ASMUS TOYS : Aragorn @ The Battle of Helm's Deep

[FlyAndFight]

For the most part, Asmus has been improving with every single figure release. In my opinion, Gimli is probably one of the best figures in my entire 1/6 figure collection.

With that being said, of course Asmus should strive to release the best representation of the character that they are capable of. I believe it all starts with the head sculpt. I've said it a million times before but a great head sculpt will lift a mediocre figure while a not-so-great sculpt will hurt a great figure.

I will say that I think the head sculpt(s) are not bad but certainly not at the level of Gimli, Elrond or Theoden (minus that hair gap...) in terms of nailing the actors' portraits. All figures don't need to be Crown level but the head sculpt does need to be as best as possible.

This is the first Asmus LotR figure in quite some time that hasn't been an instant pre-order for me. Thorin and Grishnakh were the only other two and I ended up picking them up later. So I expect I'll get the regular version of "Helms Deep" Aragorn as well, in the future.

 

[Luisenigma1]

What's up with asmus site? Tried to PO the standard and it doesn't have paypal.

 

[Lizard Lips]

With that being said, of course Asmus should strive to release the best representation of the character that they are capable of. I believe it all starts with the head sculpt. I've said it a million times before but a great head sculpt will lift a mediocre figure while a not-so-great sculpt will hurt a great figure.

I will say that I think the head sculpt(s) are not bad but certainly not at the level of Gimli, Elrond or Theoden (minus that hair gap...) in terms of nailing the actors' portraits. All figures don't need to be Crown level but the head sculpt does need to be as best as possible.

Ideally for us collectors sure, they'd keep finessing the sculpt until its as good as they're capable of. But they're a business so there's always going to be a balance with production costs.

Maybe Gimli or Elrond level will be achieved after this final attempt but all I'm saying is if they just haven't reached that level then I'm not expecting them to persist. I'm gonna assume this is the final attempt.

These aren't supposed to be a perfect representation of the character; if a collector really wanted that then they'd engage a custom designer and pay a fortune. Headsculpts from Asmus and even HT are a bit of a lottery. Sometimes they really nail them (Elrond, Gimli, Thanos, Hela, SS Harley Quinn) and sometimes they don't (this, the multitude of Thors and that Ant-Man).

For me personally its enough that I and those I show my collection to instantly recognize the character and don't criticize the likeness. If any company can't reach that level then I just won't buy their product.

 

[Gipetto0812]

I don't understand why people are complaining about the price of the deluxe. How much do you pay for ANY headsculpt out there? Least expensive mass produced head is probably what $35? People in here spend that much and more for an unpainted custom head and then another $100+ to get it painted. The base is no small piece. Try buying a base that big for a decent price. Maybe they went $20 over. Big deal. Hot Toys just put up the 2099 Spiderman figure with absolutely ZERO accessories for $265.

Keep complaining people and Asmus will go home with their toys and then you'll cry.

The people at Asmus have some thick skin, but they will grow weary. They already went from showing us the proto and taking input, to not showing anything until the item is well into production. They are still willing to listen to constructive criticism, but people are bashing too much, whether it's the sculpt or the fabrics used or the price.

If one of my customers doesn't like my price, they are free to go elsewhere. No skin off my nose. If they give me too much flack, they are no longer a customer. I have no shortage of good customers who give me great referrals. I know that I provide a great product and I'm not going to worry about a few whiners. I address real problems to make sure people are happy but I don't cater to people's every whim and fantasy.

Of course they're open to constructive criticism. But too many, and I'm not pointing fingers at any one person, are just spouting nonsense. Asmus seemed pretty proud of what they came up with. Some of this hurts. Facebook people have been particularly cruel, anything but constructive.

They are thick skinned to take the abuse. If they weren't thick skinned, they would have stopped by now, or they just wouldn't care like so many other companies.

Yep...I love that Asmus is open and responsive to feedback but I could really see a scenario where if their good nature is abused they reach they point where they simply say there is no pleasing these people and just disengage.
I personally thought that this figure looked great...I will be happy if Asmus can get it to look better.
The folks who were painting it as some kind of epic failure were being a little unreasonable.
Was there room for improvement? Yes. Had Asmus personally betrayed anyone and disgraced both Peter Jackson and the entire Tolkien estate? No.
Feedback is great but Asmus does not have to take it.
They don?t owe anything to anyone. They release products and if people like they buy if they don?t they won?t. Asmus is smart enough to realize that it pays to try to get as many people to like as possible. I am sure that like everyone else, however, they also have their limit.

If I was still a premium member I'd rep you guys. These post sum up how I typically think in most of the Asmus threads.

 

[Argo18]

I was pretty happy with the figure. Will be interesting to see how the updating look is. Really doesn't need much.

I did get the deluxe edition even tho I agree it's a bit pricey. Maybe they could add a couple more accessories. An elven cloak would be nice, a pipe aswell.

 

[DioramaMaker]

I was pretty happy with the figure. Will be interesting to see how the updating look is. Really doesn't need much.

I did get the deluxe edition even tho I agree it's a bit pricey. Maybe they could add a couple more accessories. An elven cloak would be nice, a pipe aswell.

I do really commend them for being willing to go back to the drawing board again after the feedback. Like I said before, I think I would have been okay with what was offered here, but really appreciate that they are willing to try to improve it yet again.

I do like the idea of throwing in a cloak or pipe with the package.

 

[ciaccia_rafael]

One thing that seems weird is how the figure is advertised. Why put the emphasis on that headsculpt when it only comes with the exclusive version ? We have almost no picture of the battle damaged head which is the one that most people will get. The likeness of the battle damaged seems better but even on the regular version there is only picture of it and the rest is with the other head. It seems very strange to me..

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[Kalkylen]

I think it was the same sculpt but with the eyes painted side glancing and the added blood. Asmus were obviously proud of it (rightfully so) and wanted to show the full scupt. Although it could do with a few tweaks, the passion is there and it's definitely a lot better than people are making out.

I've been pouring over the photos since the reveal and I think the face shape is there, it's just the cheekbones that need to be a bit higher and sharper and slightly less full in the cheeks.

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[Lizard Lips]

I still think the hairline is wrong, it goes to a peak whereas it should be flatter.

The nose is also clearly not right and the eyes need to be a bit rounder.

More beard required.

 

[hoodonit00]

I still think the hairline is wrong, it goes to a peak whereas it should be flatter.

The nose is also clearly not right and the eyes need to be a bit rounder.

More beard required.

Not addressing your hairline comment but to me they are trying to make it look like it grows out of the head. All it's really doing is giving the sculpt a harsh seam though. I don't know about making the eyes rounder as they look almost too round now IMO. The nose is definitely off. Compare in the pics someone posted a couple of posts up. Face should be a little more gaunt and definitely more stubble.

People can comment on comments being too harsh and I can agree with that. There is also a thing though about giving too much praise. The head sculpt is not even close to 90% to me. I know beauty is in the eye of the beholder but IMO this looks nothing like Aragorn.

 

[jk_blue_tiger]

As far as I understood, the second headsculpt is exactly the same as the first just with different paint job. On an already manufactured product, that is not 35 USD, maybe 15 USD the most. That leaves 75 USD for the generic diorama, which I don't believe to cost that much to produce (maybe 25 USD?). If you add this two products to an already produced and marketed product, it leaves you 50 USD of profit for the extended version, which means between 1/5 and 1/7 of the whole product. I don't know if it is too much or not, but it is for me.
You people are bringing always the Hot Toys argument, but there are many other companies out there. If we complain, is because we want something good and reasonably affordable, and most of it, because we want ASMUS to keep it this way and not to become another Hot Toys. Keep on being pleased with any demanding prices, and not today, not tomorrow, but one day we will all cry...

You forgot two important things: cost of shipping and weight.
When ordering from Asmus website their prices include free shipping.
Most other companies don't offer that (I can only remember Three 0), the "king" HT doesn't.
Regarding weight, any deluxe edition carrying a diorama base will increase drastically in weight and volume,
which of course will increase price for cost of shipping.
So, if we decide to talk about numbers (profit,costs, etc) let's do it right.

 

[Luisenigma1]

This shot the sculpt looks spot on.

 

[jal76]

Not addressing your hairline comment but to me they are trying to make it look like it grows out of the head. All it's really doing is giving the sculpt a harsh seam though. I don't know about making the eyes rounder as they look almost too round now IMO. The nose is definitely off. Compare in the pics someone posted a couple of posts up. Face should be a little more gaunt and definitely more stubble.

People can comment on comments being too harsh and I can agree with that. There is also a thing though about giving too much praise. The head sculpt is not even close to 90% to me. I know beauty is in the eye of the beholder but IMO this looks nothing like Aragorn.

The sculpt can definitely be improved...but do you really think that it looks ?nothing? like Aragorn...as in no resemblance what-so-ever? As in if the figure was not labeled you would not be able to guess who it is supposed to represent?
I am not attempting to attack your opinion by any means, I am just interested in better understanding where this has missed the mark so badly for people.

 

[Sassafras]

I was pretty happy with the figure. Will be interesting to see how the updating look is. Really doesn't need much.

I did get the deluxe edition even tho I agree it's a bit pricey. Maybe they could add a couple more accessories. An elven cloak would be nice, a pipe aswell.

Yeah, I went back and forth with myself for a while. *Shrug* ordered the deluxe out of Sideshow. If nothing else can use extra head to 'bash an Aragon in a long cloak, or something. Out on a lonely moor....

Looks like Aragorn to me....

 

[CrankbaitJon]

I think the cheeks are too full. Still, I think it's still better than the previous versions. I'm going to wait for an update before I order.

Also, I think the exclusive version is too expensive. From my understanding, the extra head will be exactly the same with battle damage. That stand is nice but too large for my display. I'm glad the normal version is at Asmus's normal price point.

 

[hoodonit00]

The sculpt can definitely be improved...but do you really think that it looks ?nothing? like Aragorn...as in no resemblance what-so-ever? As in if the figure was not labeled you would not be able to guess who it is supposed to represent?
I am not attempting to attack your opinion by any means, I am just interested in better understanding where this has missed the mark so badly for people.

Ok maybe nothing is too harsh a word. If it was just the head sculpt with nothing else to signify who it is I would be able to get it probably by the dimple in the chin, the stubblse, and the long hair. So for me from the hairline down to the lips the likeness is not as good as I want.

If this were my first Aragorn I would probably jump at it. As it is I got the first full set plus the rooted replacement sculpt. I will put it this way. The sculpt is not good enough for me to where I'm going to shell out another 200 dollars for. I will get the deluxe set if the sculpts are good enough.

You're new to this line. I've been in from the start. They showed a Gandalf The White which was superb. The release though not horrible was not as good as the prototype. That may be expected but the sculpt itself was squished. Then came Gandalf The Gray. They showed the cast sculpt. Everyone loved it. They released something totally different. A prototype of Aragorn can be found on FB if you look. To my eye it was dead on. Again what we got was not as good as that sculpt. Digital scans were shown at the beginning of this Aragorn. Everyone agreed they looked great. They are shown in another thread. Again it seemed to be changed. To me Gimli, Boromir, Theoden, and Elrond were outstanding. Eomer was pretty good just bad hair job. I was just really looking forward to Aragorn being another homerun.

 

[jal76]

Ok maybe nothing is too harsh a word. If it was just the head sculpt with nothing else to signify who it is I would be able to get it probably by the dimple in the chin, the stubblse, and the long hair. So for me from the hairline down to the lips the likeness is not as good as I want.

If this were my first Aragorn I would probably jump at it. As it is I got the first full set plus the rooted replacement sculpt. I will put it this way. The sculpt is not good enough for me to where I'm going to shell out another 200 dollars for. I will get the deluxe set if the sculpts are good enough.

You're new to this line. I've been in from the start. They showed a Gandalf The White which was superb. The release though not horrible was not as good as the prototype. That may be expected but the sculpt itself was squished. Then came Gandalf The Gray. They showed the cast sculpt. Everyone loved it. They released something totally different. A prototype of Aragorn can be found on FB if you look. To my eye it was dead on. Again what we got was not as good as that sculpt. Digital scans were shown at the beginning of this Aragorn. Everyone agreed they looked great. They are shown in another thread. Again it seemed to be changed. To me Gimli, Boromir, Theoden, and Elrond were outstanding. Eomer was pretty good just bad hair job. I was just really looking forward to Aragorn being another homerun.

I think I am trying to understand if Asmus has just spoiled us.
As you point out I am definitely new to the line, but far from new to 1/6 scale figure collecting.
My first 1/6 scale figure was preordering the very first Bank Robber Joker from Hot Toys on its initial release...so in over a decade of collecting I have amassed a large collection of figures from different companies.
I bought Asmus? Hateful 8 figures way back before I got into LOTR figures and have tons of figures from Blitzway, Hot Toys, Enterbay, QMx, Sideshow, and even VTS, Redman, Craftone, and Star Ace all represented in my collection and this Aragorn seems as good or better than anything that any of these companies have released.
I cannot think of many Hot Toys figures that look more like their subject than this looks like Aragorn...some do and some don?t.
Once again, not perfect.
The paint apps are slightly below recent releases from Hot Toys perhaps, but I would put the likeness alone on par with most of their recent releases.

 

[Wor-Gar]

I think it was the same sculpt but with the eyes painted side glancing and the added blood. Asmus were obviously proud of it (rightfully so) and wanted to show the full scupt. Although it could do with a few tweaks, the passion is there and it's definitely a lot better than people are making out.

I've been pouring over the photos since the reveal and I think the face shape is there, it's just the cheekbones that need to be a bit higher and sharper and slightly less full in the cheeks.

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I think this is a really good comparison here. Cheekbones and nose could be addressed.

 

[DioramaMaker]

This shot the sculpt looks spot on. View attachment 491586

This pic really should be front and center because it shows the strengths of the sculpt that should be kept in the alteration process. That is the sort of picture that sells a figure, in my mind.

I do think Asmus is about to get reamed out hard though because their solicitation is all kinds of bad. Using the exclusive headsculpt in the regular release photography is going to lead to a ton of bad press and potential returns. I could see this becoming a "we will ship buyers a clean head" situation for damage control.

 

[Chopper Face]

That absolutely should have been the shot they used to promote that figure long before anything else came out and he should’ve had that head at the Con. I think we’d be in a totally different situation if emphasis was put on the ‘damaged’ head. And yeah, it’s a terrible move to market the figure primarily using an exclusive head. Very few collectors are as informed as the group who regularly frequent these boards so it will lead to confusion and outrage

I don’t think Asmus should go back to square one but some very minor late actions to this current sculpt could make a huge difference. Raise the cheekbones a smidge, suck in his cheeks just a little, make the chin slightly less wide, round the tip of the nose and see how it looks.
I’d really hate to lose this expression to something less emotive.