Star Wars: The Force Awakens (12/18/15)

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Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (12/18/15) Discussion Thread

I happily ignore the prequels. They are not canon to me such is their level of suck.

Although if the new films turn out to be good and they presumably will take the PT as canon, perhaps even having Ewan McGregor or god forbid Hayden Christensen as a force ghost or something, that'll complicate the situation...
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (12/18/15) Discussion Thread

I LOVED the Ewoks as a kid. And i don't hate them today either. Yes, theyre a little goofy, but it's an alien universe. Who's to say what those aliens should look like.
I'm pretty sure it was just trendy for "teh oldar Kidz" to hate on them back in the day, and on some level they still think it's "Kool to doo".

nah, DiFabio is right.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (12/18/15) Discussion Thread

So, I have been thinking a lot about Chewbacca. Now, I know he died in the EU novels, but I am really hoping they treat that as a now parallel universe type thing and have Chewie back.

Thoughts? To Chewbacca or not Chewbacca....?
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (12/18/15) Discussion Thread

I LOVED the Ewoks as a kid. And i don't hate them today either. Yes, theyre a little goofy, but it's an alien universe. Who's to say what those aliens should look like.
I'm pretty sure it was just trendy for "teh oldar Kidz" to hate on them back in the day, and on some level they still think it's "Kool to doo".

Pretty much how I permit them in my personal SW canon. Absurdly 'cute' but then so is my Shih Tzu.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (12/18/15) Discussion Thread

You can't compare rebooted franchises that aren't intended to have any linear continuity (ala Batman) with a franchise like Star Wars that is telling ONE story in ONE universe. Your analogy has fail. My analogy was completely applicable. You just have your head buried too far under the sand to acknowledge it. I think what you say has no relevance and I choose to comment on it rather than ignore it. :D
Well I'm happy for you. Thanks for sharing.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (12/18/15) Discussion Thread

Oh snap, Karamazov80 Skywalker was just pushed to the DS by Emperor pixletwin and he swung his lightsaber instead of choosing electrocution :panic:


DiFabio's theory was just tested. :lol
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (12/18/15) Discussion Thread

I happily ignore the prequels. They are not canon to me such is their level of suck.

Although if the new films turn out to be good and they presumably will take the PT as canon, perhaps even having Ewan McGregor or god forbid Hayden Christensen as a force ghost or something, that'll complicate the situation...
I assume they will, but probably selectively, in the way that the midichlorians were discussed in the first film then dropped out of the discussion.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (12/18/15) Discussion Thread

I won't fault anyone for loving the PT and considering it canon. I don't. And I'm not an OT purist either. I love the EU. The EU that led up the PT was a big part of my childhood. As big as the OT was in some cases. The PT flat out contradicts much of the EU. Therefore, the PT in my mind is not canon because it doesn't fit in with the perception of the galaxy far, far away that I have.

As for Ewoks, I don't have an issue with them. I think if they toned down the cutesy comedy antics with them and gave them some meaner faces and tactics it could have been pretty cool. They should have swarmed out of the bushes unseen onto the Imperials like the scarab beetles in "The Mummy" do to people. 3-5 Ewoks wailing on Imperials with spears, axes, hammers, etc would have been pretty cool. I just imagine the ground battle to look like this but as bloody as RotLA:

gent80238-z.jpg

zSS200042.jpg
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (12/18/15) Discussion Thread

Well I'm happy for you. Thanks for sharing.

You're welcome. :hi5:

If EMcG decides to reprise is role in a spin off star wars movie (which IMO is likely), all you guys crying "poopoo" on the PT will flock to see it just the same as the rest of us.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (12/18/15) Discussion Thread

Huh, I didn't realise I've been an SSF member longer than you Kara. I thought you were always here.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (12/18/15) Discussion Thread

Vader's behavior reflects that of someone whose identity is pretty firmly established as secondary to the Emperor. It's another thing about human nature, we tend to fall into roles that become part of our identity. Vader breaking out of that role was another significant change for him of course.

Eh, it's weird. We pretty much agree, but we don't agree. I dunno. :lol

Anyway, I never thought Vader was bluffing in Empire when he told Luke he wanted him to join him and overthrow the Emperor. That's not strange to you? I thought that was Vader's game plan. Team up with his son, his blood (which I would imagine he has some feelings for) and kill that pasty bastard.

Now, I guess there's a chance that Vader was just fooling Luke so he'd get off that gantry and come join him so he could take him to the Emperor, but then that's pretty ****ed up. Not for Luke, but Vader. You want your son to kill you, join this old **** and take your place in this sort of hellish lifestyle? Whaaaaat? :lol Again, what is Palps offering here? The dark side doesn't offer any real temptation in these movies. Sure, you can be haughty about yourself like Luke was in Empire, I get "going to the dark side" in that sense. But by Jedi, the prequels? Where there's always this evil menace talking about "join me, take so and so's place at my side", I have to ask, why? Watchoo offering? Atleast the Devil's temptations were, ya know, enticing. Palps has nothing to offer than someone being his lil' gimp.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (12/18/15) Discussion Thread

A movie based on Ewan McGregor's Obi-wan? Sure I'd go see that, particularly if Lucas has nothing to do with it.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (12/18/15) Discussion Thread

Nope, I'm a newb a-dev. Only here for *sigh* 6 years or whatever.

I won't fault anyone for loving the PT and considering it canon. I don't. And I'm not an OT purist either. I love the EU. The EU that led up the PT was a big part of my childhood. As big as the OT was in some cases. The PT flat out contradicts much of the EU. Therefore, the PT in my mind is not canon because it doesn't fit in with the perception of the galaxy far, far away that I have.

As for Ewoks, I don't have an issue with them. I think if they toned down the cutesy comedy antics with them and gave them some meaner faces and tactics it could have been pretty cool. They should have swarmed out of the bushes unseen onto the Imperials like the scarab beetles in "The Mummy" do to people. 3-5 Ewoks wailing on Imperials with spears, axes, hammers, etc would have been pretty cool. I just imagine the ground battle to look like this but as bloody as RotLA:
I don't mind the Ewoks either, though I was obviously just an impressionable kid when I first experienced them and enjoyed the film. They weren't perfect, but they could have been worse.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (12/18/15) Discussion Thread

You 2008 newbs make me sick.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (12/18/15) Discussion Thread

I never thought he was bluffing in Empire when he told Luke he wanted him to join him and overthrow the Emperor. That's not strange to you? I thought that was Vader's game plan. Team up with his son, his blood (which I would imagine he has some feelings for) and kill that pasty bastard.

Now, I guess there's a chance that Vader was just fooling Luke so he'd get off that gantry and come join him so he could take him to the Emperor, but then that's pretty ****ed up. Not for Luke, but Vader. You want your son to kill you, join this old **** and take your place in sort of hellish lifestyle? Whaaaaat? :lol Again, what is Palps offering here? The dark side doesn't offer any real temptation in these movies. Sure, you can be haughty about yourself like Luke was in Empire, I can see that but by Jedi, the prequels? Whenever there's this evil menace talking about "taking your place at my side", I have to ask, why?
Yeah, I assume he was deceiving Luke, because Vader clearly knew his place at the end of Jedi. And when you've become so accustomed to certain roles, you can sometimes let that outweigh everything else. Vader was a kind of zealot, for the Dark Side, and the chief figurehead and leader of that religion, the Emperor. If the Emperor thought Luke should replace Vader, then Vader would be doing two things by allowing Luke to kill him--serving his lord (and thus, the Dark Side, which seems to be Vader's major driving motivation in the films), and allowing his son to be what he has been--the second most powerful bad-*** in the universe. You say it's a hellish lifestyle, but it allows you serious power and the ability to act out on your most base desires. That is attractive, isn't it?

A movie based on Ewan McGregor's Obi-wan? Sure I'd go see that, particularly if Lucas has nothing to do with it.
I liked McGregor's performance quite a bit. He was not among my problems with those films.
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (12/18/15) Discussion Thread

Considering he was technically a Jedi during Jabba's Palace, I'd say he was, well, a Jedi. :lol I know Yoda in his half dazed, cross eyed, dying breath says the only way Luke can be a true Jedi is if he confronts Vader, but that's sort of ********. How isn't he one? There's a huge jump from the Luke we see in Empire to the Luke we see in Jedi. He made his own lightsaber, has new force powers, he seems wiser, etc. Even his decisions before even facing off against Vader are noble. So he knew before hand what it meant to be a "Jedi" until he's pushed by Vader and Palps who won't stop buggin' him. So yeah, he's a frickin' Jedi.

Return nothin'. In Star Wars, there's Ben. In Empire, there's Yoda. In Jedi, there's Luke and Yoda (until Yoda bites it).

Besides, "crossing" over or "being turned" is stupid. Even if Luke chopped Vader's head off, who's to say he wouldn't (or couldn't) resist the Emperor? That's what I always found dull. What enticement is there in these types of scenarios? The Emperor is always like, "yo dawg, join me and stand by my side". What? What if I just kill Vader, kill the Emperor, and want to be "good" (i.e. don't become an evil dictator, support the Rebels, Republic and Democracy)? So what, if I lash out a bit I'll get Sith eyes and can't go into the "light side", huh? It never made sense. It's especially ludicrous when the Emperor and Vader's motives are dead set against what Luke is trying to achieve. They just threatened his good buddies, his friends. They're taunting him saying they're trapped, going to die, and that maybe they can turn one of them. Uhhh, why would I want to join them again? :lol

It's especially evident in the Prequels. Like with Dooku. Anakin just chopped the guys' hands off, Dooku is clearly beaten/frightened. You won Anakin! This guy is pissin' in his pants. You don't kill him and his life will be even worse. He even knows he shouldn't when Palps is egging him on. But . . . he does it. Whaaaat? Then Palps tells him to leave his best friend behind to die. Whaaaaaaaaat? Kill that old ****. Granted, later on Palpatine pulls off the old "I can save your wife bro" after some weird, backwards *** reasoning like "go kill innocent kids, then I'll show you", but still. What does this old, wrinkly bastard EVER have to offer? Unless you're an idiot, the dark side is pretty damn stupid. You'd have to be an idiot to "give in". Why the **** didn't Vader grab up Palpatine earlier in his life? As soon as Palpatine was like, "yo, she's dead", Vader should have grabbed him up then and there for manipulating him. But nah. Stupid. Video games and EU **** do the same crap. The offer that the "dark side" always presents is some kind of BS that can clearly ruin you, and yet, the person making the decision is having a difficult time deciding?

And as far as Prequels go, the Jedi and their council isn't any better. There are times where Obi-Wan, Mace, Yoda, etc. aren't being as heroic as they "should" be as far as the rules are concerned. They all have this weird lifestyle and are easily duped by a couple of emo *******s. Even Qui-Gon wasn't buying what they were selling. :lol


**** the light and dark side,


42218-star-wars_833648f8.jpg

Yeah, but Luke, even on Endor, refused to kill his dad. It's not some revelation, it was something he was always going to do. He was dead set against it. He's the same Luke he was in the beginning the film, there's not some huge character arc. He didn't want to be put into a situation that meant him killing his dad. How is that not "Jedi-like"? Even when he's talking with him in person, before the Emperor, he's handling it fine.

So, yeah he didn't want to kill his dad! He told the Jedi that, he told Vader that. He wants his dad to stop the BS and side with him. Nothing has changed. He's confronted his dad, but to no avail. He's even willing to die. That still stands all throughout. Then the Emperor ****s with him. I don't care if someone is pure of heart or a monster, everyone would try to take a lightsaber to the Emperor's head after all the provoking **** he said. Luke just keeps on getting egged on continually, but his answer is always no.

What's even stranger is Vader. His plan is to kill Palpatine right? Overthrow him and rule the galaxy with his son? Okay, why didn't he let Luke strike him down right then and there? Why deflect that? Does Vader like being this weird slave to the Emperor? This pet? I mean, Palpatine is saying right in front of him that he wants Luke to kill Vader and join him. Vader's a smart guy in Star Wars, the way he converses about the force (seems just as respectful and knowledgeable about the Force as Ben or Yoda, especially with his view on the Death Star). Empire? He's intelligent there too. So again, I have to ask, what is so enticing about going with the Emperor here? Is there really even a temptation? No? Luke is not once tempted. I guess you could say he lost it a bit when he goes beserk on Vader, but he never actually lost it. He did exactly what he said he'd do on Dagobah, Endor, etc. That he wouldn't kill his dad. Nothing changed.

Even though I like the moment, I always wondered if it would have been "bad" if Luke just refused to kill Vader, said he'd never join the Emperor and approached Palpatine with his lightsaber (to chop his block off) instead of, you know, casting it aside and getting electrocuted. Luke would have been ****ed if Vader wavered over the decision (that should have been a no brainier in the beginning considering Luke was, ya know, blood). From what Jedi shows, there is nothing enticing about the dark side, especially when your master comes out and tells you that you're easily replaceable and he's constantly looking for a newer, better apprentice. I guess you can get some electricity and royal guards, but eh, what's so great about those? Luke had an X-Wing and a green lightsaber.



And I agree, **** the prequels.

Eh, it's weird. We pretty much agree, but we don't agree. I dunno. :lol

Anyway, I never thought Vader was bluffing in Empire when he told Luke he wanted him to join him and overthrow the Emperor. That's not strange to you? I thought that was Vader's game plan. Team up with his son, his blood (which I would imagine he has some feelings for) and kill that pasty bastard.

Now, I guess there's a chance that Vader was just fooling Luke so he'd get off that gantry and come join him so he could take him to the Emperor, but then that's pretty ****ed up. Not for Luke, but Vader. You want your son to kill you, join this old **** and take your place in this sort of hellish lifestyle? Whaaaaat? :lol Again, what is Palps offering here? The dark side doesn't offer any real temptation in these movies. Sure, you can be haughty about yourself like Luke was in Empire, I get "going to the dark side" in that sense. But by Jedi, the prequels? Where there's always this evil menace talking about "join me, take so and so's place at my side", I have to ask, why? Watchoo offering? Atleast the Devil's temptations were, ya know, enticing. Palps has nothing to offer than someone being his lil' gimp.

:goodpost:

Great stuff, diFabio! I gotta say I agree with it all! :lol
 
Re: Star Wars: Episode VII (12/18/15) Discussion Thread

Yeah, I assume he was deceiving Luke, because Vader clearly knew his place at the end of Jedi. And when you've become so accustomed to certain roles, you can sometimes let that outweigh everything else. Vader was a kind of zealot, for the Dark Side, and the chief figurehead and leader of that religion, the Emperor. If the Emperor thought Luke should replace Vader, then Vader would be doing two things by allowing Luke to kill him--serving his lord (and thus, the Dark Side, which seems to be Vader's major driving motivation in the films), and allowing his son to be what he has been--the second most powerful bad-*** in the universe. You say it's a hellish lifestyle, but it allows you serious power and the ability to act out on your most base desires. That is attractive, isn't it?

Eh, I need more convincing. I see your point, but that doesn't really put Vader in a "bad *** light", does it? He actually looks pretty stupid and pathetic (and that's discounting the prequels, imagine if we included his original whiny ***** persona that killed a bunch of kids!)

Dudes like Han, Lando, Boba Fett etc. could act out their most base desires without becoming someone's "dark b***h". This light side/dark side, Jedi/Sith thing is sort of dumb the more you think about it. I think Luke had the right idea, balance. Why not choke a couple of Gamorean guards for fun? Why not be a good guy that fights oppression and tyranny?

Yoda and Ben have some great life lessons in the first two, but when it comes to ROTJ, hmm, I'm not sure. The story "logic" seems ****ed.
 
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