Rey was probly trained from an early age and mind wiped so the training would still be there, also Rey showed significant martial arts training and combat skill with her staff so it would not be much of a reach for her to be skilled with a saber(she didn't make my list either) Luke showed none of that before we saw him try and learn to use a saber, he was raised on a farm, not taught hand to hand combat of any kind. This is one of the reasons I like the prequels, clone wars and the old republic, you actually had Jedi and sith using their powers and dueling on a regular basis and that's why it's hard for me to include anything from the OT in a top ten light saber contest when they really weren't used anymore.

 

[ronri]

I agree with regards to Rey, she wasn't a complete newbie when it comes to fighting. Rey showed decent combative experience with her staff (took out two of her employer's thugs on her own). Heck a lot of her moves feel less like sword combat and more like her using a staff weapon. Given how a lightsaber is (presumably) lighter than what she's used before, couple that with her newfound awareness of her Force sensitivity, and I can see how she could have fended off a very injured and emotionally compromised Kylo Ren.

 

[klwn]

Maul is one of my favorites too and I agree I hated what they did with him in the CW it did not fit his character at all!

Same, grew up with him as my favorite vilain (plus LOVED what they added to his story through the EU) and they wa they made him feel (and even look) like a completely different character in CW was really disappointing. Way too chatty/weird, and not nearly as impressive and threatening as his "calmer" self.

I agree with regards to Rey, she wasn't a complete newbie when it comes to fighting. Rey showed decent combative experience with her staff (took out two of her employer's thugs on her own). Heck a lot of her moves feel less like sword combat and more like her using a staff weapon. Given how a lightsaber is (presumably) lighter than what she's used before, couple that with her newfound awareness of her Force sensitivity, and I can see how she could have fended off a very injured and emotionally compromised Kylo Ren.

Yes, let's not forget that we haven't seen Kylo fight without a massive wound for now (and he even gets a second one against Finn). He is very strong with the Force, definitely, but really we will have to wait until VIII to see where they want to bring him as far as lightsaber skills and Force power. TFA is only a snippet.
Overall he has this "unshaped" vibe to him and I am really hoping we see some drastic changes post-training. Let him become the ultimate weapon, kinda like Sidious tried to do with Maul but... "more". I want to see him become some kind of Malgus (The Old Republic trailers are still an absolute reference to me in terms of what Sith vs Jedi fights should look like on screen).

 

[ronri]

^ Exactly, we haven't see Kylo Ren's full potential yet, and it's unfair to judge him based on the final fight given how he was severely injured by Chewie's bowcaster (shown to be a very strong weapon), and fought both Finn and Rey, all while being emotionally compromised after having recently killed his father. I look forward to how he further develops in the sequels.

 

[jedijim3002]

Got this for Christmas. Looks pretty decent except for all the buttons and battery compartment being on top of the head instead of inside the helmet. But nice detail. Not worth the $80.00 in my opinion but considering the other options out there it's probably the nicest one till the Anovos comes out.

Most likely display this with my figure when he arrives.