Shang Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings (September 3rd, 2021)

[GhostBeard]

I think AoU is severely underrated. Many people really hated the Hulk/Black Widow relationship and as a result (IMO) they threw out the baby with the bath water. It gave us Scarlet Witch, Vision, Hulk vs. Hulkbuster and planted the seeds for Tony & Steve's Civil War conflict (and it was written in a way that was more convincing than what was done in Civil War). It easily surpasses CW in my book, which if not for the introduction of BP and Spidey would not be rated very high.

I would put Shang-Chi somewhere in the middle on my MCU list. It definitely tops DS, BW, Thor, Thor 2, AM&W and IM2.

I also like AoU. I guess others have their issues with the flick, never bothered to figure out what, don’t care. It gave us Vision.

 

[jye4ever]

Chill, dude! It's just coffee lol...

CW is still a pretty outstanding movie and in certain ways remains better than AOU but in other ways AOU tops it.

Lets just agree that both are great and WW84/TSS are not lol

You and I will never see eye to eye on ZSJL though still the best superhero movie of 2021 with Shang coming 2nd.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

I reckon he was always well regarded as 'the best' Spiderman.

I think Tom Holland is better, but Tobey has the better films, villains and costume. Also, he's likable enough

Some even state his casting is akin to that of Christopher Reeve as Superman.

Those people are ********.

 

[matticus]

So are Asians still

CW is still a pretty outstanding movie and in certain ways remains better than AOU but in other ways AOU tops it.

Lets just agree that both are great and WW84/TSS are not lol

You and I will never see eye to eye on ZSJL though still the best superhero movie of 2021 with Shang coming 2nd.

ZSJL > 50% of MCU

 

[The Buffinator]

CW is still a pretty outstanding movie and in certain ways remains better than AOU but in other ways AOU tops it.

Lets just agree that both are great and WW84/TSS are not lol

You and I will never see eye to eye on ZSJL though still the best superhero movie of 2021 with Shang coming 2nd.

Agreed, AoU and CW are both excellent. Despite their being on cable almost every other day whenever I come across one I can't help stopping & watching it again lol.

Yes, WW84 and TSS don't even belong in the conversation. Shang-Chi blows them away as well.

AS for ZSJL, it has a handful of cool scenes but over the course of four (FOUR!!!) hours that's not enough to elevate it to the BEST superhero movie of the year (even if it had been the only superhero film of the year lol). I'm not even sure it should qualify, as it's a do-over 4 years after-the-fact and even so still feels bloated and disjointed. It abruptly goes from Aquaman to Victor to Flash in an attempt to have us care about these characters*, narrative momentum be damned. And while that kind of works, it's mostly because we've already seen them in the 2017 Justice League and the since released Aquaman. IDK, instead of learning from the past mistakes that got him fired in the first place and delivering a tighter, focused narrative, he decided to double down and not only complete his previous monument to excess but also throw fanboy **** like Martian Manhunter and Joker on top of it as well.

* - I still laugh when I think that RF feels vindicated by the release of ZSJL. I liked the JL Victor much more than the ZSJL version. Maybe it was because he was pissed off that 80% of his scenes were cut, but that version was more badass & had more of an edge, whereas the ZS version came across as a momma's boy whose dad was never there for him.

ZSJL > 50% of MCU

In terms of total running time (only), you're probably correct!

 

[matticus]

Agreed, AoU and CW are both excellent. Despite their being on cable almost every other day whenever I come across one I can't help stopping & watching it again lol.

Yes, WW84 and TSS don't even belong in the conversation. Shang-Chi blows them away as well.

AS for ZSJL, it has a handful of cool scenes but over the course of four (FOUR!!!) hours that's not enough to elevate it to the BEST superhero movie of the year (even if it had been the only superhero film of the year lol). I'm not even sure it should qualify, as it's a do-over 4 years after-the-fact and even so still feels bloated and disjointed. It abruptly goes from Aquaman to Victor to Flash in an attempt to have us care about these characters*, narrative momentum be damned. And while that kind of works, it's mostly because we've already seen them in the 2017 Justice League and the since released Aquaman. IDK, instead of learning from the past mistakes that got him fired in the first place and delivering a tighter, focused narrative, he decided to double down and not only complete his previous monument to excess but also throw fanboy **** like Martian Manhunter and Joker on top of it as well.

* - I still laugh when I think that RF feels vindicated by the release of ZSJL. I liked the JL Victor much more than the ZSJL version. Maybe it was because he was pissed off that 80% of his scenes were cut, but that version was more badass & had more of an edge, whereas the ZS version came across as a momma's boy whose dad was never there for him.


In terms of running time (only), you're probably correct!

I think that's the point though - four hours of content, all quality. Just crazy to see that in today's film industry, especially big budget. I'd sign up for a 4 hour Avengers movie anytime. The MCU half the time has some goofball humor that applies to the weirdos that laugh at everything and so they think it is the greatest thing ever. If you could take half of each of the bottom half of the MCU movies, they would be even better. With Snyder, you need another hour on theatrical runtime in order for his films to be better.

 

[The Buffinator]

I think that's the point though - four hours of content, all quality. Just crazy to see that in today's film industry, especially big budget. I'd sign up for a 4 hour Avengers movie anytime. The MCU half the time has some goofball humor that applies to the weirdos that laugh at everything and so they think it is the greatest thing ever. If you could take half of each of the bottom half of the MCU movies, they would be even better. With Snyder, you need another hour on theatrical runtime in order for his films to be better.

Well obviously the "four hours of content, all quality" part is where we disagree, and that's fine. You do seem to contradict yourself somewhat with that last line, though - why would he need an extra hour to make it better if it was all good? But seriously, I've said it before - I think his work would benefit from a strong producer/editor to rein in his excesses. I think he's often a victim of his own "wouldn't this be cool?" impulses.

 

[matticus]

Well obviously the "four hours of content, all quality" part is where we disagree, and that's fine. You do seem to contradict yourself somewhat with that last line, though - why would he need an extra hour to make it better if it was all good?

He puts a ton of content into his films. BVS extended and ZSJL both were way better than the theatrical. MOS was laid out script wise from Nolan and Goyer. WB clearly has issues with all of their directors and their continued directions, which is on WB cause they finance and run the show, or at least were supposed to.

But seriously, I've said it before - I think his work would benefit from a strong producer/editor to rein in his excesses. I think he's often a victim of his own "wouldn't this be cool?" impulses.

I don't disagree with that. Problem could be his wife is his producer and might not tell him what he needs to hear. I think Snyder was told to do things and he ignored them or did his own thing at times, which does get buried in the headlines.

 

[jye4ever]

So are Asians still

ZSJL > 50% of MCU

I agree BUT…

Infinity Saga as a whole > ZSJL

 

[matticus]

I agree BUT…

Infinity Saga as a whole > ZSJL

Zero doubt on that one.

 

[ironwez20]

So this is the highest rated hero flick on RT?

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

ZSJL > 50% of MCU

Interesting number. I was ready to make fun of your post endlessly, but after going over all the MCU films, with the exception of Bland Chi.

I like 53% of MCU films. That number might go up if I like Bland Chi.

So good job on that percentage.

I like 26% of the DCEU

 

[JMT1979]

So this is the highest rated hero flick on RT?

According to this: All 25 MCU Marvel Cinematic Universe Movies Ranked By Tomatometer it is #7. However, the fact that IW is #14 invalidates the list. That said, I trust IMDb much more than RT. In terms of audience score, it is at 98% but only has 10k ratings - compare that to TWS (92% from 250k), IW (91% from 50k) and EG (90% from 50k) it still has a long way to go. If it can keep it up, it will be very impressive, but weird since no one is saying it is their favourite MCU movie.

 

[matticus]

According to this: All 25 MCU Marvel Cinematic Universe Movies Ranked By Tomatometer it is #7. However, the fact that IW is #14 invalidates the list. That said, I trust IMDb much more than RT. In terms of audience score, it is at 98% but only has 10k ratings - compare that to TWS (92% from 250k), IW (91% from 50k) and EG (90% from 50k) it still has a long way to go. If it can keep it up, it will be very impressive, but weird since no one is saying it is their favourite MCU movie.

Hype of the week. I noticed TSS and BW numbers changed a good amount since release.

 

[GhostBeard]

Well obviously the "four hours of content, all quality" part is where we disagree, and that's fine. You do seem to contradict yourself somewhat with that last line, though - why would he need an extra hour to make it better if it was all good? But seriously, I've said it before - I think his work would benefit from a strong producer/editor to rein in his excesses. I think he's often a victim of his own "wouldn't this be cool?" impulses.

Completely agree. As a Superman and DC fan for as long as I can remember (my only comic tattoo is the Superman emblem) the "new" DC movies are painful for me, I personally put Nolan's work outside of this discussion. I've only ever re-watched Aquaman of the new crop, which I do every Christmas on Blu-ray because I first saw the theatrical preview in December and now I relate it to Christmas. I have no reason in the world to not like DC movies, but other than the new Suicide Squad (shockingly enjoyed that a lot) I can't re-visit those flicks.

My wife, who initially liked WW84, just watched it again with our daughter (in her 20s) and was surprised how much she didn't like it the 2nd time. These flicks just don't do well on multiple viewings (IMO). I forced my youngest son (also in his 20s) to watch the ZSJL cut on HBOMax and he was done just about when Cyborg was introduced. And, again for my money, as much I as I wanted to like it I couldn't because it was just more "wouldn't this be cool?" impulses. I'm glad there are people who enjoyed it enough to help get it released on HBOMax and to finally get that Cyborg figure. I was also kind of hoping Zack would come out and thank the fans and say something to the effect of, "and now let's all just move on."

But the beat goes on ...

 

[Neal136]

If it can keep it up, it will be very impressive, but weird since no one is saying it is their favourite MCU movie.

Well, it doesn't have to be. It could have a 100% viewer rating and still be no one's favorite. It just shows that a large number of the reviews counted like it enough to be considered a positive review.

 

[matticus]

Well, it doesn't have to be. It could have a 100% viewer rating and still be no one's favorite. It just shows that a large number of the reviews counted like it enough to be considered a positive review.

Why rate it so high then? 70% is still "fresh". General public initial ratings are weird to me.

 

[Neal136]

General public initial ratings are weird to me.

They are weird, and now that RT has instituted the "verified audience" reviews, they tend to be even more positive. Still ... even the "all audience" score for Shang-Chi is pretty high at 96%, with an average score of 4.7 out of 5 stars.

 

[Sassafras]

According to this: All 25 MCU Marvel Cinematic Universe Movies Ranked By Tomatometer it is #7. However, the fact that IW is #14 invalidates the list. That said, I trust IMDb much more than RT. In terms of audience score, it is at 98% but only has 10k ratings - compare that to TWS (92% from 250k), IW (91% from 50k) and EG (90% from 50k) it still has a long way to go. If it can keep it up, it will be very impressive, but weird since no one is saying it is their favourite MCU movie.

Well watching the Critical Drinker relaxed any need for me to see any time soon. And it's not like he outright condemns it; it's a thoughtful commentary. I shouldn't have since it's a spoiler review, but I just didn't care. I dunno. There's nothing I've heard that makes me excited about this film. Just seems like something I've seen before.

I'll watch whenever.

 

[jye4ever]

Well watching the Critical Drinker relaxed any need for me to see any time soon. And it's not like he outright condemns it; it's a thoughtful commentary. I shouldn't have since it's a spoiler review, but I just didn't care. I dunno. There's nothing I've heard that makes me excited about this film. Just seems like something I've seen before.

I'll watch whenever.

Actually it is very different than anything from the MCU and offers an interesting juxtaposition between Stark and his father and Shang with his.

Shang’s motivations are quite unique for a villain because his comes from someone who actually gave up his life of crime but is forced back into that life including an abusive indoctrination of his son in an attempt to get back what he desired most.

Skip BW but not this it’s worth a watch.