Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)
Nah.. Not trying to take it down.. Just wondering if it made sense or not.
Ok... That makes sense... Still does not explain the Gloves appearance in AOU end credits or Thor 3 and the fact that Hela knew what it was.
I have several moments that define the MCU to me.. That when watching the film I really truly felt like I was watching the Comics come to life on the screen.
But if I had to pick one.. And you know its going to be a Hulk moment.
"Leave me Alone" The Incredible Hulk - No line in any of the MCU films perfectly captured what a character was all about then this moment here. Its not just the line itself but that its delivered perfectly in the fact that it is not said in rage or anger but with a slight sadness. Hulk just had a flash bomb thrown at him but ultimately Hulk does not want to hurt anyone.. He just wants to be left alone. Add to the fact that you cant see him but you can see the smoke move from his powerful breath when delivering this line give the scene a variety of emotions. Sadness, excitement and fear. If you don't read the Hulk comics then I can see how this is just a throw away line.. But it is IMO the best moment in the MCU
Runner Ups
Iron Man vs Thor - This to me was when the MCU came to life. How many comics did I read as a child where my hero's could not get along and get into a fight.
The Hulk punching out the Chitauri Leviathan[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif] - [/FONT][FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif][/FONT][FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]Of course another Hulk moment was going to be on the list. [/FONT]To see something on such a huge scale get knocked out by the Hulk, a character that we had been told was "The strongest on there is" in comics for decades, was something to behold. I am sure my bias has something to do with it... But it really was the MCU's way of saying.. This is for Real! What you will see from now on is the MCU comics come to life!!!
Tie
Caps Elevator fight and escape - This was the moment Cap was brought to life for me. The scene is intense.. Cap's polite delivery of "If anyone want to get out, now might be the time" The fact that one of his hands are magnetically bound to the wall and after kicking butt there he uses his shield to take down a SHIELD plane... Wow !
and
"There's Only one God ma'am, and I am pretty sure he doesn't dress like that" - Not so much a Comic brought to life moment but a perfect character moment. I love this line because it captures Caps personality perfectly.. He is from the 40's so he has traditional Christian values and the fact that he calls Black Widow ma'am is so fitting for who cap is. The delivery is perfect and tells you who exactly Cap is. Splash Page action sequence in EG - Sure Hulk got screwed but there was no denying that what I was seeing in the screen was a splash page come to life.
Honorable mention.
Thor's Spinning Hammer during the Ice Giant battle -I got a huge geeky grin when I saw this.. I mean Thor has always got that thing swinging in circles in the comics. It was great to see it on the big screen.
Oh man Jye.. I gotta fix this list for you.
Man I get that Cap is like Superman in EG so that is going to give you some bias but I am shocked to see this in your "cream of the crop" list above TWS and CW which were IMO far better films then EG.
Even if Hulk got to shine like Cap did in the last 30 I don't think I could put this in "Cream of the Crop"
But that is my issues with the time travel plot line which was silly and boring to me. But if you like it... I... guess.... I can see this on you list
As much as I was disappointed by EG with its time travel plot and pacing and being extremely frustrated by what they did with Hulk, EG is still a good movie.
Its true Marvel did not really make a "Bad" movie. Not in a Batman and Robin way.
IMO AOU is not in anyway shape or form a good movie. But its not Batman and Robin bad..
Now I am not sure that that is a fair way to ***** it.. I mean if I go by that logic then the Transformers have never made a "bad" movie.
But even if you do say that AOU was bad it has some good moments and its made well.
The level of consistency for these films is amazing. How did Marvel do it? Casting and caring about their characters.
The fact that they nailed pretty much every role and made them all likable really helped take some films like Thor 2, IM2 and 3 and still make them watchable and somewhat fun.
Then Marvel makes a move that is either brilliant or lucky... They fall on a couple comedy directors who just happen to be made for this..
IMO the Russo's saved a series that was not really in need of saving but could have gone down hill if not for their talents. They took the least powered Marvel Hero and made him a fan fav. They made you feel like our hero's could die. They juggled tons of characters and made them all interesting.
Imagine if Joss Whedon had been asked to make WS, and CW.. I am sure the films would have still been successful but would they be the films they are? And because of that success maybe he is asked to make IW and EG..
Well at least Hulk would have got more to do but the quality would have suffered IMO.. Granted I love the original Avengers. It's my fav Marvel movie.. But after AOU and JL (though it not all his fault) I just don't see any of those films being the same level of film making.
But what really amazing is that this is not over.. Maybe for some of our hero's but if Spider-man is good to great then its 23 movies in a row.. and who knows how long that steak keeps going.
Man you really are on a mission to destroy EG now after Hulk’s arc went sideways aren’t you
Now in your own rage you’re even trying to bring down all of the MCU!
Kal-El......NO!
I mean...
JAWS......NO!
Ok... That makes sense... Still does not explain the Gloves appearance in AOU end credits or Thor 3 and the fact that Hela knew what it was.
I have several moments that define the MCU to me.. That when watching the film I really truly felt like I was watching the Comics come to life on the screen.
But if I had to pick one.. And you know its going to be a Hulk moment.
"Leave me Alone" The Incredible Hulk - No line in any of the MCU films perfectly captured what a character was all about then this moment here. Its not just the line itself but that its delivered perfectly in the fact that it is not said in rage or anger but with a slight sadness. Hulk just had a flash bomb thrown at him but ultimately Hulk does not want to hurt anyone.. He just wants to be left alone. Add to the fact that you cant see him but you can see the smoke move from his powerful breath when delivering this line give the scene a variety of emotions. Sadness, excitement and fear. If you don't read the Hulk comics then I can see how this is just a throw away line.. But it is IMO the best moment in the MCU
Runner Ups
Iron Man vs Thor - This to me was when the MCU came to life. How many comics did I read as a child where my hero's could not get along and get into a fight.
The Hulk punching out the Chitauri Leviathan[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif] - [/FONT][FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif][/FONT][FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]Of course another Hulk moment was going to be on the list. [/FONT]To see something on such a huge scale get knocked out by the Hulk, a character that we had been told was "The strongest on there is" in comics for decades, was something to behold. I am sure my bias has something to do with it... But it really was the MCU's way of saying.. This is for Real! What you will see from now on is the MCU comics come to life!!!
Tie
Caps Elevator fight and escape - This was the moment Cap was brought to life for me. The scene is intense.. Cap's polite delivery of "If anyone want to get out, now might be the time" The fact that one of his hands are magnetically bound to the wall and after kicking butt there he uses his shield to take down a SHIELD plane... Wow !
and
"There's Only one God ma'am, and I am pretty sure he doesn't dress like that" - Not so much a Comic brought to life moment but a perfect character moment. I love this line because it captures Caps personality perfectly.. He is from the 40's so he has traditional Christian values and the fact that he calls Black Widow ma'am is so fitting for who cap is. The delivery is perfect and tells you who exactly Cap is. Splash Page action sequence in EG - Sure Hulk got screwed but there was no denying that what I was seeing in the screen was a splash page come to life.
Honorable mention.
Thor's Spinning Hammer during the Ice Giant battle -I got a huge geeky grin when I saw this.. I mean Thor has always got that thing swinging in circles in the comics. It was great to see it on the big screen.
Oh man Jye.. I gotta fix this list for you.
Man that just freaking warms my heart to read. I'm not gonna bore people by reposting details of the decades long wait I've had hoping that Cap would be done justice on the big screen but suffice it to say that it's truly surreal to actually have the MCU and IW/AEG be an actual thing and worthy of mention alongside the SW OT and LOTR.
Now if I'm just going to cut out individual movies to say are the ultimate cream of the crop then I'd probably go:
SW/ESB
FOTR
ALIENS
AEG
Boom, right there. But really its:
SW OT/RO
LOTR
A1/A2
MCU Phase I-III
Man I get that Cap is like Superman in EG so that is going to give you some bias but I am shocked to see this in your "cream of the crop" list above TWS and CW which were IMO far better films then EG.
Even if Hulk got to shine like Cap did in the last 30 I don't think I could put this in "Cream of the Crop"
But that is my issues with the time travel plot line which was silly and boring to me. But if you like it... I... guess.... I can see this on you list
Yes that's right and it's kind of an annoying pain to type that last one so I'll say "MCU" for now, lol. How did they do it. Just how. Yes a valid argument could be made that lots of individual MCU entries are merely "good", "average" or slightly subpar. Right now I wouldn't apply that last label to a single MCU flick, not even IM3, TDW or CM. Those are still all watchable flicks that are instantly and *forever* elevated by IW/AEG. There's just no separating them now.
And for the record I always respected IM3 for doing it's own thing and IMO even doing it well. TDW being heavily referenced in Ragnarok and AEG is absolutely indispensable now. CM didn't ruin anything in AEG (and I think Thanos' ship turning all it's cannons on her like a pirate ship making a full broadside attack was just hella cool as was the accompanying cheer from my initial audience) so any misgivings I had about the poor direction of her flick is just water under the bridge.
Like you said it's not just that AEG is a great flick but that they *stuck the landing on a 22 film finale.* I get that Hulk fans are disappointed. Of course I get it I'm a lifelong SW fan who actually disowned ROTJ (an actual OT flick!) for years because of disgust over how it treated Han, Fett, and Vader, all bigger icons than the Hulk for me. But over time I've come to appreciate the satisfying resolution that it still provides the entire Saga with great moments like Jabba, space battle, Emperor and so forth.
AEG might not be perfect but it's absolutely ROTK level flawed (that is to say totally forgivable in any missteps) and has none of the outwardly laughable moments of say ROTJ, TLC, TDKR, SM3, ROTS, and other franchise/trilogy closers. This is NOT another SW/ESB situation where so many franchises get traction for one or two films out of the gate and then falter (sometimes spectacularly) by the end. AEG is an ending to end all endings, lol. And with the balls to even call themselves Endgame.
It didn't just satisfyingly wrap the setup of IW but it closed loops going back to the original IM (loved Tony repeating his famous quote as he snapped his fingers), explaining the disappearance of TFA Red Skull, revealed the full extent of Zemo's actions, definitively answered why Banner might have been given the green monster "for a higher purpose" as suggested in A1, delivered on the promise of Thanos turning to the camera at the end of A1, Cap and Peggy, Thor and his mom (and by extension coming to terms with not just her but all the family he lost), Pepper finally bonding with and understanding Tony in a manner that goes way past simply tolerating his suit fetish, Tony making the definitive sacrifice play, Fury fully making good on his effort to create a self sustaining network of global superheroes, I'm probably forgetting half a dozen others.
And it didn't just close loops or bring things full circle it did it in ways that far exceeded my wildest expectations!
Even if you go back to TIH it's kind of heart-warming that the Banner who was always terrified of a new "incident" and living off the grid is now green and proud and out in the open 100% surrounded by his closest friends.
Yeah in the 22 film journey we can probably go back and see where they backtracked certain threads or course corrected (remember that random IM short revealing that Killian wasn't the real Mandarin? So much seeing that through, lol) but dude, *22 films*, minimal misfires or continuity gaffes. Epic SW OT/LOTR level action and feels. No I won't even say "SW OT level" feels because SW *never* had this kind of emotion. Exhilaration, yes, but only LOTR and AEG have had me practically tearing up days later on simple reflection of everything that played out on screen.
I don't know how I can call this anything other than an absolute best case scenario. IMO it really is. Bravo Favreau, Feige, Russos, RDJ, Evans, and everyone else. Freaking bravo.
As much as I was disappointed by EG with its time travel plot and pacing and being extremely frustrated by what they did with Hulk, EG is still a good movie.
Its true Marvel did not really make a "Bad" movie. Not in a Batman and Robin way.
IMO AOU is not in anyway shape or form a good movie. But its not Batman and Robin bad..
Now I am not sure that that is a fair way to ***** it.. I mean if I go by that logic then the Transformers have never made a "bad" movie.
But even if you do say that AOU was bad it has some good moments and its made well.
The level of consistency for these films is amazing. How did Marvel do it? Casting and caring about their characters.
The fact that they nailed pretty much every role and made them all likable really helped take some films like Thor 2, IM2 and 3 and still make them watchable and somewhat fun.
Then Marvel makes a move that is either brilliant or lucky... They fall on a couple comedy directors who just happen to be made for this..
IMO the Russo's saved a series that was not really in need of saving but could have gone down hill if not for their talents. They took the least powered Marvel Hero and made him a fan fav. They made you feel like our hero's could die. They juggled tons of characters and made them all interesting.
Imagine if Joss Whedon had been asked to make WS, and CW.. I am sure the films would have still been successful but would they be the films they are? And because of that success maybe he is asked to make IW and EG..
Well at least Hulk would have got more to do but the quality would have suffered IMO.. Granted I love the original Avengers. It's my fav Marvel movie.. But after AOU and JL (though it not all his fault) I just don't see any of those films being the same level of film making.
But what really amazing is that this is not over.. Maybe for some of our hero's but if Spider-man is good to great then its 23 movies in a row.. and who knows how long that steak keeps going.
. Contrasted right before with the beaten, dirty Cap standing alone. 
. (For a bit I irritably wondered why Tony hadn't warned his father but 1) Hydra would've gotten Howard, sooner or later and 2) by then timelines had been all messed up anyway
) I didn't think that sequence w. Tony/Howard was needed anyway but whatever.
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