*BEWARE SPOILERS* Deadpool & Wolverine (July 26th, 2024)

[Dave_W]

There is an idea at the moment that a strong female character must take on traditional masculine attributes and out men the men to be strong (at the expense of traditional female characteristics). This is quite often coincided with male characters taking on the traditional damsel role or just being less intelligent and having less agency than female ones.whilst you might say 'it's about time' or 'now men know how it feels', this isn't going to change the fact that such material will not appeal to your typical male audience. Well written diverse characters like black panther and wonder woman appeal to everyone.

Ultimately, I hope that this period has shown the bean counters that well written characters is the way forward.

This leads into talk about male and female attributes and what exactly they are. You have strong, imposing women and mild, timid men in real life. Does that mean they aren't 'real' women? Are those types not 'real' men? Does that mean those archetypes shouldn't be seen on screen because it comes at the expense of masculinity? All interesting stuff and I for one like the fact that it brings up questions on humanity and what it means to be someone.

 

[Otomofan]

This leads into talk about male and female attributes and what exactly they are. You have strong, imposing women and mild, timid men in real life. Does that mean they aren't 'real' women? Are those types not 'real' men? Does that mean those archetypes shouldn't be seen on screen because it comes at the expense of masculinity? All interesting stuff and I for one like the fact that it brings up questions on humanity and what it means to be someone.

Stop posting this BAIT!! You know damn well we're not allowed to give an honest answer to any of your "hypotheticals." You must love being able to have a completely closed off one-sided "debate" and thinking to yourself that you "won."

You didn't.

We all know the answers to your questions but this board clearly says we're not to discuss it, and you're already violating that, so if we take the bait, we're the ones that are gonna get infractions and this thread is gonna get locked.

You know damn well what everyone thinks. And you think it too.

It's why your avatar is this

and not this

I've tried twice to steer this thread back on topic but you're clearly enjoying trying to stir the ****. Stop it.

 

[jaztermareal]

If looking for the agenda, it is driven by DEI as pushed by blackrock. Companies like disney are paid to shoehorn diversity equity and inclusion not just in the talent (in front and behind the camera) but in the writing. Scenes have to be forced into stories in order to qualify for such funding or to be considered for Oscars etc. All this inevitably comes at the expense of good writing and believability. That is why we are seeing historical individuals being portrayed by people of different races and numerous subplots about LGBTQ characters and relationships. The Last of Us halted all momentum of the plot to stick a gay love story in the middle that ultimately did not further the plot at all. Had that instead been its own movie with a bit more runtime it would have been a great love story framed by the apocolypse but stuck in the middle of the tv show it just grinds everything to a halt wasting an episode in a season that was already cutting a lot down to fit the runtime of a season.


Another issue is that important POC or LGBTQ characters get erased in favor of raceswapped characters. In the Halo show sgt Johnson was sadly missing. Instead Captain Keys and Miranda Keys were needlessly race swapped and then to add insult to injury Captain Keys was portrayed poorly, made a bit of an A hole and killed of early.

Why do such things? Blackrock money depends on it, directors are apparently getting bonuses to force in such actors/scenes/themes. Meritocracy is out, pandering is in when it wasn't necessary. People already loved Black Widow, Scarlett Witch, Sgt Johnson, Will Smith, Idris Elba, Sarah Connor, Denzel Wahington, Star Trek etc etc etc etc etc etc


One of my favourite movies of all time (predestination) for example features a trans character as the lead. It is a very well written movie and doesn't tokenise being trans, it is central to the story. Same thing in Midnight Mass. The sheriff is Muslim, not out of bean counting, but because it is a core plot point that helps guide the story and is consistent with the themes.


Allow diversity to be organic, alllow strong female characters to retain femininity and have flaws, dont vilify a single group (straight white males) as villains or idiots constantly and audiences will enjoy the show. Just focus on writing realistic and consistent, relatable characters.

 

[Dave_W]

Stop posting this BAIT!! You know damn well we're not allowed to give an honest answer to any of your "hypotheticals." You must love being able to have a completely closed off one-sided "debate" and thinking to yourself that you "won."

You didn't.

We all know the answers to your questions but this board clearly says we're not to discuss it, and you're already violating that, so if we take the bait, we're the ones that are gonna get infractions and this thread is gonna get locked.

You know damn well what everyone thinks. And you think it too.

It's why your avatar is this View attachment 700833


and not this View attachment 700835

I've tried twice to steer this thread back on topic but you're clearly enjoying trying to stir the ****. Stop it.

Well if people would stop constantly bringing up 'the woke agenda' in every thread, it wouldn't be a problem in the first place would it?

If the actual answer to 'what is this agenda people keep whining about' breaks the CoC, how about everyone stop complaining about it? Deal?

 

[Otomofan]

One of my favourite movies of all time (predestination) for example features a trans character as the lead.

Great movie. So underrated. Just such a fun story.

 

[jaztermareal]

Great movie. So underrated. Just such a fun story.

It is really tightly written in order to keep the time travel consistent, something so few movies do. Looper for example was such an inconsistent paradoxical mess it was a logical nonsense

 

[ironwez20]

Well if people would stop constantly bringing up 'the woke agenda' in every thread, it wouldn't be a problem in the first place would it?

If the actual answer to 'what is this agenda people keep whining about' breaks the CoC, how about everyone stop complaining about it? Deal?

Yea like that drinker guy. So annoying. Every character who is a woman or poc is woke now in media.

I hate the term “woke” when they don’t even know what it means.

Remember how people were crying woke when morph was gender fluid? lol now it’s been praised as one of the greatest revivals in history

 

[Dave_W]

Yea like that drinker guy. So annoying. Every character who is a woman or poc is woke now in media.

I hate the term “woke” when they don’t even know what it means.

Remember how people were crying woke when morph was gender fluid? lol now it’s been praised as one of the greatest revivals in history

They have the audacity to species swap in this film. Dogpool! The world's gone mad!

 

[chrisstbh]

Yea like that drinker guy. So annoying. Every character who is a woman or poc is woke now in media.

He only likes female characters when they’re damsels in distress.

I hate the term “woke” when they don’t even know what it means.

Remember how people were crying woke when morph was gender fluid? lol now it’s been praised as one of the greatest revivals in history

It’s also not even mentioned in the show at all. You can completely ignore it.

 

[chrisstbh]

IRON STUDIOS STATUE SHOWING THE COWL

https://x.com/deadpoolupdate/status/1786206661146792100?s=46

 

[Sachiel]

I'm sensing an agenda there...

 

[chrisstbh]

I'm sensing an agenda there...

Mustard is stronger than ketchup?

 

[Pauln6a]

He clearly stated the facts and backed it up with evidence. It's right there and it's damning. Every beloved male character was either replaced by a female or had a female counterpart added after the fact.

Why are you so sensitive about people observing a pattern?

There is a pattern but the assumptions are skewed. They aren't replacing the male character because of an agenda but more because the actors move on and their choices are to recast or to bring in a comparable replacement. Pepper isn't a replacement for Tony though, Rhodey is, albeit we don't know if they are going to go there for Secret Wars (when he was Iron Man in the original comics). Captain Carter isn't a replacement for Steve, Sam is. She's just a fun cartoon character who gained some popularity. Clea isn't a replacement for Strange, Wong is. There is a Spider-man and a Spider-woman but she isn't his replacement. She-Hulk is not Hulk's replacement.

Correlation does not equal causation.

There are a ton of lesser known characters and not enough opportunities to use them, so they will be fed into the system at a regular rate and a fair number of lesser known characters will be women because creating a female variant was low hanging fruit back in the day.

The issue was more that many of the early A-list characters were white males and when you move down the chain, you start to hit the more diverse characters that came later.

They have changed the gender or ethnicity of some of the D-list characters and I think it is legitimate to grumble about that but generally, that's less common than tweaking origins and abilities and far less common than tweaking comic-accurate costumes.

Deadpool and Wolverine has a unique opportunity to capitalise on nostalgia, like Spiderman did, while acting as a springboard for the next phase, wrapped up in a lot of inappropriate humour. It has huge potential. I'm just hoping that the next phase builds on what came before as far as the characterisation goes. It would be a shame to waste too much time on resetting and re-introducing everyone again.

 

[MeatHookGekko]

What's your point?

How Deadpool Changed Movies And You Barely Noticed

....One major reason for Deadpool's success was its R rating, which ensured bad words and copious amounts of violence would be on offer, but that's easy to spot. We're here to discuss the more esoteric reasons behind Deadpool's victory over low expectations — and, ultimately, superhero cinema as a whole....

A new kind of marketing - What made it so special isn't just its excessive, over-the-top humor, but also its not-so-subtle meta slant. Befitting the character, Deadpool's marketing made sure to tap into fourth-wall-breaking territory, showcasing a degree of self-awareness that elated the meme generation. This marketing knew its target demographic so well that it transcended its own status, resulting in Deadpool's pre-release antics being shared as entertainment rather than advertising. This led to an unprecedented degree of organic word of mouth, which likely played a huge part in Deadpool's debut as the one of the biggest R-rated openings of all time.

B-list is the new A-list - .... Really, the cast of this movie, from top to bottom, was as B-list or below as it got — and that's probably why it worked so well. Virtually none of these characters had to worry about living up to overwhelming audience expectations, meaning there was minimal pressure and maximum freedom to adapt them however would best suit the film. And that's exactly what Deadpool did, writing them smartly and entertainingly enough to fit within the film's universe while simultaneously maintaining their core comic book identities....

Penny pinching - ....Deadpool proved it's possible to do so much more with so much less. On its shoestring budget, Deadpool relegated itself to only one fully CG character (Colossus), no more than a few action sequences, and even a finale scene that omitted guns entirely solely to keep the budget tight. these sacrifices forced Deadpool to stay focused on the things money can't buy: genuine character development and good humor. With these two tools in its arsenal, Deadpool managed to make every action scene twice as intense and every CGI interaction that much more powerful.

Walking the line between self-aware and sincere - Deadpool, the first and best of its meta-kind, showed that it's possible to be extremely self-aware but also legitimately emotional at the same time. Deadpool tied most of its fourth-wall-breaking antics to the main character's superhero alter ego, so that whenever Wade Wilson and Vanessa Carlysle were sharing an intimate, real beat, no "you're watching a silly superhero movie" humor would crop up and ruin the moment. It was a smart balancing move that ensured audiences would care about Wade and Vanessa's happiness and wellbeing, while also being able to laugh at all of Deadpool's zany shenanigans.

The importance of being subtle - Disaster awaits when a movie tries too hard to be edgy and wacky and never reels itself in enough to have impact. Deadpool, however, nailed this high wire act and managed to keep its humor, action, and emotion in check so nothing took viewers out of the moment. No jokes were overemphasized to the point where they ruined a scene, no action scenes were too ridiculous for their own good, and no emotional beats were hammed up to the point where audiences rolled their eyes. Deadpool kept its jokes subtle and rapid, so that if you didn't chuckle at one you'd be laughing at another within a matter of seconds. It kept its action brisk so there was never a sense of "is this really necessary?" — and it kept its romance between Wade and Vanessa as real and understated as possible. Every interaction between the main couple was reserved and relatable.....

https://www.looper.com/134613/how-deadpool-changed-movies-and-you-barely-noticed/

 

[Garlador]

IRON STUDIOS STATUE SHOWING THE COWL

https://x.com/deadpoolupdate/status/1786206661146792100?s=46

View attachment 700863

Need more of it.

 

[jinkazama]

Need more of it.

Here you go.......

 

[jye4ever]

Here you go.......

Always hated that version because the ears are pointed straight up like Batman instead being flared out sideways like they should be.

Wolverine not meant to have horns he should not look like Darkness from Legend lol

 

[Shai]

Memo to Blackrock and other overlords: Forcing Behavior wont work, only creating more division.

 

[Garlador]

Always hated that version because the ears are pointed straight up like Batman instead being flared out sideways like they should be.

Wolverine not meant to have horns he should not look like Darkness from Legend lol

I've seen it several ways before.

Just depends on the artist.

Now Dark Claw, on the other hand...

 

[chrisstbh]

I've seen it several ways before.

Just depends on the artist.

Now Dark Claw, on the other hand...

Plenty of comic artists suck though.