Man of Steel (SPOILERS)

[Adolfo]

For a superior race they're pretty stupid when it comes to geology then, even the basics

Yeah it sounded like they didnt have sex anymore and had too many cable stations..

 

[morphosis]

Yeah, another thing on the 'that doesn't make any sense' list

the Kryptonians like Jor-El, Kara, and the Council didn't care about genetic superiority, it was just the bloodlines they cared about. Back thousands of years ago they decided whoever was a leader, a worker, a soldier, a teacher, whatever their bloodlines were back then, their bloodline would always be those types of people. So when they created this Codex, it was flawed because whose to say those bloodlines were the best for those positions in their society. Jor-El realized this but it was too late. Zod also realized this, but he is the one who wanted genetic superiority. Only the best bloodlines should be preserved was his belief and his followers.

 

[thenammagazine]

Well as unlikely as it seems, I'm with you 'Nam. Asexual reproduction can only be achieved through some sort of cloning process.

They seem to have what appear to be (at a fanboy type guess) artificial egg/wombs in which to gestate the embryonic Kryptonian until birth so then all they would need would be the deciding additional, DNA genetic markers and information coming from a sample from the Codex (Kotex? 'Nam...you naughty person you ) and hey presto, a new Kryptonian clone of what/whomsoever they needed again.

It fits inexactly with what we see in the film.



So perhaps a crucial but so far ignored question....genetically engineer from what...Lego Bricks? I know we can talk about 'the building blocks of life' but that is just taking it too far! The moment a person mentions building an entire race from genetic engineering, you have to have to have some genetic material to engineer in the first place, or you're just engineering air.

HA! Finally someone gets it!

the Kryptonians like Jor-El, Kara, and the Council didn't care about genetic superiority, it was just the bloodlines they cared about. Back thousands of years ago they decided whoever was a leader, a worker, a soldier, a teacher, whatever their bloodlines were back then, their bloodline would always be those types of people. So when they created this Codex, it was flawed because whose to say those bloodlines were the best for those positions in their society. Jor-El realized this but it was too late. Zod also realized this, but he is the one who wanted genetic superiority. Only the best bloodlines should be preserved was his belief and his followers.

You completely missed the point of the post you quoted.

 

[morphosis]

obviously you aren't following me. and no i did not miss any points. Your missing the points and details.

But I know you just stated this because you like to fight with people. So your going back on IGNORE.

 

[thenammagazine]

obviously you aren't following me. and no i did not miss any points. Your missing the points and details.

But I know you just stated this because you like to fight with people. So your going back on IGNORE.

The a-typical response from someone who can't sustain their end of the debate. Enjoy your ignorance.

 

[morphosis]

Well as unlikely as it seems, I'm with you 'Nam. Asexual reproduction can only be achieved through some sort of cloning process.

you can take the egg and sperm from different donors to create babies. Its not cloning. We have been doing this here on our planet for a long time. And you can select who your donor is. You can select the DNA you want your baby to come from. But its human "choice" that makes our human race here on earth (for the most part). But on MoS Krypton, the baby had no choice. If he/she was born from a Warriors DNA, they had to train to be a warrior. They couldn't decide on their own what they wanted to be a teacher or doctor. The flaw was that maybe that DNA was really not suited to be the best leader, warrior, scientist, etc...Jor-El knew this, and a better society would be one where we can chose what they want to be like it was wayyy back when they didn't have this birthing process. Thats when Krypton was striving.

But anyway, they took the egg+sperm from selected DNA based off the Codex, and grew the babies in the Genesis Chamber. We don't have 100% specifics on how they exactly did it, but that was the implied process.

The Codex is data, its a registry of the citizens of Krypton. And you can look up on it who is/was what in their life, what was their DNA, etc...again we don't have 100% the science behind it, but thats what it basically is.

 

[galmando]

Waitaminute!!

They stole this entire idea from Antz!!!

 

[Adolfo]

Waitaminute!!

They stole this entire idea from Antz!!!

LOL...Waited for that one from someone

 

[galmando]

LOL...Waited for that one from someone

The connections run deeper! Superman, Gene Hackman, - Gene Hackman, Antz! Antz - Man of STEEL (featuring Superman!)

It's a conspiracy

 

[morphosis]

Waitaminute!!

They stole this entire idea from Antz!!!

its not a new concept by any means...but if Antz helps people understand it, then yes....Yay!!!!

 

[DGTWoodward]

you can take the egg and sperm from different donors to create babies. Its not cloning. We have been doing this here on our planet for a long time. And you can select who your donor is. You can select the DNA you want your baby to come from. But its human "choice" that makes our human race here on earth (for the most part). But on MoS Krypton, the baby had no choice. If he/she was born from a Warriors DNA, they had to train to be a warrior. They couldn't decide on their own what they wanted to be a teacher or doctor. The flaw was that maybe that DNA was really not suited to be the best leader, warrior, scientist, etc...Jor-El knew this, and a better society would be one where we can chose what they want to be like it was wayyy back when they didn't have this birthing process. Thats when Krypton was striving.

But anyway, they took the egg+sperm from selected DNA based off the Codex, and grew the babies in the Genesis Chamber. We don't have 100% specifics on how they exactly did it, but that was the implied process.

The Codex is data, its a registry of the citizens of Krypton. And you can look up on it who is/was what in their life, what was their DNA, etc...again we don't have 100% the science behind it, but thats what it basically is.

But with the greatest respect, was that not the whole 'special' thing about the birth of Kal-El, the fact that he had been born naturally rather than the genetic tricks being perpetrated by the Kryptonian Elders? The kind of genetic control (or as Zod saw it, plain interference) that had led them unto eventual death and stagnation.

 

[morphosis]

But with the greatest respect, was that not the whole 'special' thing about the birth of Kal-El, the fact that he had been born naturally rather than the genetic tricks being perpetrated by the Kryptonian Elders? The kind of genetic control (or as Zod saw it, plain interference) that had led them unto eventual death and stagnation.

I think people got confused and thought they couldn't have natural child birth. They could, but it was against their laws and beliefs. thats why Zod yells "Heresy"....because it was against their customs and beliefs to have natural child birth.

The issue is that there wasn't enough time to show everyday life on Krypton in MoS. They had very very strict customs and laws. Their society, you cannot compare it to our society because we have so many different beliefs and laws in every single country. In theirs, its implied they all followed 1 society rules and laws, and went on for thousands of years.

But i think people thought they couldnt physically have natural child birth, but that's not the case. Thats why the word "Heresy" is very important to show is was a violation of laws and beliefs, not a violation of science or a miracle.

 

[DGTWoodward]

I think people got confused and thought they couldn't have natural child birth. They could, but it was against their laws and beliefs. thats why Zod yells "Heresy"....because it was against their customs and beliefs to have natural child birth.

The issue is that there wasn't enough time to show everyday life on Krypton in MoS. They had very very strict customs and laws. Their society, you cannot compare it to our society because we have so many different beliefs and laws in every single country. In theirs, its implied they all followed 1 society rules and laws, and went on for thousands of years.

But i think people thought they couldnt physically have natural child birth, but that's not the case. Thats why the word "Heresy" is very important to show is was a violation of laws and beliefs, not a violation of science or a miracle.

No, I took it form the context within the film that they could, but somewhere and somehow...had just decided not to. I never thought they couldn't.

But I agree with you about not having screen time for showing exactly how important this all was to Kryptonians in general...within the film it was certainly serious enough to start a coup-de-tat by Zod and his militant faction. Perhaps Snyder could have sacrificed some building destroying at the end (which was spectacular but went on for just too long) in favour of clarifying more constructively and effectively just how cemented into this system Krypton actually was. This would have bookended the two ends of the film very well, without all of this debate.

 

[thenammagazine]

Instead, we're left to wonder WTF the Kotex was and why it was important. But we'll never know, because the sequel has turned into Batman and Friends.

 

[galmando]

Instead, we're left to wonder WTF the Kotex was and why it was important. But we'll never know, because the sequel has turned into Batman and Friends.

IT'S A CODEX!!!!!!

 

[thenammagazine]

IT'S A CODEX!!!!!!

Ya think?

 

[galmando]

Ya think?

You're gonna keep spelling it Kotex, aren't you

 

[DGTWoodward]

You're gonna keep spelling it Kotex, aren't you

I'd say yes.

 

[morphosis]

No, I took it form the context within the film that they could, but somewhere and somehow...had just decided not to. I never thought they couldn't.

But I agree with you about not having screen time for showing exactly how important this all was to Kryptonians in general...within the film it was certainly serious enough to start a coup-de-tat by Zod and his militant faction. Perhaps Snyder could have sacrificed some building destroying at the end (which was spectacular but went on for just too long) in favour of clarifying more constructively and effectively just how cemented into this system Krypton actually was. This would have bookended the two ends of the film very well, without all of this debate.

Cool. ya, some people think they couldn't physically have natural child birth anymore, but that wasnt they case. they just as a society chose not to and made it law most likely from whatever political rule was at the time. It was sort of a knock at our real society too.

I would love a Krypton film...like a Jor-El movie from this world. Love to see more about how they were explorers and achieved wonders and then the downfall when some ruler probably took over and changed their ways. Would really love to see more of that

 

[abake]

Well as unlikely as it seems, I'm with you 'Nam. Asexual reproduction can only be achieved through some sort of cloning process.

They seem to have what appear to be (at a fanboy type guess) artificial egg/wombs in which to gestate the embryonic Kryptonian until birth so then all they would need would be the deciding additional, DNA genetic markers and information coming from a sample from the Codex (Kotex? 'Nam...you naughty person you ) and hey presto, a new Kryptonian clone of what/whomsoever they needed again.

It fits inexactly with what we see in the film.



So perhaps a crucial but so far ignored question....genetically engineer from what...Lego Bricks? I know we can talk about 'the building blocks of life' but that is just taking it too far! The moment a person mentions building an entire race from genetic engineering, you have to have to have some genetic material to engineer in the first place, or you're just engineering air.

I probably didn't express myself very well.
What I think is going on is basically "test-tube babies". The way I see it, they fertilize krytonian ova in vitro and genetically manipulate them to certain standards they want.