Masters of the Universe Classics

[Kuzeh]

Hey Eamon,
Please answer me this... Am I not allowed to enjoy your MOTU art, Emiliano's, Axel's, Dave Wilkin's, 4H's and other artists at the same time?

Am I not allowed to enjoy the MOTU figures I like by Mattel without being labeled an apologist?

Am I not allowed to go to PowerCon just because I like your art?

Why am I supposed to take sides on issues I have nothing to do with and are irrelevant to MOTU as a whole?

Remember years ago when I told you the whole Val vs. Emiliano feud started, that YOU were the one who told me NOT to get worked up about other people's problems and enjoy PowerCon regardless?

I WILL support your art, even if you hate that I go to PowerCon... Contrary to what you might want to believe, I love seeing you succeed! Years ago we met at ComicCon and I purchased your Teela print and other MOTU Art, and I love how much you have improved and I admire how your hard work has paid off!
Contrary to what you might believe, you're an inspiration to me, and also Emiliano... and yes, also Val, and Axel and dozens of other artists.

I've said it several times, to you, to Val, and to Emiliano... MOTU fans are not supposed to take sides on these matters... Last I checked this is a free country and we are allowed to like whatever the f we want...

I know sometimes I annoy you and am a bit senseless, and for that I am sorry, MOTU for me is an escapism and one of. My favorite things to enjoy... So, I tend to be defensive about that enjoyment when excessive negativity hinders that enjoyment...

Again, I'll continue to enjoy all facets of MOTU as Insee fit, because that's my right... Sorry if it annoys you that I purchase Emil's book one day and the next day I attend PowerCon, or that I buy a print from you and also visit He-man.org...

I want everyone to be successful and I've seen that MOTU is big enough for a lot of people to work on different facets of it.

I don't care if people call me hypocritical, as I've said it before, MOTU is bigger than anyone's ego... It's been like that since it's conception....
Good journey and peace!

 

[Eamon]

Hey Eamon,
Please answer me this... Am I not allowed to enjoy your MOTU art, Emiliano's, Axel's, Dave Wilkin's, 4H's and other artists at the same time?

Of course you are. I have no idea why you would say that.

Am I not allowed to enjoy the MOTU figures I like by Mattel without being labeled an apologist?

Who labeled you as that as I certainly didn't. I work for Mattel, so again, not sure why you would say that.

Am I not allowed to go to PowerCon just because I like your art?

Again, no idea why you saying that.

Why am I supposed to take sides on issues I have nothing to do with and are irrelevant to MOTU as a whole?

You don't know everything and how certain products were affected, so yeah its' very relevant actually. For starters, do you think you would've had such crap card back art on the Filmation figures? Unless of course you feel Trap Jaw looks better off model and with three teeth instead of five? That's just one example I can give you. There's plenty more so again, actually rather relevant. But I also understand that is not nice hearing such stuff and it can tarnish things a little...but only of you let it.

This will be my third time saying the same thing so I hope you register it this time. When you originally said that you did not want to hear about the shinanigans, that's taking a side. It's certainly not on my side as saying you don't want here how badly I was treated is taking the other side.
You saying I was "taking smack" and describing it as such as though what I am saying is untrue is taking a side. You calling board member piccolodaimaoh "Oh you are one of those" after what he said is again proof of where you stand despite you constantly saying otherwise. Understand how your posts can be read by others.

Remember years ago when I told you the whole Val vs. Emiliano feud started, that YOU were the one who told me NOT to get worked up about other people's problems and enjoy PowerCon regardless?

That was some years ago. Stuff has gone down hill sence then starting with HM.org not showing the 30th Anniversary She-Ra standee in the news or any mention of who did it. Not to over state my relevance here but i think fans should be shown any new official art for the brand regardless of any personal issues. That's just one example. There are many more. This is the site that claims to be all about the fans after all right?!

I WILL support your art, even if you hate that I go to PowerCon... Contrary to what you might want to believe, I love seeing you succeed! Years ago we met at ComicCon and I purchased your Teela print and other MOTU Art, and I love how much you have improved and I admire how your hard work has paid off!
Contrary to what you might believe, you're an inspiration to me, and also Emiliano... and yes, also Val, and Axel and dozens of other artists.

Sigh, I never said at any time ever that I hate you go to Power Con dude. You might like to think I did as it fits with your view on things but I didn't.
FYI Val is not an artist. He colors comics and at that he farms much of it out to other artist looking to make a break. I was once on of these poeple at one time. Axel is decent artist but still saw fit to swipe from Emilinao recently whom is simply brilliant and deserves way more respect than he gets. I am always happy when others like my art and thank you for your endorsment. Though generally, I try to avoid pissing off people whom I respect, especially when they have a legitimate case....and the mountain of evidence. Unless you think all the staff changes on the podcast and many top moderators leaving HM.org is pure coincidence. It isn't by the way.

I've said it several times, to you, to Val, and to Emiliano... MOTU fans are not supposed to take sides on these matters... Last I checked this is a free country and we are allowed to like whatever the f we want...

That's all well and good but as I said you have taken a side. You not wanting to hear anything bad about Val or HM.org is taking as side. I had this same issue with others too on Facebook. I am ever so sorry Kuzeh for being treated like crap and that hearing such news annoys you. I will just bury my hurt because it bothers you shall I?!

Folks were treated really badly and it's still happening. Those with smarts see it. You don't. You were not there, you were never a part of HM.org a site that I put many days and nights to help build so people like you can enjoy it.
But hold on, you buy all the baloney you've been fed so according your insightful perception, no one has been treated badly - there's no art theft, no blocking of jobs or art in art books, no blocking of other art books .org not officially involved in, PCS stuff gets top billing in the news and is never bumped for fan art news, they always post news on products I or Emilinao have worked on, they don't control the conversation, always allow free speech, never ban you if your opinion is not on message and I was no longer on podcast due to a simple time issue. By all means carry on believing all that. I mean how could a person who say the things he does be so rotten right?!

I know sometimes I annoy you and am a bit senseless, and for that I am sorry, MOTU for me is an escapism and one of. My favorite things to enjoy... So, I tend to be defensive about that enjoyment when excessive negativity hinders that enjoyment...

Thats fine and I appreciate that but you describe it as excessive and I think that's an exaggeration. I know many folks around here don't care for it either but they simply ignore me or what I am saying. It's not your duty to monitor what others say because it irks you. Though I will say that I think it's a rather selfish stance to take when you hear news that a fellow fan who helps create stuff you enjoy is treated badly and your only response being is about how it effects you negatively.

Again, I'll continue to enjoy all facets of MOTU as Insee fit, because that's my right... Sorry if it annoys you that I purchase Emil's book one day and the next day I attend PowerCon, or that I buy a print from you and also visit He-man.org...

Good for you. I really love Mad Max and Braveheart despite the actor being a pig. I love Jane's Addiction but I know Perry Farrel is well weird.
I am just not seeing where you get all that from. Me bitching about price of exclusives should not translate into you thinking that I am annoyed you going to PowerCon. I have no doubt that PowerCon will be a lot of fun, so go and enjoy with my best wishes.

I want everyone to be successful and I've seen that MOTU is big enough for a lot of people to work on different facets of it.

Well I would hope so too but there is plenty of evidence that some do not share that point of view and activley hinder others from securing more work. I'd love to see how you would react in a similar situation.

I don't care if people call me hypocritical, as I've said it before, MOTU is bigger than anyone's ego... It's been like that since it's conception....
Good journey and peace!

It certainly is. You need to tell others this though not me.

You are reading into things that are not there and conjuring up things to cement what ever your own personal perception is and said perception is just incorrect.

 

[Kuwahara]

I know there's revisionist historians out there in the MOTU fan base, but I wonder if some people simply aren't aware of the terrible things Val has done to other people over the years. I think if people knew, it would make their head's spin. It's easy to say, "well, who cares?" but if people are going to go out of their way to defend the likes of him, they should really know what kind of a character he is first. This also applies to the legendary Scott Neitlich. I'll give people the benefit of the doubt and assume many just don't know the backstories, and chalk it up to just nerd rage against a forum admin and a previous brand manager. A little research will explain why so many have such well deserved bitter rancor for both of them.

 

[Eamon]

I know there's revisionist historians out there in the MOTU fan base, but I wonder if some people simply aren't aware of the terrible things Val has done to other people over the years. I think if people knew, it would make their head's spin. It's easy to say, "well, who cares?" but if people are going to go out of their way to defend the likes of him, they should really know what kind of a character he is first. This also applies to the legendary Scott Neitlich. I'll give people the benefit of the doubt and assume many just don't know the backstories, and chalk it up to just nerd rage against a forum admin and a previous brand manager. A little research will explain why so many have such well deserved bitter rancor for both of them.

I think it's unfair to put Scott in the same category. He was in a very difficult position and you could argue he put himself there but it was he who pushed the line and it doing so long as it did, which is longer than the vintage line, is a testimony to his work. He put his foot in his mouth sometimes but there were reasons why. He one dude in a massively and very conservative company that really caters to shareholder whims.
When folk see the He-Man documentary ToyMasters, it gives you some idea about the working environment in such large companies and how things play out as line gets bigger or there's a movie. I think you and others would be more sympathetic towards Scott whom I think did far more good than folks give him credit for.

 

[Kuwahara]

He is definitely a factor as to why MOTUC has lasted so long, I won't deny that... and when you compare him to the current team of "do-nothings", it only reinforces the above.

I'm really just taking about character. From what I know, I feel Val and Scott may not necessarily be cut from the same cloth, but they have MUCH in common in the "little to be desired traits" department. I think Val takes 1st place though.

 

[Kuzeh]

Alright Eamon... it's not the first time that we've discussed this... I am aware of some of the issues, but as you say, I wasn't there so there's no way for me to know what exactly transpired behind closed doors... I mean, I've been told several things by different people, so... again, for me MOTU is bigger than you, Val, ToyGuru, PowerCon, heck, it's bigger than Mattel...

It's my mistake to think that people would like to enjoy this thread instead of the constant flood of negativity and endless fingerpointing... I am naive like that... this is one the longest lasting threads in this Forum, so maybe I'm also naive to think that it would be a better place, but it just gets worse. And it's not aimed at you, but let's be honest, everyone takes potshots, including me and you...

I know that you have your point of view, and I have mine... and it's easier to jump on a bandwagon and spew malice and criticism left and right... I'll try to avoid that and keep it to myself... it's hard, as I've tried before... ha!
I fail... this is one of the few threads I visit in the forum... maybe I'm a glutton for punishment to put up with some of the crap I read here... :

Anyway...
I'm here for MOTU, don't mind me...

 

[Eamon]

It's strikes me that if I told you he deliberately ran over my cat, you'd still find a way to doubt it. You simply do not want to believe what I am saying which further proves my point.

If others here feel that I have dominated this thread with my bitching, please tell me now. I think Kuzeh is still exadurating but if others feel the same please let me know.

 

[Kuwahara]

It's strikes me that if I told you he deliberately ran over my cat, you'd still find a way to doubt it. You simply do not want to believe what I am saying which further proves my point.

If others here feel that I have dominated this thread with my bitching, please tell me now. I think Kuzeh is still exadurating but if others feel the same please let me know.

I think many will agree that you're not as bad as I am with the complaining. Still, I think it's totally within our right to speak up about whatever we want, even if it does have a negative overtone. The negativity apparently spoils other people's time on this forum, I still don't get why though. It's not like this thread is 100% negative. Nothing is stopping anyone from unleashing the rainbows and unicorns when discussing MOTUC. Some people feel this place should be NOTHING BUT positivity, and attack those who start going down a dark and dreary road to the Fright Zone.

The irony is MOTU is all about good and evil or positive and negative if you will. Such as life. Such as internet fan forums.

 

[BetterThanKenobi83]

I think the line is just winding down. The only people keeping it going are the diehards. I think most fans have had just about enough of it after 8 years. All the vintage figures have been released and now there's just a few stragglers from other factions, some remaining vehicles, etc. Then of course there's the disenchantment with the line due to quality, availability, and shipping issues. Some are upset about Mattel's poor communication because they're spoiled. They really aren't required to stay in touch with the fans, that is something Neitlich used to do because he loved the attention and because it did kinda help sales, but the new team is clearly oblivious and really doesn't give a crap. I personally think MOTUC has run it's course, but Mattel will still try and milk it for what it's worth, even though it may not look like they're trying too hard.

We still might get Snake Mountain and it sounds like more vehicles are in the works, but... Whatever. I actually like the way it is now. A few figures here and there. It's a great time to be a cherry picker.

I think you're right. From here on out I'll just pick and choose. Like I mentioned before I will complete the 200x sub line and get the rest of the vehicles I want but other than that I think I am done for now. If they release new 200x figures down the line I will pick those up for sure but I cannot see myself investing much more than that into Classics. Its a brilliant line but it does seem to not have a clear direction on where they want to take it now.

 

[Kuzeh]

It's strikes me that if I told you he deliberately ran over my cat, you'd still find a way to doubt it. You simply do not want to believe what I am saying which further proves my point.

If others here feel that I have dominated this thread with my bitching, please tell me now. I think Kuzeh is still exadurating but if others feel the same please let me know.

I'm not saying you're dominating the thread with negativity...
Let's put this to rest...
I am obviously failing to communicate my point and we're going in circles...
Others here believe things to be black and white and that's their prerogative...

Moving on... :

PS: We agree about TG, He gets way too much flack for things beyond his control... He did good in my book!

 

[takuGuy]

I was into this line back in 08-10, but got fed up with digital river and scalpers. Took all the joy out of collecting them, and I sold the few I was able to obtain off. Now I'm looking into collecting a MOTU line again because I just plain miss it. Looking through this thread and the ORG, it really doesn't seem like things have changed at all, and secondary market prices are laughable. I collected a few 200x figures back when that line was alive, and remember really liking the sculpts and designs. Taking a second look at them and I have to say I really like the look of them a lot more than the Classics, especially the stactions. Think I'll avoid the headache and credit card debt, and just go with the 200x line. That Hordak staction is calling to me.

 

[Kuwahara]

That's one of the reasons why I'd like to see the line finally end. Once the hype is over, secondary market prices will eventually have to drop. Then it will be cheaper and more fun to collect, although you'd have to wait a few years.

Right now the line is actually aimed at resellers, not collectors. It's almost like a retail line without the brick and mortar, with resellers being the new Toys R Us of our age. Mattel sells the majority of the product to resellers, then they sell them to real collectors. Why else would one think they have a 10 figure limit instead of a 2 figure limit? In the end Mattel made their money, and this is also another reason why they don't change their ways. So long as resellers think collectors will still buy these, they will continue to buy them from Mattel. Mattel will stop making them all together once the resellers lose enough money and stop buying them to scalp.

Matty only sells product on their page to create the illusion that "collectors are king" but it's really there for the scalpers who choose not to sub, and the sub model is aimed at both resellers and regular collectors.

 

[MagpieMad]

I didn't realise scalpers were still sniffing around this line that much! When I got into the line in 2010 it was horrendous but as MOTUC's popularity declined I was able to pick up the 2009 figures for reasonable prices. I know some vintage characters kept their high price but if you wait you can get the majority fairly cheap. Most expensive item I ever bought was Shadow Weaver for £50 about a year after initial release, which is double retail price to the UK. Also I've seen lots of people on heman.org bemoan the losses they incurred selling off multiple subs they bought to push the sub through.

 

[teemu]

That's one of the reasons why I'd like to see the line finally end. Once the hype is over, secondary market prices will eventually have to drop. Then it will be cheaper and more fun to collect, although you'd have to wait a few years.

Right now the line is actually aimed at resellers, not collectors. It's almost like a retail line without the brick and mortar, with resellers being the new Toys R Us of our age. Mattel sells the majority of the product to resellers, then they sell them to real collectors. Why else would one think they have a 10 figure limit instead of a 2 figure limit? In the end Mattel made their money, and this is also another reason why they don't change their ways. So long as resellers think collectors will still buy these, they will continue to buy them from Mattel. Mattel will stop making them all together once the resellers lose enough money and stop buying them to scalp.

Matty only sells product on their page to create the illusion that "collectors are king" but it's really there for the scalpers who choose not to sub, and the sub model is aimed at both resellers and regular collectors.

I am not sure I totally agree with this

Considering the line being produced in low numbers,I don't see certain CORE characters (1982-85) losing their after-market price.Over time,the market does dry up....The scalper's are mostly the subscriber's. BBTS is one of them and alot of subscriber's buy multiple or more subs for trade,re-sell

I am not sure there tons of scalpor's just waiting to buy up stock on day of sale causing higher prices

 

[Kuwahara]

I don't think the line is being produced in the low numbers they want us to believe. For a while they were adding SKU after SKU after SKU. You don't make vehicles and playlets for a line that is "niche". I think that's all BS to make it sound like this line is going to be so valuable someday. Like I said, I think this is just like a retail line, only without the retail. Instead of TRU or any other major department store, they sell most of their bulk to businesses like BBTS. Then you have the eBay scalpers, then collectors who buy multiple subs to flip for profit, then finally the regular collector who actually likes the figures and wants to own them. I disagree and feel most of the scalpers are non fans who see this line as an opportunity to make profit... kinda like Val. Also, I do believe in time MOTUC products being sold by eBay scalpers will eventually be priced to sell. It may take 10 years, but it will happen. I think anyone who is new to the line and wants to collect them all should wait until then if they want them cheap as possible.

 

[teemu]

I don't think the line is being produced in the low numbers they want us to believe. For a while they were adding SKU after SKU after SKU. You don't make vehicles and playlets for a line that is "niche". I think that's all BS to make it sound like this line is going to be so valuable someday. Like I said, I think this is just like a retail line, only without the retail. Instead of TRU or any other major department store, they sell most of their bulk to businesses like BBTS. Then you have the eBay scalpers, then collectors who buy multiple subs to flip for profit, then finally the regular collector who actually likes the figures and wants to own them. I disagree and feel most of the scalpers are non fans who see this line as an opportunity to make profit... kinda like Val. Also, I do believe in time MOTUC products being sold by eBay scalpers will eventually be priced to sell. It may take 10 years, but it will happen. I think anyone who is new to the line and wants to collect them all should wait until then if they want them cheap as possible.

So you think Fisto will drop to $40? Fisto will never see under $100

 

[Kuzeh]

After all the whining, I was fearing the worst...
Trap Jaw is pretty awesome, not perfect... But pretty kick ass figure!!

 

[KingGrayskull]

Is it allright to come to this thread and like Eamon and Kuzeh equally?

 

[Kuwahara]

So you think Fisto will drop to $40? Fisto will never see under $100

Yes. Like I said, It may take an eternity... but Fisto along with every other ridiculously priced figure will go down.

 

[Kuwahara]

After all the whining, I was fearing the worst...
Trap Jaw is pretty awesome, not perfect... But pretty kick ass figure!!

So wait, All of the "whining" actually made you worry that your figure might actually be botched?

Man! Those fear mongers are powerful creatures.