Star Wars: The Last Jedi (Dec 15th, 2017)

[klwn]

The 'Becoming Rose' video is at 9k likes and 5k dislikes btw. The comment section is still pure savagery.

I think PewDiePie said it felt like they just had a contest for a SW fan to appear in the movie and she won. Spot on.

 

[filip629]

He should've stopped going to midnight showings years ago when the premier time for movies was pushed up to 7:00 PM (or earlier).

Either way, he'll still be watching all the sequels at the movie theaters and ranting about them after. Every franchise jumps the shark sooner or later. Star Wars is no exception.

 

[morphosis]

when Yoda and Ben went into seclusion the Jedi were being actively hunted by the Empire. Luke went into seclusion because he "felt bad".

I guess you all forgot that Snoke, Kylo, and the FO were hunting down Luke to kill him as well.

whatever....no sense arguing with people who say they don't like the movies.

 

[Rorywan]

It's great that Lucasfilm decided to put Billie Lourde in these movies, except they seemed to miss the fact that she cannot act. I mean even look at the sky convincingly and yet they put her into every****ing resistance scene in the Last Jedi.
She was in the first ****ing shot for Christs sake.

 

[EVILFACE]

I’m very curious with what’s going to happen now going forward with the modern diversity narrative that’s found its way into SW now that TLJ might earn an entire 1 billion less than TFA.

I see only 2 paths.

1. Kennedy/Iger/Shareholders completely shut down the perceived forced diversity narrative in SW out of massive fear of the damage caused to the brand with TLJ.

2. Kennedy/Iger/Shareholders say screw the 50% box office loss and 50% negative RT fan score and they double down, triple down, quadruple down on their diversity narrative pretty much telling the fans that if you’re not into diversity in SW then new SW is not meant for you find another franchise to be angry over.

I was going to add path 3 which was keeping the same amount of diversity that was already in TLJ but for some keeping it the same as TLJ is pretty much the same as path 2.

Now I know some (cough JAWS cough) are going to quickly point out to me that diversity wasn’t their main problem with the movie but that’s irrelevant because I guarantee you that’s the primary reason Disney is going with on why it will earn 1 billion less than TFA and why that RT backlash exists. It sure is much easier to blame the 1 billion loss on others for pushing back against diversity than it is to blame themselves or their sweetheart Rian especially after they already announced his trilogy.

So which will it be 1 or 2?

I bet Disney already had a crisis intervention for Kelly Marie Tran for her not to hang herself.

Laura Dern doesn’t it need it this isn’t her first rodeo but for Kelly yikes she killed SW.

I don't think diversity is an issue.

Most here grew up on seeing a woman take down ALIENs, Terminators, Jason Voorhee, Freddy Krueger and 88 crazy swordsmen.

The issue is those diverse characters doing nothing. Finn and the Asian chick and their 'plot' could have been cut entirely from this movie and shortened the length by 45 min creating a tighter more fluid movie.

On thing though I'm interested if kids actually like this movie or what they saw. Not talking the kids that were forced to watch it by their hardcore SW fanboi parents. ANH was special as you can see all the elements that kids would like and it was so different than what was available at the time. Now days you have GotG and other Marvel and DC, Pixar, Jumangi ect that offer things already seen in SW and they all have diverse characters.

 

[jye4ever]

It's great that Lucasfilm decided to put Billie Lourde in these movies, except they seemed to miss the fact that she cannot act. I mean even look at the sky convincingly and yet they put her into every****ing resistance scene in the Last Jedi.
She was in the first ****ing shot for Christs sake.

Yeah she’s pretty bad I can even look up at the sky more convincingly than her but do we really need Meryl Streep in that role no of course not.

 

[klwn]

I guess you all forgot that Snoke, Kylo, and the FO were hunting down Luke to kill him as well.

whatever....no sense arguing with people who say they don't like the movies.

Obi-Wan had to be on Tatooine to keep an eye on Luke, and eventually, in a way, joined the Rebels in their fight, giving his life.
Yoda was old and tired, had been outmatched by Sidious, and only had one purpose at this point: be there for a new young Jedi that could need him one day.

Luke wasn't in Yoda's situation because Snoke never outmatched him, clearly they never met as far as we know, and if they did that should have been made very clear with a couple lines of dialogue. But no time for that of course, **** lore, Canto Bight is more important.

Luke could have helped the Resistance all along, rejected the person that needed him (Rey), and didn't even join the fight until everything was pretty much lost, just to sacrifice himself and buy some time for the handful of survivors.
The point is, giving a real purpose to his seclusion would have given his arc much more weight. But there was no purpose. He didn't train Rey, he didn't learn anything that eventually mattered on the island, and he still died even without the FO ever finding him (Snoke did find him by extracting the information out of Rey but that was never put to good use of course).

 

[Rorywan]

Making a point about diversity, racism, sexism where there isn't a point to make is counterproductive to any intelligent thinking.

SW always had strong women leading, actors of different ethnicities.

What Disney have done is under the guise of diversity - is to tap the Asian $$, by shoe horning in a new character with no real reason to exist. The use of token 'diverse' characters to make more money is racist in it's self.
That's not something to be applauded.

 

[PAINFORALL]

Star Wars is a small world after all in a galaxy far far away

 

[Darth Madden]

Making a point about diversity, racism, sexism where there isn't a point to make is counterproductive to any intelligent thinking.

SW always had strong women leading, actors of different ethnicities.

What Disney have done is under the guise of diversity - is to tap the Asian $$, by shoe horning in a new character with no real reason to exist. The use of token 'diverse' characters to make more money is racist in it's self.
That's not something to be applauded.

So basically if Disney doesn't use diverse actors they are racist... and if they do use diverse actors its only because of money and they are racist?

 

[Sassafras]

I agree with pretty much everyone in here and all the reasons why this sucks so bad... And as I've said before, I feel it's the worst of ALL the movies, including ALL 3 prequels. The acting and dialogue may have been bad in the PT, but there was a story, plot and pacing that didn't take you out of the movie, cause any confusion, or make you want to scream WTF at the screen (not even the Jar Jar humor or the midichlorians)....

People who defend this just can't wrap their heads around the fact that it's a BAD movie, regardless whether it was Star Wars, Harry Potter, or part of any other scifi franchise. And some arguments/defense make no sense.

I don't feel it's the worst of the SW films. And just sayin' to this day there's plenty that takes me straight out of the PT movies, including those midichlorians *ugh*, having a LITTLE BOY win a DANGEROUS pod race and generally be a savior, Jar Jar, the *confusion* of trying to track the politics zzzzzzz (like whatever), highly trained Jedi just getting wiped out, Yoda bouncing around like a ball fighting, bad CGI, sullen whiny Anakin, Padme just up and dying (even tho w. those babies in theory she's got something to live for, and instead dies for luv of a whiner), why Darth Vader just didn't kill the Emperor when he found out Padme was dead, some poorly done action sequences, etc. Plenty of WTF moments. Never mind that the PT messes up the other films, script-wise (Leia remembering her mother tho maybe that was the Force in her or something - multiple dimensions???)

There's plenty I like about the PT, but IMO don't see TLJ is any more full of holes than any other SW movie. And IMO TLJ has good acting and some interesting dynamics - Kylo, Rey, Luke. I like the porgs and the crystal foxes.

Just sayin'. I can talk about what I see, personally, that I like in TLJ, but that's subjective and doesn't change anyone's mind *shrug*. I'd like to see TLJ again - maybe this weekend.

In the meantime *for fun* I'm pondering trying to get a handle on the opposite end of the polarization. Because if I overlook the issue of all the *narrative holes/silliness* in the film (since all of the movies have holes/silliness if you think about it) as far as I can tell, the *outrage* can be summed up as (so far):

1) Canon violation/lack of respect for original? material/universe
2) Luke. Especially Luke. Extreme [out]rage that he didn't go out the way (many) folks envisioned. He needed to "go out like man", mano a mano. And for sure he wasn't supposed to want to chuck the whole thing...
3) Misc. like Rey-Mary-Sue, too many women running around running things, Leia-Mary-Poppins, Dickens-Oliver-Twist-sweatshop-kids, the porgs, Rose isn't hot...tho I'd totally agree that Phasma was completely wasted - that DID PO me, what a WASTE

But, at least with a first viewing, there was plenty I liked. Didn't feel like my *pricey* reserved seat ticket was a ripoff. It's worth seeing this on a big screen. As for Luke, I thought it was an interesting treatment, not an emasculating one or a betrayal. It was something different than the usual "well, you gotta face and kill "X" no matter how much it messes your head up, because the Force needs balance and BTW if you die in the attempt that's good too." It's an interesting approach - e.g., what value is any religion if the end result is slaughter? And IMO it takes an adult to wonder about things that way - past the heroic motif.

So don't agree that the approach Johnson used means a BAD movie. I don't know if I'd call it "great" but IMO there's plenty of good.

 

[jye4ever]

I don't think diversity is an issue.

Most here grew up on seeing a woman take down ALIENs, Terminators, Jason Voorhee, Freddy Krueger and 88 crazy swordsmen.

The issue is those diverse characters doing nothing. Finn and the Asian chick and their 'plot' could have been cut entirely from this movie and shortened the length by 45 min creating a tighter more fluid movie.

On thing though I'm interested if kids actually like this movie or what they saw. Not talking the kids that were forced to watch it by their hardcore SW fanboi parents. ANH was special as you can see all the elements that kids would like and it was so different than what was available at the time. Now days you have GotG and other Marvel and DC, Pixar, Jumangi ect that offer things already seen in SW.

I agree with your message i’m just trying to play devils advocate on what Disney’s core reasoning behind the backlash will be.

If not diversity then runner up goes to not giving everything the fans wanted from their 2 years worth of speculation.

Regarding kids from non diehard geek households I only know of my nephews and nieces who come from non geek parents not one bluray in the house not even the OT, no collectibles to be found anywhere super ****ing boring lifestyle lol and the kids loved it but they also say PT is better than the OT so I say **** their opinions lol

 

[Rorywan]

Yeah she’s pretty bad I can even look up at the sky more convincingly than her but do we really need Meryl Streep in that role no of course not.

Yeah, but bad acting immediately takes you out of the scene, even for a minor character.
Stick a decent character actor in the role- make the scene work.

 

[jye4ever]

So basically if Disney doesn't use diverse actors they are racist... and if they do use diverse actors its only because of money and they are racist?

Pretty much Disney is so ****ed it’s not even funny lol

I do think they could’ve done a better job with Rose and Finn’s overall side mission and that’s coming from a person who has already debunked for himself the main complaints levied against Holdo and Rose’s characters so i’m comfortable with their arcs and purposes.

 

[Rorywan]

So basically if Disney doesn't use diverse actors they are racist... and if they do use diverse actors its only because of money and they are racist?

That has nothing to do with what I posted.

 

[MaulFan]

Do you think criticism of Billie Lourde would even exist if not for the relation to Carrie? If she was unconnected and just a so-so actor, would anyone even pay attention? Unfortunately, being connected draws extra attention to a role that would otherwise likely be overlooked.

As for child reactions, my girlfriend's 10 year old nephew saw it and said it sucked Despite having the issues I have with it, I'm still neutral, I'm not glad we got the movie, but I'm also not angered by it's existence.

 

[Rorywan]

Forcing characters into scenes as badly written token marketing tags is what I commented on.
Rose was a badly written pointless Asian woman stuck in there to help sell the movie in China.
It didn't work, at all.

Token diverse characters are ******. Do it - do it properly. Hire great actors write great roles and make a movie that isn't a ****ing marketing mess.

 

[aa909]

I guess you all forgot that Snoke, Kylo, and the FO were hunting down Luke to kill him as well.

whatever....no sense arguing with people who say they don't like the movies.

But that’s not why Luke went into seclusion. He wasn’t hiding from Kylo, RJ’s script is crap, Luke clearly spells it out when he says he came “here to die”.

 

[aa909]

Making a point about diversity, racism, sexism where there isn't a point to make is counterproductive to any intelligent thinking.

SW always had strong women leading, actors of different ethnicities.

What Disney have done is under the guise of diversity - is to tap the Asian $$, by shoe horning in a new character with no real reason to exist. The use of token 'diverse' characters to make more money is racist in it's self.
That's not something to be applauded.

Well said!

 

[RIDDICK]

Bad acting is one thing I don't care about when it comes to Star Wars.
OT had a lot of it. PT had a lot of it. It's part of the franchise.