Star Wars: The Last Jedi (Dec 15th, 2017)

[Niltusk]

Star Wars was NEVER NEVER a PACERS GAME

 

[Spazz]

Maybe they thought that since flicks like Wonder Woman fared so well (I mean seriously, what other movie made 4 freaking times its opening this year) it would work for a Star Wars flick. Problem is, people are going to see Star Wars, not Woman Wars. Its not that I'm saying theres anything wrong with anyone pushing their agenda, I'm all about freedom of expression, but do it in the proper time/space. If I go to see the Colts play and the Pacers take the court, I'm going to be upset. Not because I like basketball any less than football, but if I went to see football, I want to see football. When I want to see a basketball game, I'll buy a damn basketball ticket.

You're not wrong. Also, suppose the goal of the movie was to teach men something. Is this an effective way to go about it? Take male iconography and myths about male rights of passage, and turn them into a condemnation of male behavior? That'd be like me re-writing Thelma and Louis, injecting an anti-feminist subtext in hopes of persuading Feminists of their Toxic Post Modernism. It obviously wouldn't go over well. It's more of a 'F$#@ you'. This wasn't an attempt to teach anyone anything, so much as a form of antagonism. It's puzzling, seeing as they have so much money on the line. I have a feeling Kathleen Kennedy is going to face the wrath of angry share holders over this one.

 

[Asta]

How did Luke rationalise killing a million? Then lose it because he considered killing Ben?

I'll answer that.

In 1977 it was pretty black and white. Good guys and bad guys, just like in those old serial cliffhangers. Star Wars was evoking an older period and outlook for nostalgia.

Star Wars today is concerned with contemporary issues. And Lucas was to blame for that in TPM.

 

[Adolfo]

When I get the special edition you choose man or woman version blue ray in gonna buy a welders mask and some long ice tongs so I can pick up the dvd

 

[Niltusk]

You're not wrong. Also, suppose the goal of the movie was to teach men something. Is this an effective way to go about it? Take male iconography and myths about male rights of passage, and turn them into a condemnation of male behavior? That'd be like me re-writing Thelma and Louis, injecting an anti-feminist subtext in hopes of persuading Feminists of their Toxic Post Modernism. It obviously wouldn't go over well. It's more of a 'F$#@ you'. This wasn't an attempt to teach anyone anything, so much as a form of antagonism. It's puzzling, seeing as they have so much money on the line. I have a feeling Kathleen Kennedy is going to face the wrath of angry share holders over this one.

Great example, yeah, you don't see Hollywood rushing to remake that flick as Tom and Louie.

 

[Adolfo]

So far I think the good guys are winning here in this thread

 

[Wor-Gar]

My nephew saw this last night. He is 14. He said there was some good stuff and some really bad stuff... but overall he felt cheated.

That's probably the simplest way to put it.


The rest of the family will be over for dinner tonight. I will get feedback from his sister (17) and their mother and father.

 

[jye4ever]

I voted liked it just to be a **** lol

 

[Adolfo]

I voted liked it just to be a **** lol

Ok let me guess...4 letter word starting with the letter *? Is it baby? Safe?Good? or ?

 

[Prime Clone]

At least Johnson is maintaining his sense of humour...

 

[JAWS]

There are two issues you need to address. The first, is whether or not there is a radical feminist subtext within the film. People who advocate for feminism seem to think there is. For example:

Den of Geek: Toxic Masculinity in The Last Jedi
https://www.denofgeek.com/us/movies...s-the-true-villain-of-star-wars-the-last-jedi

Vanity Fair: The Last Jedi's Harsh Condemnation of "Mansplaining"
[video]https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2017/12/star-wars-last-jedi-laura-dern-admiral-holdo-listen-to-women[/video]

News.com: Feminists Praise Star Wars - The Last Jedi
[video]https://www.news.com.au/entertainment/movies/new-movies/feminists-praise-star-wars-the-last-jedi/news-story/df3b45914d651663b4d7881fb16a7ec4[/video]

New Statesman: The Last Jedi is the First Properly Feminist Star Wars:
[video]https://www.newstatesman.com/culture/film/2017/12/last-jedi-first-properly-feminist-star-wars[/video]

MTV: The Last Jedi is the most Feminist Star Wars Yet:
[video]https://www.mtv.com/news/3053737/star-wars-last-jedi-feminist/[/video]

Moneyish: Why The Last Jedi Proves that Star Wars future is female:
[video]https://moneyish.com/ish/why-the-last-jedi-proves-that-star-wars-future-is-female/[/video]

The Guardian: Yay for Feminism in the Last Jedi:
[video]https://www.theguardian.com/film/2017/dec/18/star-wars-the-last-jedi-women-bechdel-test[/video]


Point being, if you didn't detect a feminist subtext in the movie, then that means this less-than-subtle movie went over your head. No one in their right mind would watch this movie, and say to themselves, "Nope. No radical feminism there."

At which point, the question becomes whether or not you agree with the radical feminism subtext, regarding "Toxic Masculinity", "Mansplaining" and Male vanity. Do you agree with it? Sounds like you do. People who dislike the film's feminist message haven't been emasculated. You have!

The film basically argues that Toxic Masculinity results from male culture's advocacy of trying to be AWESOME. Stop worrying about being awesome, and instead, be more selfless in protecting and promoting the well being of what you love.

Yeah, that's great... so long as you don't like acquiring knowledge, innovation, art, or any other sort of accomplishment that has ever happened in the history of people. Know why? Because no one who ever accomplished anything in human history ever told themselves for even an instant, "I think I've reached a sufficient level of awesomeness." That's never happened. Successful people are driven by ambition, self-image and a desire for self-improvement.... It's what makes the world move forward. Feminists are losers, and they're teaching you and your kids to be losers. If you want to be a loser, go ahead.

However, presuming this film isn't propaganda (it is), wouldn't that mean the intention of the film was to start a discussion? So if you're for the film, you should be enthusiastic about discussing feminism. If not, then you should hate the film, because that's specifically what the film wants you to do (unless you admit it's propaganda). You can't have it both ways.

Not to speak for Khev or that I know what he is thinking... But Khev is a good guy.

I think Khev liked the film and thus any of the agendas in the film either doesn't bother him or he does not notice them

I have said that if the script was better that the agenda stuff would be no big deal or I would not notice it..

Khev thinks the script is good and enjoyed the film... Thus he does not notice or care about any messaging in the film..

Either that or he has a v*gina


Either way I envy him and his blind enjoyment of this film

 

[Adolfo]

At least Johnson is maintaining his sense of humour...

He's typing from Kennedy's panic room....

 

[subzro]

My nephew saw this last night. He is 14. He said there was some good stuff and some really bad stuff... but overall he felt cheated.

That's probably the simplest way to put it.


The rest of the family will be over for dinner tonight. I will get feedback from his sister (17) and their mother and father.

Not sure why but i have yet to talk to anyone in person (friends, family, co-workers) who disliked it. I feel i should have the way some people are reacting. To say that ANH was a life altering experince for me would be an understatement. I have loved it for 40 years, i had all the toys, posters, books, lunchbox, etc. I was listening to ANH soundtrack record daily back in 78 at 8 years old. I watched ANH 22 times in the theater. Reading some reactions i should be upset and angry according to what some are saying but i really loved TLJ. It honestly made me feel 7 years old again in parts
It's far from perfect but none of them have been but it had enough good (and great moments) for me to forgive the bad.

 

[JAWS]

Not sure why but i have yet to talk to anyone in person (friends, family, co-workers) who disliked it. .

Interesting.. I have only talked to one person who really liked it.. Most either don't care for it or thought it was really disappointing.

I think the drop off this weekend might be a good tell on how people are feeling about this one..

 

[JAWS]

https://screenrant.com/star-wars-last-jedi-box-office-drop/


How did all the trolls and bots get in the system and manipulate the ticket sale numbers



"While critics loved the film’s bold new take on Star Wars, audiences generally thought the film was too humorous, created too many plot holes, threw all the mysteries Episode 7 director J.J. Abrams set up out the window and butchered Luke Skywalker’s character (despite Mark Hamill’s performance being praised as one of the better aspects of the film)."

 

[aa909]

There are two issues you need to address. The first, is whether or not there is a radical feminist subtext within the film. People who advocate for feminism seem to think there is. For example:

Den of Geek: Toxic Masculinity in The Last Jedi
https://www.denofgeek.com/us/movies/star-wars/269657/toxic-masculinity-is-the-true-villain-of-star-wars-the-last-jedi

Vanity Fair: The Last Jedi's Harsh Condemnation of "Mansplaining"
[video]https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2017/12/star-wars-last-jedi-laura-dern-admiral-holdo-listen-to-women[/video]

News.com: Feminists Praise Star Wars - The Last Jedi
[video]https://www.news.com.au/entertainment/movies/new-movies/feminists-praise-star-wars-the-last-jedi/news-story/df3b45914d651663b4d7881fb16a7ec4[/video]

New Statesman: The Last Jedi is the First Properly Feminist Star Wars:
[video]https://www.newstatesman.com/culture/film/2017/12/last-jedi-first-properly-feminist-star-wars[/video]

MTV: The Last Jedi is the most Feminist Star Wars Yet:
[video]https://www.mtv.com/news/3053737/star-wars-last-jedi-feminist/[/video]

Moneyish: Why The Last Jedi Proves that Star Wars future is female:
[video]https://moneyish.com/ish/why-the-last-jedi-proves-that-star-wars-future-is-female/[/video]

The Guardian: Yay for Feminism in the Last Jedi:
[video]https://www.theguardian.com/film/2017/dec/18/star-wars-the-last-jedi-women-bechdel-test[/video]


Point being, if you didn't detect a feminist subtext in the movie, then that means this less-than-subtle movie went over your head. No one in their right mind would watch this movie, and say to themselves, "Nope. No radical feminism there."

At which point, the question becomes whether or not you agree with the radical feminism subtext, regarding "Toxic Masculinity", "Mansplaining" and Male vanity. Do you agree with it? Sounds like you do. People who dislike the film's feminist message haven't been emasculated. You have!

The film basically argues that Toxic Masculinity results from male culture's advocacy of trying to be AWESOME. Stop worrying about being awesome, and instead, be more selfless in protecting and promoting the well being of what you love.

Yeah, that's great... so long as you don't like acquiring knowledge, innovation, art, or any other sort of accomplishment that has ever happened in the history of people. Know why? Because no one who ever accomplished anything in human history ever told themselves for even an instant, "I think I've reached a sufficient level of awesomeness." That's never happened. Successful people are driven by ambition, self-image and a desire for self-improvement.... It's what makes the world move forward. Feminists are losers, and they're teaching you and your kids to be losers. If you want to be a loser, go ahead.

However, presuming this film isn't propaganda (it is), wouldn't that mean the intention of the film was to start a discussion? So if you're for the film, you should be enthusiastic about discussing feminism. If not, then you should hate the film, because that's specifically what the film wants you to do (unless you admit it's propaganda). You can't have it both ways.

100% Spot on!

 

[JAWS]

[h=1]Star Wars: The Last Jedi' Had Largest First to Second Weekend Box Office Dollar Drop in History[/h]
Like its predecessor Star Wars: The Force Awakens, Star Wars: The Last Jedi is setting new box office records, but probably not the kind it would like.
Star Wars: The Last Jedi is set to have the biggest week-to-week drop at the box office, based on total dollar amount, in box office history.

 

[klwn]

https://screenrant.com/star-wars-last-jedi-box-office-drop/


How did all the trolls and bots get in the system and manipulate the ticket sale numbers

Those damn trolls and bots!

Clearly all over this forum and twitter as well.

It's way too early to make a prediction like that, but depending on how this goes, I wouldn't be surprised if we learn at some point that Lucasfilm brought in George Lucas as main consultant for IX. Or at least Dave Filoni. Well of course it could happen and we wouldn't hear about it, but if we do hear about it, I called it.

 

[spindrift]

[h=1]Star Wars: The Last Jedi' Had Largest First to Second Weekend Box Office Dollar Drop in History[/h]
Like its predecessor Star Wars: The Force Awakens, Star Wars: The Last Jedi is setting new box office records, but probably not the kind it would like.
Star Wars: The Last Jedi is set to have the biggest week-to-week drop at the box office, based on total dollar amount, in box office history.

Man the mouse isn't going to be happy if this doesn't crack $600 million domestic..not at all.

In PART i give it to the "nothing is going to match TFA numbers with another SW movie every year" explanation

 

[JAWS]

I am sure there will be lots of excuses as to why this film has dropped so much.. But people were not so nice to BvS when it happened to that film.

People may be waiting to see it after Christmas but I really think that its just not going to get the repeat business from the fans like other SW films have..

Some may compare this to Empires Box office numbers.. But comparisons to Empire should stop... This film is no Empire.. Empire also left you hanging with its dark story and dark cliffhanger ending... In that way TFA was more like Empire then this film was.