HT original Predator- photo thread

[ashkanls]

What does him wanting to sell his stuff on ebay have anything to do with you just recasting his ____ and passing it off as your own? It's no different than selling bootleg movies.

lol, The difference is I draw the cover art of the copy Just trying to be funny.

 

[bigpig]

What does him wanting to sell his stuff on ebay have anything to do with you just recasting his ____ and passing it off as your own? It's no different than selling bootleg movies.

 

[Lee in MI]

Does TD even make these anymore? I sent him a PM several months back and never got a response... So all the angst over the recast may be a moot point...He's moved on to other stuff.

 

[mosaicsquare]

look go further then here:

I do not understand what you mean. I have trouble with English

I have to say that my mask ..... can be molded with a hairdryer.
if you need to improve the fit

just heat up until you feel that the mask goes soft
then adjusted by hand and cooled at the tap
within seconds the operation is performed

I mean I'm also preparing an improved bio P1
attempt to fix some bugs ....
first mistake ... very sunken eyes
second error ... top of his nose
third form of error ... the top of your head
fourth error ... we must expand the back of his head and remove that way too round

I just hope not to see another hustler making casts of my mask to sell

 

[ashkanls]

look go further then here:

From what I took from that is he is making another one "New and Improved" and hopes that their wont be a "bootleg" from there.

On another note, Ford called me from his grave and said he was pissed everyone copied the car. Funny thing is that A caveman texted me that and was pissed at Ford for using their wheel! Its funny how throughout history everything is a copy of something else. It seems that ideas seem to get recycled and itellectual properties that belong to others are always bootlegged and bootlegged again with a variation on it.

That mask was originally sculpted with reference to the movie mask and Hot Toys for some reason didnt follow. Isnt this mask in question a bootleg from Stan Winstons crew to begin with?

 

[bangkok_wolf]

Does TD even make these anymore? I sent him a PM several months back and never got a response... So all the angst over the recast may be a moot point...He's moved on to other stuff.

To ur question, yes he's still doing them. But his reply to me was that he was busy finishing all the
old orders and was going on a vacation so try PM-ing him again in a couple of weeks.

Please, stop fighting - lets wait for TD reply on his dis- or approve on ashkanls action and "is ashkanls
recasting them or making adjustment on the ones he bought?". We all know recasting is wrong but
try to listen to both side of the story

The choice is up to the buyer anyway - I myself prefer ashkanls's as i not really into the exact-movie-
accuracy and i liked the textured looking of the Bio better.

 

[mosaicsquare]

what kind of work did you do on the your versions of the bio itself? you textured it a bit ... and thats it? if that is consider a legitimate variation is is enough to make it your own maybe I should start should just start casting some hot toys products nicking a bit of it off and passing them off as my own work.

 

[baloo]

Wow... I do not like what I just read in last few pages. I will not judge for now because I do not have all the cards, but my feeling is this: intellectual property is sometimes very tenuous and always very complex. Some are experts to divert creations of others and make his own. Commercial law should not be the only rule. I mean is that if one ignores an ounce of morality, not only we forget to consider the other, but worse, to regard oneself. And so, you end up finding what you are doing as trivial... Anyone has the right to divert the creation of somebody else, until it is for private use. But from the moment it is trading, it falls into the illegal side if a copyright has been filed. And yet, it usually is not enough; a patent must be filed at the international level and be renewed periodically if you want to be able to claim a creation. Here, obviously, we're not at that stage. But the fact remains that this is expressly morally reprehensible.
Personally, when I see a commerce website, where an email is given for only contact (no phone number and less postal address...), for me, that does make me feel any confidence and I passed my way. I fervently hope that the illustrations used in printing on T-shirts are all royalty free? ...


PS: sorry for my imperfect english... My practice is a bit distant.

 

[iampoch]

There are workarounds to patents as well. Take one design, and then improve on it and it becomes something else as far as patents are concerned. Also, patents are country-specific afaik. There are also some really damaging loopholes, so much so that there are companies that are set-up to specifically take advantage of them.

However, I'm not sure what governs artwork, of which these custom biomasks can be categorized. I'm not sure if such artwork is governed by Copyright. Regardless, both can't copyright their work. If either one doesn't want their work copied, they'll need to apply for license. Since, I'm sure either one won't, their best alternative is to come into an amicable agreement. Also, both aren't made for mass distribution anyway.

As for the morality of ash's move, frankly it's a bit hard to comment on that. As said, he may have used a recast as base, but he has made enough modifications to make it distinguishable from tayler's. It's more of like a "why reinvent the wheel" sort of thing, especially since both don't OWN the design of the biomask anyway. There are so many gray areas here, folks. Bottomline, we can't JUDGE. We should let both parties talk things through, and reserve judgement till then.

 

[baloo]

You're right, but that's what I just said: we will not make a textbook case of this story. It is not worth the trouble. But it would be good if we win a little more consideration. Where is ethics? Where is morality? I would have said nothing if ashkanls had not bought a mask from Alejandro (taylerdurdem) and had not diverted for commerce. If he had made from A to Z as did Alejandro, there would be nothing objectionable. But this is not the case.
I also ordered an Alejandro's mask (it's a non-painted). I should receive it in few days. I will certainly improve because, as Alejandro told, it is perfectible. This does not mean that I'm going to do business behind... What bothers me is the lack of ethics of certain: this is not because the law is on their side they are right... It is the moral of this story.
I am not a dreamer, but what the hell, guys, a little respect for yourself!

 

[toyrewind]

I don't mean any disrespect to ashkanls but I have the same sentiments as the post above (baloo's post) when I saw the ebay listing. Just putting myself in TD's shoes, I would feel hurt and disrespected if my work was bought by someone just to recast it and sell it off as their own.

If I were wanting to sell & profit from something, the best I could do is to create my own mold, paint, texture, etc.

Again, no disrespect to ashkanls. Just posting my opinion on how I see it.

 

[ashkanls]

You're right, but that's what I just said: we will not make a textbook case of this story. It is not worth the trouble. But it would be good if we win a little more consideration. Where is ethics? Where is morality? I would have said nothing if ashkanls had not bought a mask from Alejandro (taylerdurdem) and had not diverted for commerce. If he had made from A to Z as did Alejandro, there would be nothing objectionable. But this is not the case.
I also ordered an Alejandro's mask (it's a non-painted). I should receive it in few days. I will certainly improve because, as Alejandro told, it is perfectible. This does not mean that I'm going to do business behind... What bothers me is the lack of ethics of certain: this is not because the law is on their side they are right... It is the moral of this story.
I am not a dreamer, but what the hell, guys, a little respect for yourself!

I was a designer for Fox Racing a few years ago. To shorten the story:

"Hey Ashkan, Hurley made this eagle and it sold well. Can you do a Hawk for our version? "

There shouldnt be any thought of ethics with this COURT CASE we have going here. . I bought his mask because it fit the Predators head. Hot Toys version wouldnt stay on my P1 head. I was not a fan of his paint job. So I customized it to the way I felt it looked best with the overall figure for me. I dont care what it looked like in the movie. You never saw Cobra Commander with the blue outfit and then a red mask did you?

I obviously didnt resculpt the entire mask because the wheel fit the car. But I turned the 17 inch hubcaps into 20in chrome wheels for me.

 

[ashkanls]

I don't mean any disrespect to ashkanls but I have the same sentiments as the post above (baloo's post) when I saw the ebay listing. Just putting myself in TD's shoes, I would feel hurt and disrespected if my work was bought by someone just to recast it and sell it off as their own.

If I were wanting to sell & profit from something, the best I could do is to create my own mold, paint, texture, etc.

Again, no disrespect to ashkanls. Just posting my opinion on how I see it.

No disrespect taken. Your opinion is yours to be said. I created a 1/6th Deadpool head and sold 30 of them. I saw someone casted it and was selling it for less. I laughed to myself and didnt make anymore. I didnt own deadpool, I made the head for my own personal use but I thought why no pay for the mold and resin I had bought with it and I did. I didnt cry to the guy selling it. Everything these days is a rip off of something else.

I dont owe anyone anything. As far as I know some of my shirt designs have already been ripped off and sold in China. What am I gonna do cry and say its unethical


Anyone has extra predator 1 fists they want to sell??? Casted ones are find too

 

[EndIessRAlN]

The way I see it even TD started with a thinner version of the HT mask. Then he upgraded it completely and turned it into something else which is the famous TD P1 bio we all love today.

Ashkanls should at least acknowledge TD's work when reselling a recast of his work just out respect for the artist.

Just because you can't prevent other people from copying your work doesn't mean you should do it too. I know in this corporate world, nothing is sacred anymore but I would like to hope that amongst the (online) community here, we'd be more than that. Above that.

 

[taylerdurdem]

wow!
what a surprise!
I think any normal person realizes that this is an ugly play.
has copied my mask ... he says he has changed ... but in the latest pictures offered. the mask is almost identical.
I never say that Mr. ahskanls have to ask permission from me. Who am I?
of course if I know ... not sell it.
Mr. askanls has the right to do whatever he wants .... but I'm not going to copy your designs as you do ...

What would happen if everyone did that?


Mr asklanls ... I found a lack of respect towards me. I believe that anyone would feel the same. I bought a mask and a week ... your advertising copy to your side of mine ...
my god .... some people think that the mask .. you've done your

a question for Mr. askanls ... you always do you behave so?

this ugly friend ... but I can not say anything ...


I apologize to those who do not answer but I have many Messages
I just ask a little patience and please write again

 

[baloo]

toyrewind, I am reassured to see that I am not alone in this view.
EndIessRAlN, taylerdurdem, my friends, we are in complete agreement, but we can see in the answer that ashkanls has just given to me, whatever we say, whatever we think, this will change nothing. That's what I wrote in my first thought: people end up thinking that what they are doing is perfectly normal...

 

[ashkanls]

toyrewind, I am reassured to see that I am not alone in this view.
EndIessRAlN, taylerdurdem, my friends, we are in complete agreement, but we can see in the answer that ashkanls has just given to me, whatever we say, whatever we think, this will change nothing. That's what I wrote in my first thought: people end up thinking that what they are doing is perfectly normal...

I wrote T and told him once I sell off the 6 I have left I will remove the auction. I dont think what Im doing is right but its not as extreme as you guys make it since T is selling is only in this location as far as I know. I am selling them in one location too. His move only on word of mouth and I bet this escaped sold another 30 for him. I dont want a backlash against me so I will stop. Since the mask fits I feel he should put it on ebay and do a favor to everyone that has the P1 and its crummy original mask.

 

[fawk3s]

Thank you Iampoch.

lol I have a clothing line in the US. I cant stop anyone in China or spain from taking my art, altering it and re selling. Also neither one of us owns PREDATOR. There are a million and one things wrong with this world from the kurupt judicial system that cost my pops $2.5 million in a class action laawsuit because Valero bought the judge. The gulf is poisioned for the next 100 years. 40% of that oil has evaporated and will be rained down on us within the next 6 months. 3 of you are worried about this?

Is Tyler selling his on ebay? I havent seen it so its fair to say that he is only selling on this site.

You like his, buy his, you like mine buy mine as I put my 2 cents in it and made it different. Different case but Mcdonalds didnt ask Starbucks permission to sell coffee drinks??? Starbucks for sure lost 20% of business on that move but......... "Child Please" Ocho Cinco

Tyler, here is my site, ContradictionWear.com. Take as many designs as you want and make your own shirts out of them and sell them in Spain. I think you were from there.

I dont see why anyone should buy your helmet. The sculpt is Tayler's and the paintjob on Taylers is a LOT better.
Sorry if Im wrong on this assumption here but you're probably selling them for more than Tayler, to make profit. So I dont see any reason to buy yours over TD's.

The fact is, though, it is allowed. But its lame to take someones work, alter it and slap your name on it.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[ashkanls]

I dont see why anyone should buy your helmet. The sculpt is Tayler's and the paintjob on Taylers is a LOT better.
Sorry if Im wrong on this assumption here but you're probably selling them for more than Tayler, to make profit. So I dont see any reason to buy yours over TD's.

The fact is, though, it is allowed. But its lame to take someones work, alter it and slap your name on it.

Just my 2 cents.

Good job being the first to jumping in the DEADHORSE beating party. The situation has been resolved. Here is your 2 cents back

 

[fawk3s]

I dont think it was that dead since it was being discussed just above my post. And I was just expressing my opinion so no need to get all butthurt.