Captain America: The First Avenger Discussion Thread

[jye4ever]

Yeah. Hell I couldn't even see Fury

Fury got to shoot his weapon this time

 

[jye4ever]

Make your own flying shield with cardboard and duct tape:

https://superpunch.blogspot.com/2011/07/how-to-make-captain-americas-shield-out.html?m=1

 

[Natrix]

The real reason Captain America doesn’t punch Hitler in his new movie

Alasdair Wilkins — Since it became clear that the cinematic Cap would be taking on the Red Skull and his terrorist organization HYDRA, people have asked why he isn't just fighting the Nazis themselves. The creative team have the answer to that question.

This past weekend, we had a chance to chat with the filmmakers behind Captain America: The First Avenger, including writers Christopher Markus and Stephen McFeely, director Joe Johnston, and producers Kevin Feige and Louis D'esposito. They had assembled to explain some of the key decisions behind their new film. The short answer? This movie isn't just about Captain America in World War II - it's about seeing World War II through the prism of the wider Marvel universe. They also explained how Captain America sets Steve Rogers up for his role in The Avengers.

The creative team emphasized that they didn't push the Nazis to one side because they were afraid of using them - as Joe Johnston put it, they're a universal villain and can be killed with impunity, so they didn't leave them out for fear of somehow offending people. And, indeed, they pointed out that there are still plenty of Nazis in the movie, they just aren't the primary antagonists for Cap.

As Kevin Feige explained, the reason they made HYDRA the main villains was because this is a film set in the Marvel universe, and they wanted to be true to as many aspects of the comics as they could. So while the Nazis would be the obvious villains in pretty much any other World War II film (at least any set in the European theater, I guess), only Captain America could feature a bad guy like the Red Skull.

The idea that this was very consciously set in the wider Marvel universe was of great use in writing the script, according to Christopher Markus, and it adds an extra layer for people who are familiar with the comics or even have just seen Iron Man and Thor. Since the movie needed an all-powerful Macguffin anyway, he said it made perfect sense to just use the Cosmic Cube, which had already been set up in Thor, while the presence of a young Howard Stark as a key ally for Cap brings in what Markus could only describe as "that Tony Starkness."

That said, Feige acknowledged that Cap very much does fight Nazis as well as supervillains in the original comics, and he alluded to the iconic cover of Captain America #1, in which Steve Rogers punches out Hitler. The problem, he explained, is that it's very difficult to come up with any logical scenario that could get Cap to that moment.

Instead, he said that they decided to just tip their hats to that cover by incorporating that imagery into the USO show in which Cap is forced to participate. And "forced" is the right word - Joe Johnston said it's his favorite sequence of the movie, but they made sure Steve seemed out of place and uncomfortable amid this silliness. As a bonus, Feige explained that the USO show actually inspires the creation of the in-universe version of Marvel Comics, which is an homage to the comic book universe's longstanding contention that Marvel Comics exists as a not always accurate chronicle of the superheroes' various adventures.

The other challenge, according to the writers, was that they couldn't just tell a straight-up origin story in which we saw, say, Captain America's first mission. Instead, the movie had to be baggy enough to cover the final three years of the war and get Steve to the present day in time for The Avengers. To some extent, that's to leave room for unseen, 1940s-set adventures that could form part of later sequels.

But, as Christopher Markus explained, that approach was also a necessity for The Avengers to make any sense. After all, in keeping with the comics version of the team, Steve has to be the most seasoned and experienced soldier imaginable, and somebody whose past experiences in World War II make him a natural leader and someone who can command the respect of all these other ridiculously powerful superheroes. The only way to do that, Markus said, was to "bloat in" all that extra backstory.

 

[Biojex]

Just bought my tickets for the midnight showing

 

[jye4ever]

Just bought my tickets for the midnight showing

 

[CelticPredator]

Well, as long as Cap shoots a swastika wearin, jew hatin', humanitarianless (it's a word now!) BASTARD...

Then i'm good.

 

[Biojex]

 

[Anzik]

As much as I would like to check out a midnight showing of this, its much more fun sharing the experience with my son.

 

[jye4ever]

I'm all set boys and girls.

Cap Art Book, check.

Cap Game, check.

Cap T-Shirt, check.

Cap HT preordered, check.

Cap midnight tickets, check.

Cap post release party, check.

Bring on the fake Nazis with their Star Wars lasers and At-At Walkers, i'm ready for everything they have to offer!

Lets not forget the Spidey trailer and Avengers teaser!

 

[PlayItLoud]

Thanks to Josh and his endorsement of the Art of Thor book which I bought way back in April in that order I completely forgot that I pre-order another book. And this just arrived today....

If you loved the Art of Thor, I'm pretty sure you'll like this one as well.

 

[Jaycepticon]

I can't wait to get that. Mine gets here Thursday and I can't wait

 

[jye4ever]

From Slashfilm:

Chris Evans spoke to Movieline about the differences in Captain America costumes, his contact with Marvel and working with one of his idols: Robert Downey Jr.:

He’s so great. I can’t say enough about him, I really can’t. I didn’t know what to expect going in to work with him. He’s so talented and he’s got so much charisma and persona. I can honestly say, of all the movie stars I’ve worked with, he’s the one that when he comes on set, you really feel like, ‘Man — this guy’s a movie star!’ You just feel it. When he comes in a room he just owns the oxygen. He is a movie star, and he’s been so great. So supportive, so positive. I had to do a scene with him the other day where I was just nervous, it was just me and him, and I was just terrified. It’s Robert Downey Jr

And he’s just, you know, every little take he gives you a fist bump, a little thumbs up, and it just changes your whole day. It probably means nothing in his mind but I go back to my trailer, like, giddy. He really is something else.

 

[BuddyGus]

No info about the new costume huh?

 

[Jaycepticon]

just this

Chris Evans recently talked to Movie Line about the differences between the Cap costume in The First Avenger and the one in The Avengers, saying:

They each have pros and cons. [T]he first Cap costume is very cumbersome. It’s thick and it’s bulky, it’s tough to do fight sequences in, but the cowl, the helmet, can come on and off at will. The current wardrobe is a bit different. The suit, the range of motion is fantastic, you can really get some good fight sequences in. It’s a little bit more form-fitting. But the cowl, the hood, has some… changes that make it a little more difficult to get on and off.

 

[BuddyGus]

Awesome. Can't wait for pictures. Thanks for sharing.

 

[lord-22]

the captain america OST is awesome !!

alan silvestri did it again

[ame="https://youtu.be/3dPfwr8w_OU"]302 Found[/ame]

[ame="https://youtu.be/CX_K5yd5xkg"]302 Found[/ame]

[ame="https://youtu.be/vsrd1z-Ufuo"]302 Found[/ame]

 

[Spartan Rex]

“Originally, we called the Howling Commandos ‘The Invaders,’”" Johnston says. “It wasn’t until my son Henry, who is in high school, came over to spend the summer with me while I was making this, and the Marvel team gave him a video camera and let him go behind the scenes to make a documentary about the making of the movie. And in the credits of his little documentary he credits them as ‘The Howling Commandos.’ He put it on the screen, as a graphic – ‘Howling Commandos.’ And Kevin Feige sees that and goes, ‘You know, that sounds pretty good. Let’s call’em what they are, The Howling Commandos. Why the hell not?’”


Aye Chihuahua.
Why werent they called by the correct name in the first place?

 

[Spartan Rex]

Comic Book Movies:
The Hollywood Reporter Reviews Captain America: The First Avenger!
In something of a mixed review, it seems Marvel Studios have once again done a good job bringing one of their heroes to the big screen, but it's unable to live up to the benchmark set by X-Men: First Class...
The review for Captain America: The First Avenger have all been pretty good so far, but The Hollywood Reporter (one of the first major outlets to give their take on the movie) has now released their somewhat mixed take on the upcoming movie. While it's far from a bad review, they do seem to find a fair few faults, spurred on perhaps by the critically acclaimed X-Men: First Class it would seem! Head on over to the site to read the review in full.

Captain America delivers comic-book action that should satisfy Captain America’s fans, old and new, while Chris Evans’ no-nonsense yet engaging portrayal of a man who doesn’t know how to back away from a fight may cause young women to swoon and young men to join a gym. Yet the film will leave others wondering, especially following the film’s long gestation and marketing build-up, "Is this all there is?"

For in terms of even recent films, Captain America lacks the deft touch, appealing character interaction and sophisticated storytelling skills of Marvel Comics’ X-Men: First Class. And let’s not even bother to compare this to Christopher Nolan’s Batman series.

Sticking to its simplistic, patriotic origins, where a muscular red, white and blue GI slugging Adolf Hitler in the jaw is all that’s required, Captain America trafficks in red-blooded heroes, dastardly villains, classy dames and war-weary military officers. There is no ambiguity here. Nor does any superhero question his powers. No, sir, not in this war and not with these determined heroes. While bracketed by a modern-day sequence, the movie otherwise takes place in a heightened rendering of the early days of the fight against Nazi Germany.

An overnight media sensation, the military doesn't know what to do with Steve other than send him— shades of Flags of Our Fathers— on a bond-raising tour as the newly dubbed Captain America. When the tour takes him to Europe, he breaks out of the carnival show long enough to save the lives of nearly 400 GIs including his Brooklyn buddy Bucky Barnes (Sebastian Stan). This rescue cues a new assignment for Captain America. Steve is now point man for Col. Phillips’ team in Strategic Scientific Research, along with the redoubtable Peggy Carter and inventor Howard Stark (Dominic Cooper), in taking on the Hydra organization, a Nazi science division that is even worse than the Nazis. In fact, it’s more like a worldwide criminal organization out of the James Bond era, intent on world conquest and more than willing to kill fellow Nazis. Everyone associated with this evil group shouts not "Heil Hitler" but "Heil Hydra."

Caught between contemporary tent-pole movie making and a period piece, the movie keeps featuring very odd visual anachronisms. You might accept the battles that feature sci-fi weapons along side vintage WWII arms but what to make of the Hydra soldiers’ Darth Vader costumes, those weird planes, cars and a submarine that maneuver within 1943’s earth, sky and sea and, most alarming of all, that red dress Peggy wears in the battle zone. It’s a knock-‘em-dead outfit that may be a special weapon all its own.

Director Joe Johnston makes certain that amid all the retro-futuristic nonsense his nucleus of actors playing SSR heroes fits well together. Evans nicely underplays the role, giving a Gary Cooper-ish air to the young hero who just wants to do the right thing. Atwell is a perfect throwback to that era: Darkly gorgeous yet tough as nails, she would look just at home painted on a bomber fuselage as she is slugging a solider who gives her lip. Jones knows how to make every moment of screen time count with these grumpy and gruff characters he now plays, but Stan and Cooper aren’t so lucky: Their characters came out a little too thin in Christopher Markus and Stephen McFeely‘s screenplay. Meanwhile, Weaving is very one-notish as the villain, which leaves it to Toby Jones, as his sidekick, to add a little nuance to Nazi villainy.

The tech team brilliantly supports the comic-book action without any single department showing off or adding unnecessary flourishes. A special tip of the hat here to Anna B. Sheppard’s costumes and Rick Heinrichs’ production design for maintaining enough period flavor so the production doesn’t go too overboard.
Oh yes, this film is yet another summer fantasy in 3D in certain theaters. For some sequences, the format works well enough but it’s hardly worth the extra expenditure. This gimmick is truly running out of steam.

 

[Spartan Rex]

Captain America: The First Avenger Review
Marvel's new movie is this close to being their best.
IGN
July 20, 2011

by Phil Pirrello
LATEST IMAGES

This review contains some SPOILERS. Captain America: The First Avenger is that rare summer movie that delivers on everything promised in its trailers, and that's about all it does, which isn't to say it's not a good movie.

Rather, it's just a "good" movie, a very efficient and enjoyable piece of matinee entertainment. It's a summer movie adventure whose story takes place across a few years and several locations, and it has a fun time doing it. But like Iron Man 2 and, to some degree, Thor, Cap seems content with being a base hit instead of going that extra, edgier mile to become a home run; to be that movie you revisit time and time again because you're still trying to master it.

After one viewing, Joe Johnston's best movie since October Sky leaves nothing new to be found; there are no significant discussions of subtext or nuance to be had after leaving the theatre, like we had after seeing X-Men: First Class, Dark Knight or Spider-Man 2. But that's better than leaving the theatre discussing the black-out rage issues a movie like Green Lantern has that Cap, successfully, avoids.

Broadly speaking, superheroes generally have the same origin story parameters. It's a formula that Marvel, for better or worse, has capitalized on. (The names and settings change, but the mold stays the same.) With check-list precision, Cap's origin story hits all the expected beats while laying another stone on the path to The Avengers.

The howl of arctic wind leads us to a snowy wasteland, where a present-day government team discovers a frozen... something. They excavate the site, locate Cap's frozen shield and before we can ask "where's its owner?", we're back in WWII, New York City, where we meet our hero, Steve Rogers. Here, Chris Evans invests the First Avenger with an unstoppable amount of likability, as Steve goes from a bullied weakling who lacks the "I quit" gene, to a genetically-enhanced super solider who has proven his mettle to his country selling war bonds, but still has to win over his fellow soldiers fighting in WWII.

Enter Dr. Johann Schmidt, AKA Red Skull (the always reliable Hugo Weaving) and his HYDRA army, a collection of ultra-faction Nazis hellbent on making Hitler's campaign look like a square dance. With the all-powerful Tesseract/Cosmic Cube in hand, and an endless supply of well-armed canon fodder at his disposal, Skull takes to the skies with a massive single-winged death plane named Valkyrie, and only Cap can stop him.

Along the way, key players from Cap's Marvel history help him out. Dr. Erskine (Stanley Tucci) plays both sympathetic mentor and scientist in charge of the Super Solider program. Sebastian Stan's Bucky Barnes is Cap's best friend, with Stan playing the role in such a way where we wish we had more time to spend with the character, one whose ambiguous final moments more than hint to his darker, Winter Solider rising in a sequel. The (never named) Howling Commandos, whom Cap breaks out of a POW camp, are extended cameos that deserve their own movie. Most of their action is relegated to an enjoyable, ol' fashioned montage showcasing their explosive brand of field ops alongside Cap, and the scene is one of the movie's best. It's a testament to how much Johnston and the actors sincerely like these characters that they feel fully realized, despite their limited screentime.

There's Tommy Lee Jones playing a bulldog of an Army Colonel overseeing Captain America in action, and getting most of the film's best lines. And to those who had reservations about Evans taking on the role, the actor does not disappoint. Since Evans took on the part, inevitable comparisons to his portrayal of The Human Torch in the Fantastic Four films were bound to come up. Thankfully, Evans keeps the two portrayals separate. He negotiates that fine line between being a Boy Scout and being a hero with effortless charm, thus ensuring that the last piece in the Avengers puzzle is a hero worth investing in.

The heart and soul of the movie rests with Hayley Atwell's Peggy and Evans' Steve. Their dynamic gives Marvel their most believable and satisfying romantic coupling on the big screen yet. Atwell's understated work, coupled with Evans' ability to find the right amount of emotional credibility in any scene, gives First Avenger an emotional center not usually found in these movies.



What personality the movie has comes through in its 1940s "futura" style, which informs everything from the action-packed set-pieces to the production design. An early sequence at a Stark Expo-type World's Fair feels like a 1940s Max Fleischer Superman cartoon come to life. Johnston commits fully to this tone, without veering into camp or whatever compromised Sky Captain, a movie with a similar aesthetic. Captain America may not be the most daring comic book movie ever made, but visually speaking, it is one of the genre's most interesting. movie's weakest link is its villain, as Red Skull is truly underdeveloped. He spends more time building his death plane and reminding us how evil he is, than he does emerging as a true threat for Cap to conquer. (SPOILER WARNING! In fact, Cap doesn't even defeat Skull. The Cosmic Cube takes him out, similar to how the Ark took out Indy's nemesis, Belloc, in Raiders, but without the clarity and satisfaction of that final moment.)

And it's important to note that, since Cap began production, comparisons have been made between it and Spielberg's first Indiana Jones movie. (Even by Johnston himself, who worked on Raiders.) Outside of a globe-trotting adventure and a few beats that wink to the playfulness of Indy's first ride, the comparisons stop there. Because Johnston is the director you hire to make the production look good, to make sure the CG hits its mark and things move from A to B without a hitch. Spielberg is the guy you get to give all of that life; to give it a personality, a spark.

That spark finds its way into the proceedings, but it does so intermittently and inconsistently, leading to an awkwardly-paced last 10 minutes that are more concerned with setting up a sequel and The Avengers, than they are concluding the story we've invested in here.

Captain America: The First Avenger neither commits any terrible storytelling offenses nor takes any significant creative risks. If the director and the script took more chances with the material, Marvel could have had their best movie ever. Instead, they'll just have to settle for one of their better ones.

 

[jye4ever]

From Bad Ass Digest, the dude who hated IM2, Thor and GL (but loved (XMFC):


There were problems with Iron Man 2 and Thor on fundamental levels, but the biggest issue with both films was the way that Marvel Studios forced the stories to submit to a larger continuity wank, to fit in extraneous and stupid SHIELD business in order to build a shared universe and set up The Avengers. There is (almost) none of that in Captain America: The First Avenger, meaning the movie gets to be its own movie and tell its own story, which on its own would make it the best Marvel movie since Iron Man.

But Captain America: The First Avenger is more than just the elusive standalone Marvel film – it’s the best Marvel Studios film, and one of the superhero movies that reminds us this genre is a viable storytelling format when it isn’t being smashed into following formulas or sticking to conventions. Captain America is not a great movie but it’s a damn good one, a thrilling and fun adventure movie with cracking one liners, decent action on a large scale and terrific characters played by good actors.

The film, directed by The Rocketeer’s Joe Johnston and written by Christopher Markus & Stephen McFeely (with, I understand, some uncredited work by Joss Whedon), takes some minor liberties with the origins of the Star Spangled Avenger but gets the meat of it right. Steve Rogers is a scrawny kid who wants nothing more than to serve his country in WWII. What he lacks in muscle and stamina he makes up for in brains, heart and guts – he’s the perfect American trapped in an imperfect body. A top secret super soldier serum morphs Steve into a specimen of physical perfection, but Nazi agents sabotage the project, leaving Steve as the only one of his kind. He heads to Europe, wearing the costume and shield of Captain America, to do battle with the evil, deformed Red Skull and his science cult Hydra, guys so evil they think the Nazis are soft.

But most of all what it gets right is the tone. The film is earnest and not afraid to be a little bit corny. There’s not a lick of irony in the piece, and while the movie does do that modern superhero tap dance of having to explain why the hero gets a costume – in this case Cap’s first assignment is as a USO bond salesman – the script actually manages to make it all feel pretty organic and not like a huge wink at the audience (here’s a hint for future comic book movie writers: just realize that at this point we simply accept these characters in costumes. It isn’t 1999 anymore). And most of all the movie understands it needs to be FUN – this isn’t the kind of Batman Begins slog that too many fanboys want out of their superhero films, it’s a rollicking old-fashioned adventure story.

It isn’t the post-modern fun of Iron Man, though – Captain America is firmly entrenched in the spirit of WWII. Raiders of the Lost Ark is the obvious comparison point (and cheekily referenced in the movie), especially because Johnston worked on that film, but the director’s own The Rocketeer is another good example. It’s two fisted, over the top and filled with retro scifi flair. Scientists preside over control panels that spark and explode, retro-futurist jets buzz through the air and Captain America blows up a seven story tall tank.

While Thor felt a lot like a retread of Iron Man, Captain America blazes its own ground by making its hero not a smartass, not full of himself and not flawed. If anything, you could complain that Steve Rogers has next to no arc because he’s exactly the same when he’s a scrawny guy standing up to bullies as he is when he’s Captain America duking it out with the Red Skull in the control room of a massive stealth bomber. But that’s the greatness of the character, the idea that the man inside is more important than the man outside; the Skull is the evil reverse of Cap, an already strong man who wanted to be stronger and subjected himself to an early version of the super soldier serum, which amplified his own bad qualities. Steve Rogers is polite and smart and friendly and sweet and good – all the things that we used to think of ourselves as Americans, in the days before Vietnam or Watergate, anyway.

Amazingly Captain America doesn’t touch on any of that. The film makes no effort to paint Allied forces as anything but grand heroes; while some of the soldiers are salty, they’re decent men. It’s refreshing to have that image of our armed forces in a post-Guantanamo era. There are some who may find this to be an insidious right wing political statement, but I think the replacement of Nazis with Hydra moves Cap perfectly into the realm of non-political fantasy.

Chris Evans makes a terrific Captain America. He gets the aw-shucks everyman quality of the character perfectly, and he looks pretty good with his shirt off. There’s no ego in Cap, and Evans nails that – he’s a guy who just wants to do the right thing and do it well. I can’t wait to see what Evans does with the character in future films.

He’s supported by a fairly incredible cast. Tommy Lee Jones is a revelation, reminding us of what he can do when he’s actually engaged with the material. He’s funny and badass in equal measure, and he’s charmingly loose when the time is right. Stanley Tucci is also great as Dr. Erskine, the man who comes up with the super soldier serum; both characters have plenty of funny one-liners that have Joss Whedon’s fingerprints all over them.

Sebastian Stan is Bucky, Cap’s sidekick. In this version Bucky has been aged up and is actually Steve’s best friend from Brooklyn, a blustery ladies man type who gets into the Army while Steve is 4F. It’s a good change and it allows a nice shorthand for the relationship between the two; sometimes you can ____ with the myth and actually improve it. Stan is good, but he doesn’t really get a ton of screentime. Hayley Atwell is fine as Agent Carter, the mysterious British liaison to the Super Soldier initiative; she’s beautiful in 1940s get-up, and the character is presented as quite kick ass, but she’s missing a scene where Carter goes from type to straight up character.

Hugo Weaving KILLS as the Red Skull. Putting on a Werner Herzog accent he has the time of his life going just broad enough without being campy. The Skull has a stretch limo deathmobile, so Weaving needs to be able to fill that seat while also maintaining reality as a character, which he does incredibly well. The Marvel Universe is filled with great bad guys, which makes the complete dearth of good baddies in the Marvel Studios films baffling. The Skull is the best realized Marvel bad guy yet put to film, by Marvel Studios or anyone else.

Tagging along with him is Dr. Arnim Zola, played with weaselly fun by Toby Jones. He’s not quite comfortable with the weird superscience cult that the Skull has built, and he’s physically perfectly out of place around the masked stormtroopers and Kirby-looking devices.

I wish I had more to say about the Howling Commandos, but they get the short shrift. The words ‘Howling Commandos’ are never uttered, and none of them are ever named in the film. They LOOK great, and they do take part in most of the film’s action, but I would have loved to see another couple of scenes with these guys, at least one where they told the audience who they were.

In fact this leads to my biggest complaint about Captain America: The First Avenger: it’s too short! The film is two hours long but could have easily fit in another ten or fifteen minutes in the second act’s action montage, which covers Cap’s activities during the length of the war, shutting down Hydra bases. It isn’t that the film is lacking in action – for the first time in Marvel Studios history a movie has just the right amount of action and it’s big enough to be satisfying – but it’s that the movie feels like it jumps quickly from establishing Cap to the final battle with the Red Skull. I wanted more! And that’s the kind of complaint only good movies have levied against them.

The action works, but isn’t spectacular. As mentioned, the action is bigger here and better staged than any of the previous Marvel films. The movie also peppers the action throughout, and the climactic battle feels appropriately climactic, not like an afterthought. I think Joe Johnston is a journeyman director and his skills lie in working with actors, so his action stuff is serviceable but not great. Still, Johnston manages to one-up Raiders’ guy-into-propeller gag in a big, big way.

This is the Marvel movie I’ve been waiting for. Iron Man is a really good film, but at the time I gave it a lot of passes – especially in the action department – because I was so happy with what it got right. But the rest of the movies the studio has released ranged from okay to not particularly good, and none of the other movies felt like they were real competitors in the summer movie sweepstakes. Captain America is big in a way no other Marvel movie has been, and it swings for the fences in ways that no Marvel movie since Iron Man has done.

Forget about comparing it to Marvel movies, though. Captain America is of a kind with X-Men: First Class in that it attempts to actively thrill and engage, but it’s better than that film (for one thing its effects seem three-quarters baked* as opposed to First Class’ half baked effects). It’s a ripping good time, a fun romp that scales all the action to pulp levels and doesn’t fall into endless CGI traps. There’s a lot of actual stunt people doing actual jumps and falls and swings in this film. It’s a movie where a punch to the face has impact, a movie where leaping across a flaming chasm is a great action and character moment.

It’s been a hit or miss summer, but Captain America is a huge hit. This is what a summer movie should be, filled with good performances and fun adventure and brisk storytelling. All of a sudden I’m excited for The Avengers again.

* I will say this: while some of the green screen stuff is borderline bad, the movie spends the money where it needs to – on creating scrawny Steve Rogers. By making skinny Steve believable Captain America gives you more character, and I’ll take that over a realistic hangar bay any day.