Solo: A Star Wars Story

[Spazz]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

Damn son... crows unleashed....

Actually, he has a point. Disney/Lucasfilm politicized the film, and then accused people of unethical or immoral intentions when they rejected said film for aesthetic reasons. That's a very dangerous form of "public relations", even from a corporation promoting a movie. At what point should people take a fascist ideology seriously? I'd say immediately, in every instance if we care about our freedom. It's not just about the movie.

McCarthyism is "the practice of making accusations of subversion or treason without proper regard for evidence." Blaming Russian bots and the Alt-Right for criticism of your film is McCarthyism, is it not? Should we care about McCarthyism?

The reason why we're talking about this in the Solo thread, is because it will be interesting to see how much of this continues. Solo was made prior to the backlash for TLJ.

 

[crows]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

Actually, he has a point. Disney/Lucasfilm politicized the film, and then accused people of unethical or immoral intentions when they rejected said film for aesthetic reasons. That's a very dangerous form of "public relations", even from a corporation promoting a movie. At what point should people take a fascist ideology seriously? I'd say immediately, in every instance if we care about our freedom. It's not just about the movie.

McCarthyism is "the practice of making accusations of subversion or treason without proper regard for evidence." Blaming Russian bots and the Alt-Right for criticism of your film is McCarthyism, is it not? Should we care about McCarthyism?

The reason why we're talking about this in the Solo thread, is because it will be interesting to see how much of this continues. Solo was made prior to the backlash for TLJ.

we had big Mainstream media outlets Legitimately blaming Imaginary Russian Hackers attacking a freaking Christmas movie.........
A Christmas Sci Fi movie...like if somehow the russians would somehow destroy America if this movie did badly.... what kind of drugs were they on? oh wait, I know, they were shilling for Disney.

This movie proved 100% that most news outlets are just paid shilling machines. they are not critics. they are advertisers.

 

[Spazz]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

we had big Mainstream media outlets Legitimately blaming Imaginary Russian Hackers attacking a freaking Christmas movie.........
A Christmas Sci Fi movie...like if somehow the russians would somehow destroy America if this movie did badly.... what kind of drugs were they on? oh wait, I know, they were shilling for Disney.

This movie proved 100% that most news outlets are just paid shilling machines. they are not critics. they are advertisers.

 

[Popnfresh98]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

I have an answer to that question, but I'm not sure if I can thoroughly answer without offending the mod. I'll keep it relevant to the Star Wars franchise, and keep it as short as possible.

The short answer is, I don't believe in natural rights or justice, because there is no blueprint for how we 'ought' to organize ourselves. Justice doesn't exist. If we share compassion (want each other's well being), I think the best way to bring that about is to get out of each other's way. How do you do that, in a world where everyone has different, unique subjective priorities? My vague answer would be pluralism, in a system where everyone has access to resources they can produce with, where they can organize on their own terms with like-minded people.

Rights presume some sort of "right-giver" who has jurisdiction over me. I don't acknowledge anyone's authority in that regard. I don't have a "right" to free speech, because I don't recognize anyone's authority to stop me from saying what I want. They can coerce me, but they have no legitimate authority over me, as far as I'm concerned.

In a free system, there would be no rights. Instead, I prefer contracts. In that sense, there are more aspects of capitalism that I like than socialism, with the exception of an egalitarian distribution of primary resources.

In the original trilogy, there was a sense that Han and Luke could join the resistance, and bail when they see fit. If they had to go to Degobah or to pay back Jabba, that was up to them. In the new trilogy, if you leave the way Finn attempted to, you're a deserter. If you question authority, demanding answers before risking your life in contributing to the group, you're shirking your responsibilities as a subordinate. There is an authoritarian streak beneath the egalitarian subtext of that film. The authoritarianism is justified in the name of equality, legitimized by strong women who, we're to presume, shouldn't be undermined because it's a sign of sexism or "toxic masculinity".

I want to avoid that sort of authoritarianism myself. Thing is, I'm not an idealist and realize some people crave authority. Who am I to tell them what to do? Hence the need for pluralism, more so than what we have now. As production becomes increasingly automated over the next decade, I'm hoping these issues will become increasingly relevant and we start having a discussion about social experimentation.

That’s fair, I pretty much agree again, though I’m not so sure if such a system would be feasible given the way humans work. It seems you’re not going to get much of an argument from me on anything.

However to the point of free speech and answering to no one, how does that gel with not being able to speak freely and offending the mods as you said? That means we do recognize their power to some extent in this very small localized example. Or I suppose you could say it’s the price for this service, but it still doesn’t sit flush.

Of course that is answered in your theoretical pluralism scenario, but as of right now, if one is answerable to the mods on this small site, surely you can’t believe you don’t answer to anyone else either? That kind of sounds like an idealism of a type. The only way out would be to get off the grid and live in the middle of nowhere.

Remember I say this.. but I still agree.

Actually, he has a point. Disney/Lucasfilm politicized the film, and then accused people of unethical or immoral intentions when they rejected said film for aesthetic reasons. That's a very dangerous form of "public relations", even from a corporation promoting a movie. At what point should people take a fascist ideology seriously? I'd say immediately, in every instance if we care about our freedom. It's not just about the movie.

McCarthyism is "the practice of making accusations of subversion or treason without proper regard for evidence." Blaming Russian bots and the Alt-Right for criticism of your film is McCarthyism, is it not? Should we care about McCarthyism?

The reason why we're talking about this in the Solo thread, is because it will be interesting to see how much of this continues. Solo was made prior to the backlash for TLJ.

I was agreeing with him I guess I should have been more clear.

If you look in my history I was probably the first person to mention the Russian bots reviewing TLJ story

I meant crows took out the balls in one shot by exposing the agenda so plainly with incontrovertible proof. Keep spreading that righteous fire!

we had big Mainstream media outlets Legitimately blaming Imaginary Russian Hackers attacking a freaking Christmas movie.........
A Christmas Sci Fi movie...like if somehow the russians would somehow destroy America if this movie did badly.... what kind of drugs were they on? oh wait, I know, they were shilling for Disney.

This movie proved 100% that most news outlets are just paid shilling machines. they are not critics. they are advertisers.

Completely agree. I know one of the professional reviewers, they actually are scared of going against the hype because they don’t want to lose their jobs. They just churn out crap. The independent ones are the only ones you can trust, and most of them are extinct.

 

[Spazz]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

However to the point of free speech and answering to no one, how does that gel with not being able to speak freely and offending the mods as you said? That means we do recognize their power to some extent in this very small localized example. Or I suppose you could say it’s the price for this service, but it still doesn’t sit flush.

Of course that is answered in your theoretical pluralism scenario, but as of right now, if one is answerable to the mods on this small site, surely you can’t believe you don’t answer to anyone else either? That kind of sounds like an idealism of a type. The only way out would be to get off the grid and live in the middle of nowhere.

Remember I say this.. but I still agree.

The Mods can coerce me, because they have power. Power and authority are not the same thing. If someone has a gun to my head, and tells me to wear a pink t-shirt, you best believe I'll be wearing that t-shirt, at least until the armed bully can be dealt with. I'm not dying over a fashion statement. That doesn't mean the assailant has authority. I don't feel obligated to obey them, but disobedience has consequences. I'm not subservient, but I'm a realist.

Likewise, the Mods have access to a lever of power in that they can delete my posts. I don't feel morally or ethically obligated to obey them, but I recognize that they have the ability to coerce me. I have no leverage, so I'm stuck.

 

[Spazz]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

That’s fair, I pretty much agree again, though I’m not so sure if such a system would be feasible given the way humans work. It seems you’re not going to get much of an argument from me on anything.

The way I see it, is that we should be looking at what we want from a system, then experimenting, driving innovation in order to get what we want. Idealism leads nowhere. The question is, why are we not innovating our social system, the way that we innovate everything else? Right now, oligarchs have decided that everyone will eventually be on basic income. They're experimenting with it, right now. Why is that the only experiment? If we take the free market, supply and demand seriously, shouldn't we have competing forms of social organization, vying for participation? Can this system itself be exposed to market innovation? I don't see why not.

 

[xipotec]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

I have made reading this forum easier by imagining these guys posting some of the conspiracy stuff....

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Khev]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

yeah, someone should tell Kennedy what a foolish braindead ******* she has been I dont think shes aware of this Khev. someone should inform her that her movies dont have the propaganda that you say they donthave , it would be really helpful if someone told her what a moron she has been about it




what a loon. what a nutso... if she ONLY KNEW these movies dont have an agenda

Don't make me you crows.

None of those clips showcased an "anti-male" agenda or anti-"toxic masculinity" progaganda. Feminism = equality among the sexes, nothing more. If KK wants a female lead in a SW movie it doesn't mean she hates men. Now whether she does or doesn't I have no idea (though I seriously doubt it) but none of those clips or what we've seen on screen promote the radical nonsense that you and Spazz are suggesting.

 

[crows]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

I have made reading this forum easier by imagining these guys posting some of the conspiracy stuff....

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

dr. rockso had amazing waifus

 

[Spazz]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

Don't make me you crows.

None of those clips showcased an "anti-male" agenda or anti-"toxic masculinity" progaganda. Feminism = equality among the sexes, nothing more. If KK wants a female lead in a SW movie it doesn't mean she hates men. Now whether she does or doesn't I have no idea (though I seriously doubt it) but none of those clips or what we've seen on screen promote the radical nonsense that you and Spazz are suggesting.

That's absolutely not true. You should familiarize yourself with 3rd wave feminism.

 

[crows]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

Don't make me you crows.

None of those clips showcased an "anti-male" agenda or anti-"toxic masculinity" progaganda. Feminism = equality among the sexes, nothing more. If KK wants a female lead in a SW movie it doesn't mean she hates men. Now whether she does or doesn't I have no idea (though I seriously doubt it) but none of those clips or what we've seen on screen promote the radical nonsense that you and Spazz are suggesting.

did we forget about this?"

https://comicbook.com/starwars/2016...kathleen-kennedy-says-she-doesnt-need-to-cat/

 

[Spazz]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

did we forget about this?"

https://comicbook.com/starwars/2016...kathleen-kennedy-says-she-doesnt-need-to-cat/

Yes we did. We also forgot about the video clip we were previously commenting on, where Kathleen Kennedy is delighted that meritocracy had little relevance to her career advancement.

 

[Khev]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

did we forget about this?"

https://comicbook.com/starwars/2016...kathleen-kennedy-says-she-doesnt-need-to-cat/

What about it?

You think I should be outraged that Kennedy doesn't want to "cater" to me? What the hell does she owe me? Nothing. Make movies that I like and I'll support them, make ones that suck and I won't. Chicks, dudes, whatever as long as the end result is good.

She's not directing the films anyway. She hired Gareth Edwards who *did* cater to me so win/win, lol.

 

[Popnfresh98]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

Chicks, dudes, whatever as long as the end result is good.

 

[Khev]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

The transports were cloaked. When DJ made the FO aware of this, they ran a de-cloaking scan and were able to see (and fire upon) the transports.
Now, I realize that if fighters were in the vicinity of the cruiser, this plan may not have worked, but it is mentioned by Hux to Kylo that the fighters needed to pull back because the Destroyers couldn't "support" them at that range.

You know I was about to counter that it still didn't make sense to hold back the fighters but your mention of Hux solves the issue for me. The very opening scene established him as bit of an ***** when it came to using TIE's effectively (as the Dreadnaught captain angrily exclaimed "We should have launched fighters five minutes ago!") after Poe stalled to get in position to take out the turrets.

And that's all I needed, something "in universe" to explain why the Fighters weren't covering the Resistance fleet and that's the character flaw of Hux that he relies on his Destroyers too much. Nice work Neal!

 

[Spazz]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

What about it?

You think I should be outraged that Kennedy doesn't want to "cater" to me? What the hell does she owe me? Nothing. Make movies that I like and I'll support them, make ones that suck and I won't. Chicks, dudes, whatever as long as the end result is good.

She's not directing the films anyway. She hired Gareth Edwards who *did* cater to me so win/win, lol.

Did we somehow enter a parallel universe where the goal of the competitive market is not to meet supply and demand? Are demographics no longer relevant in conducting business? Is Kathleen Kennedy unaware of this, or is her Idealism prioritized beyond business acumen? Either way...

You liked the movie. That's fine. However, subjective taste aside she objectively made a very poor executive decision, on behalf of shareholders. The fallout is just beginning. This is going to blow up in her face.

 

[crows]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

What about it?

You think I should be outraged that Kennedy doesn't want to "cater" to me? What the hell does she owe me? Nothing. Make movies that I like and I'll support them, make ones that suck and I won't. Chicks, dudes, whatever as long as the end result is good.

She's not directing the films anyway. She hired Gareth Edwards who *did* cater to me so win/win, lol.

it means she dont want guys like us in the fandom anymore. it means these movies are made to get rid of us, the last jedi literally spells it out for us
"burn the old, bury the old. the jedi are finished." the movie is literally telling the audience to bury the old fan base

the last jedi LITERALLY lost 1 billion in box office to make sure we let go, to make sure they new generation embraces star wars


it is very naive and silly to dismiss the mainstream news articles talking about the toxic masculinity of the villains in star wars because millennials and younger kids are reading that.

the new wave of fans will pay attention to those articles my friend. we are obsolete and left behind, those articles are for them



wake up broheim

 

[Spazz]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

it means she dont want guys like us in the fandom anymore. it means these movies are made to get rid of us, the last jedi literally spells it out for us
"burn the old, bury the old. the jedi are finished." the movie is literally telling the audience to let go

the last jedi LITERALLY lost 1 billion in box office to make sure we let go, to make sure they new generation embraces star wars


it is very naive and silly to dismiss the mainstream news articles talking about the toxic masculinity of the villains in star wars because millennials and younger kids are reading that.
the new wave of fans will pay attention to those articles my friend. we are obsolete and left behind



wake up broheim

Don't worry, crows. This is just a blip in the trajectory of a culture inevitably headed back toward anti-authoritarianism. It's like bullish and bearish markets. Right now, resilience is bearish, but we're at the end of a cycle. Very soon, just as it was in the 70's, 80's, 90's and 00's, the revenge of the deviants will lay waste to subservience culture... and each time it returns, it pushes back harder.

 

[Popnfresh98]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

The Mods can coerce me, because they have power. Power and authority are not the same thing. If someone has a gun to my head, and tells me to wear a pink t-shirt, you best believe I'll be wearing that t-shirt, at least until the armed bully can be dealt with. I'm not dying over a fashion statement. That doesn't mean the assailant has authority. I don't feel obligated to obey them, but disobedience has consequences. I'm not subservient, but I'm a realist.

Likewise, the Mods have access to a lever of power in that they can delete my posts. I don't feel morally or ethically obligated to obey them, but I recognize that they have the ability to coerce me. I have no leverage, so I'm stuck.

ah I see you’re breaking power and authority apart, whereas I was coming at it as one thing in this case. In that I agree, but ultimately even free speech can be stopped by those who have power, so which of us truly answers to no one? Unless of course you still spit in their face and go out a legend, but go out you will.

I suppose that ends this little detour

 

[Khev]

Re: Solo: A Star Wars Story (May 25th, 2018)

it means she dont want guys like us in the fandom anymore. it means these movies are made to get rid of us, the last jedi literally spells it out for us
"burn the old, bury the old. the jedi are finished."

You're wrong. The old were not burned today. They spark against the backlash has just been kindled. And feminism has NOT ruined "The Last Jedi."