Star Wars: The Last Jedi (Dec 15th, 2017)

[DarthBakura]

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Actually it’s more like “...my sister, some girl I kind of hate, buncha sock puppets, some cool robots and a nice gay couple escape with an androgynous corpse and all my ****ing books.”

Luke doesn't know about the books because Yoda tricked him one last time

 

[Wor-Gar]

please explain to me why Luke was on that that island ( im not being facetious). What I got out of the movie is he was there to die, after feeling bad for trying to kill his Nephew. Therefore he didn't want anything to do with the outside world and wasn't going to train Rey even though he knew the "Rebels" needed her and his help. He just gave up and went there to wither away. I didn't see any hero qualities in him anymore and the drive to carry on help for his friends and family.

I've seen this "retirement" thing before where a strong female enters his life...

 

[Spazz]

Luke doesn't know about the books because Yoda tricked him one last time

Yeah, the one thing I hated about the OT was in ROTJ when Obi Wan's force ghost gave Luke the Post Modernist cop-out explanation for lying to him about Vader. Johnson saw that and thought, "Brilliant! We should have all the Jedi's constantly lying to each other, for kicks! They're a tricky bunch! We'll even have Luke play the biggest practical joke of all: He'll kill himself by Force Projecting! Oh man, the look on Kylo's face will be priceless..."

 

[Khev]

please explain to me why Luke was on that that island ( im not being facetious). What I got out of the movie is he was there to die, after feeling bad for trying to kill his Nephew. Therefore he didn't want anything to do with the outside world and wasn't going to train Rey even though he knew the "Rebels" needed her and his help. He just gave up and went there to wither away. I didn't see any hero qualities in him anymore and the drive to carry on help for his friends and family.

He was on the island because of Lesson #2 that he gave to Rey: "The Legacy of the Jedi is failure." He literally believed that the Jedi (of which he was the last) were terrible caretakers of the Force and that they ultimately always ended up making things worse. He thought (wrongly obviously) that he was actually benefiting the galaxy and his loved ones by staying out of the fight. His mask was indifference but Hamill's performance showed how much the plight of Leia and the Resistance were hitting home.

 

[DiFabio]

Honestly, it would have been better if Luke was just never heard from or seen again and just disappeared after the events of ROTJ.


But everything that occurs in TFA and TLJ paints a very bad picture of Luke. He's gross, he's a coward, he's cynical and, he's not very bright. He's a failure in pretty much every regard. He let the First Order gain power and prominence, he let Snoke manipulate Kylo Ren. Contemplating murder over the shoulder over your emotional nephew isn't a very good thing. Letting said nephew catch you? That's even worse. But to then let everyone else suffer because of the mistakes and go into hiding? Oh boy.

They made Luke an unlikeable loser. Rey almost looks justified when she starts hitting and threatening him. If he loved his family and friends, he would have nipped this First Order/Snoke problem in the bud. It's mostly his doing, that's why he hides on the island and "shuts himself" off from the force, because he really hasn't grown and is a failure like the other Jedi.

His death isn't even heroic. Doesn't even look to me like he expected to die on that rock. His death has no meaning whatsoever. It's so bad that his intentions aren't even clearly demonstrated and Poe has a lucky guess to explain what Luke is doing to the remaining rebels and the audience. Awful. In death, Luke didn't achieve anything that couldn't have been achieved had he not shown up. Disappointing.


He ain't no Walt Kowalski

 

[DarthBakura]

I've seen this "retirement" thing before where a strong female enters his life...

I liked seeing Catwoman **** his **** up. Bruce literally sat around for eight years waiting for something big enough to happen in his life to revive him. If Mr. Freeze or the Penguin had suddenly appeared halfway during that timespan, then that little endeavor of hers might have gone differently.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Yeah, the one thing I hated about the OT was in ROTJ when Obi Wan's force ghost gave Luke the Post Modernist cop-out explanation for lying to him about Vader. Johnson saw that and thought, "Brilliant! We should have all the Jedi's constantly lying to each other, for kicks! They're a tricky bunch! We'll even have Luke play the biggest practical joke of all: He'll kill himself by Force Projecting! Oh man, the look on Kylo's face will be priceless..."

There's no such thing as Jedi Scrolls.

That was a misspelling, it's Jedi Trolls: 1001 ways to troll people by SNIKT the Wise.

 

[DarthBakura]

Honestly, it would have been better if Luke was just never heard from or seen again and just disappeared after the events of ROTJ.


But everything that occurs in TFA and TLJ paints a very bad picture of Luke. He's gross, he's a coward, he's cynical and, he's not very bright. He's a failure in pretty much every regard. He let the First Order gain power and prominence, he let Snoke manipulate Kylo Ren. Contemplating murder over the shoulder over your emotional nephew isn't a very good thing. Letting said nephew catch you? That's even worse. But to then let everyone else suffer because of the mistakes and go into hiding? Oh boy.

They made Luke an unlikeable loser. Rey almost looks justified when she starts hitting and threatening him. If he loved his family and friends, he would have nipped this First Order/Snoke problem in the bud. It's mostly his doing, that's why he hides on the island and "shuts himself" off from the force, because he really hasn't grown and is a failure like the other Jedi.

His death isn't even heroic. Doesn't even look to me like he expected to die on that rock. His death has no meaning whatsoever. It's so bad that his intentions aren't even clearly demonstrated and Poe has a lucky guess to explain what Luke is doing to the remaining rebels and the audience. Awful. In death, Luke didn't achieve anything that couldn't have been achieved had he not shown up. Disappointing.


He ain't no Walt Kowalski

There would be no film... or not one even remotely enthralling anyway. And then there would be a whole new level of bitching.

 

[Adolfo]

Leia in space was a head scratcher. Nothing else in TLJ was. The "new" powers were all extensions of what we saw in ESB. Vader in the Dagobah cave was a Force projection (that was tangible no less!) Luke Force linked with both Leia and Vader. ESB also established that certain powers beyond a Jedi's abilities could take a physical toll on the Force user (Luke was weak and out of breath after trying to lift the X-Wing, Yoda was not.) Ranting about break dancing and firebreathing just makes you look silly

Wrong ...you loving TLJ makes you look silly boy.

 

[a-dev]

There would be no film...

That might be the idea....

 

[Wor-Gar]

He literally believed that the Jedi (of which he was the last) were terrible caretakers of the Force ...

Nope, that honor goes to Kathleen and JJ.

 

[Spazz]

He was on the island because of Lesson #2 that he gave to Rey: "The Legacy of the Jedi is failure." He literally believed that the Jedi (of which he was the last) were terrible caretakers of the Force and that they ultimately always ended up making things worse. He thought (wrongly obviously) that he was actually benefiting the galaxy and his loved ones by staying out of the fight. His mask was indifference but Hamill's performance showed how much the plight of Leia and the Resistance were hitting home.

Exactly. Luke felt that he made things worse, which is a likely conclusion that anyone would arrive at, after destroying the Death Star, then convincing your father to abandon the Dark Side, and ultimately being responsible for the fall of the Emperor. Luke just made everything worse. Then, Luke would obviously abandon the positive re-enforcement he received from turning DARTH VADER to the light, and saving the galaxy, because his nephew had a creepy emo vibe. Then he'd retreat into isolation, overwhelmed by a sense of futility once his reactionary nephew decides to go on a tyrannical killing spree. It just makes sense.

 

[DiFabio]

There would be no film... or not one even remotely enthralling anyway. And then there would be a whole new level of bitching.

That's why it should have ended after ROTJ.


Or, if you gotta make more Star Wars movies,

I honestly wanted the films set eighty to a hundred years after Return of the Jedi. Or a thousand years prior. Seriously, some prime storytelling out there when you get past the ****ing Skywalkers. I wish the midichlorians would just eat them all like parasites already.

But the people at the helm of this aren't creative. That's why we're still at Empire 2.0 vs. Rebel 2.0 stories in the 8th film of a "saga".

 

[Khev]

Hyperbole: you're doing it wrong Spazz.

 

[Adolfo]

Kent's death > any TLJ death...in fact better than TLJ

 

[DiFabio]

Exactly. Luke felt that he made things worse, which is a likely conclusion that anyone would arrive at, after destroying the Death Star, then convincing your father to abandon the Dark Side, and ultimately being responsible for the fall of the Emperor. Luke just made everything worse. Then, Luke would obviously abandon the positive re-enforcement he received from turning DARTH VADER to the light, and saving the galaxy, because his nephew had a creepy emo vibe. Then he'd retreat into isolation, overwhelmed by a sense of futility once his reactionary nephew decides to go on a tyrannical killing spree. It just makes sense.

I actually thought about this. This is exactly why they make the history between the events of OT and ST so murky and vague in regards to Luke, Kylo, Snoke, the Knights of Ren, the First Order, the Resistance, the New Republic and the return of the Anakin lightsaber. As soon as you'd try and explain them, it would just fall apart because of how ridiculous it would all look. It's clear that they don't put much thought into the plots of these things. There's no cohesion, it comes down to one note ideas and themes poorly thrown on screen. It's sad when your behind the scenes ideas and concept art is better than your movies.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Kent's death > any TLJ death...in fact better than TLJ

Actually, I read a pretty good article about Kent's death, and how it actually serves a purpose, but people have misinterpreted the point of that scene, so yes, there was more thought and purpose in Kent's death than in Luke or Solo's death.

 

[DarthBakura]

That might be the idea....

I wanted more films. And they had to make more after acquiring the property. If nothing else to try and make up for the prequels.

That's why it should have ended after ROTJ.


Or, if you gotta make more Star Wars movies,





But the people at the helm of this aren't creative. That's why we're still at Empire 2.0 vs. Rebel 2.0 stories in the 8th film of a "saga".

You won’t hear any complaints from me!

I wanted to see a departure from that anchor. There’s too much inspiration out there, that’s evolved from this magical thing that Lucas has created. He’s even said it himself, that he wants people to tell new stories. Stop ****ing bringing back the Skywalkers. Pleaaaaase. This has to be the last time.

 

[Wor-Gar]

Meanwhile, fans debate on the Skywalker connection to Broom Boy.