The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies

[Khev]

Funny, I just received my signed copy of the BOTFA Art & Design book this very morning.

"Some months later we had a second round of design on Dain when Peter asked us to conceive him without the restrictions of costume and make-up. What had been achieved on Actor Billy Connolly with the prosthetic make-up and costume was cool, but it hadn't given Peter, Fran and Philippa exactly what they wanted from the character and we all felt that Billy had become a bit lost under it all. Paradoxically, if Dain were entirely digital we could bring more of Billy to the front of the new design brief. At the same time we could shift his proportions in subtle ways that costume could only achieve to a certain degree. We were able to broaden him, enlarge his head in relation to his body and make him feel chunkier, without encumbering Billy's performance the way a heavy costume, armor and prosthetics had."

I think what isn't being clear in the above text is WHY Peter Jackson wanted Dain to not have the "restrictions of costume and make-up." Haters read that and say "aha, he's talking about design restrictions! He wants to make him cartoony like Azog!" But all of Dain's designs, even the final CG one, were no more restrictive than Bombur's massive fat suit, which was like a hundred pounds or something. I think more than likely PJ was watching Connoly struggle under all that gear on account of being a 70 year old dude with Parkinsons (and not the spry actors playing Thorin's company) and decided that it just wasn't working.

THEN when it was determined that Dain would "play" better as a CG character instead of an old, sick actor struggling to even move under all that gear he said "okay, since we're going CG to help Connoly, how can we use this opportunity to tweak his design even more?" That's how it reads to me. Call me an apologist if you like but I find it highly coincidental that PJ just happened to pull an "Azog" ONLY for the one dwarf with lots of gear on an ailing actor.

 

[crows]

It's like when they did the CGI baby for twilight because they didn't want to make a real baby have to deal with being on set lol

 

[Khev]

I hate the fact that that comparison isn't that big a stretch.

 

[Khev]

Holy crap, I'm going through the BOTFA art book now and there are a lot of spoilers for what will no doubt be in the EE.

Alfrid's fate is definitely NOT for kids:

Spoiler

While trying to find a place to hide his gold he inadvertantly gets catapulted across the battlefield into a giant troll's mouth where he gets eaten alive. The troll has huge metal prosthetic teeth like surgically implanted swords along his mouth and is freaking NASTY looking.

 

[Masked]

Holy crap, I'm going through the BOTFA art book now and there are a lot of spoilers for what will no doubt be in the EE.

Alfrid's fate is definitely NOT for kids:

Spoiler

While trying to find a place to hide his gold he inadvertantly gets catapulted across the battlefield into a giant troll's mouth where he gets eaten alive. The troll has huge metal prosthetic teeth like surgically implanted swords along his mouth and is freaking NASTY looking.

Whoa, yeah.

 

[Khev]

Hmmm, the book describes two other deaths for Alfrid so hopefully the EE goes with the one mentioned above. I love that they specifically said they were trying to come up with a good "Carter Burke" death for him.

It also shows pictures of:

Spoiler

Thorin, Kili, and Fili's tombs and Dain in a coronation outfit

so it's good to see confirmation of sorts that those will be in the EE as well.

Some of you will be happy to know that originally they planned to have that big nasty troll that Legolas uses to smash into the tower be ridden by Bofur and a couple other dwarves down on the main battlefield instead. Apparently the chains dangling from his eye sockets were used by orc riders to "steer" him and the dwarves were going to hijack him and turn him on the enemy forces. Phew! Glad they avoided the blatant Chewie/ewoks/scout walker ROTJ moment.

 

[Gruson]

All of this talk about Dain being all CGI... I never noticed when he was not riding his Pig...

I guess I just assumed it was a real actor because why would it not be and thus never looked at it too closely. When riding the Pig it was obvious... Ignorance is Bliss.

I easily noticed it and hated it. He looked so fake and lifeless...my wife and brother did not notice it though. The real actor scenes stood out for sure, you could easily tell the difference IMO and the CG was much worse than Azog, who I thought looked VERY real in most of the shots. Both him and Bold looked amazing.

 

[Khev]

Alfrid > Dain

 

[jye4ever]

Alfrid should've been on that pig.

 

[JAWS]

I easily noticed it and hated it. He looked so fake and lifeless...my wife and brother did not notice it though. The real actor scenes stood out for sure, you could easily tell the difference IMO and the CG was much worse than Azog, who I thought looked VERY real in most of the shots. Both him and Bold looked amazing.

So some of the shots were of the real actors face?? Perhaps that is what I am thinking of... All this talk of CG and I thought the close ups of his face were pretty good.. Perhaps that is why LOL!

 

[furystorm]

Going again on Thursday...

 

[The Ween]

Going again on Thursday...

I didn't think you cared that much for it? Stop trying to cufises me!

 

[furystorm]

I've seen every Hobbit twice. Usually in HFR 3D first, then in 2D. This time is reversed because the fine freaks I went with in LA wanted to see the 2D marathon, as did I.

I've always gone with a work buddy and he's been waiting for us to be able to go together.

 

[Xenoburger_]

Saw it again yesterday.

Anyone else notice just how silly the 9 ringwraith/ghosts' movements are? It's like something straight out of a video game or cartoon. Specifically when one of them hops in front of Elrond. He slowly hovers down in this goofy pose and it just seemed so...silly. Also when Sauron "resurrects" them all. It brought me back to resurrecting fallen characters in World of Warcraft.

The highlights for me though are still everything with Smaug, Bard, Saruman, Elrond, Legolas, Tauriel and Thranduil.

This trilogy was supposed to focus more on the dwarves than the elves, which it did, but I think I cared for them the least out of everyone. The architecture and weapon/armor designs, as I've said before, were absolutely fantastic. I just couldn't get into any of those characters. I know they didn't do much in the books, and when the focus was on them it could be silly at times, but I still think they could have been written/portrayed better in the films. Not sure exactly what I would change though. All I know is that I liked them in the book and couldn't stand them in the movies.

...I found Alfrid more entertaining than Thorin

Back to the architecture, I don't think enough people appreciate just how perfect it was. You couldn't ask for a better dwarven kingdom. It was massive with hundreds of stone tunnels and stairwells going on for what seem like miles. So dark, so ancient, so hidden. It amazes me. I wish it could have been explored more in the movies.

 

[jye4ever]

Thorin was just as frightening as Azong when he was bewitched.

 

[Irvy]

Thorin was just as frightening as Azong when he was bewitched.

 

[furystorm]

Thorin was just as frightening as Azong when he was bewitched.

Azong = Azog with a dong

 

[Khev]

Thorin was just as frightening as Azong when he was bewitched.

I was 6 when my mom took me to The Empire Strikes Back in 1980 and needless to say it was the most awesome thing ever BUT one scene that completely blew my mind was the Dagobah cave sequence. I was all "What?? Darth Vader?? He's here? And BEHEADED?? And his face looks like some random dude?" (not realizing that it was supposed to be Luke) Obviously I realized that he was alive and well for the rest of the movie but I was utterly confused about what I saw on Dagobah.

Well I took my 5 year old son (named Luke ) to BOTFA and he thought it was awesome but as we were driving home he commented that "there was a dragon swimming under the gold floor??" Ha ha. I explained the whole dream sequence but it cracked me up that he had his own "Dagobah cave" moment.

 

[hoodonit00]

Anyone else notice just how silly the 9 ringwraith/ghosts' movements are? It's like something straight out of a video game or cartoon. Specifically when one of them hops in front of Elrond. He slowly hovers down in this goofy pose and it just seemed so...silly. Also when Sauron "resurrects" them all. It brought me back to resurrecting fallen characters in World of Warcraft.

That's pretty much exactly how I felt about them. I got a "Ninja Gaiden" feel about them. Why would a wraith, a ghosts, appearance change from the LOTR to The Hobbit is beyond me.

 

[The Ween]

That's pretty much exactly how I felt about them. I got a "Ninja Gaiden" feel about them. Why would a wraith, a ghosts, appearance change from the LOTR to The Hobbit is beyond me.

Probably the same way the Men of the Mountain in RotK were ghosts but still decomposed to skeletons. The Nine were just resurrected by Sauron, so........

I'm guessing.