Hot Toys Predator 2 - (battle damaged version) full spec

[Jamal]

Okay, I know I seem to get into this argument on a daily basis, but all that design had a purpose. The Predators in AVP were Initiates. They were there for their Rite of Passage/ first big hunt. While they are "alien" by their very nature, I would imagine they still share similaries to other bi-pedal races, such as humans. Think of them as teenagers trying to prove themselves. Of course they are going to be cocky (I actually thought the chest bump/slap thing illustrated that well). The pyramid was suppose to be a controlled environment. They really didn't fear going in there ... until the humans screwed it up by hitting the "start" button before they reached their cannons. The film did a good job of punishing the predators for their arrogance (I still love the "Yeah, I am badass ... now let me pose here, even though the place is crawling with these f'kers" and the resounding chest stab from above by the alien). So, yeah, what many of you see as weaknesses I see as character development. Besides, I am sure it takes a few hunts before they learn the lessons of P1, P2, and presumably Wolf ... it takes more than an arsenal to take down aliens ... you have to be a warrior born.

Don't get me wrong, I still cringe at some of the pacing problems (i.e. the accelerated alien birth cycle, the haphazard movement patterns of the pyramid, etc). However, I remember reading an interview with Anderson a while back where he explained how the studio had gutted a lot of his intended continuity with the budget cut and PG-13 mandate. I won't go into it all, but here's an example - Anderson had planned to shoot a scene with the alien queen activator to show the viewer that the machine artificially sped up the growth cycle of the Aliens to create a better testing environment. But FOX cut the budget and refused to push back the release, so he had to go with what he had. All in all, Anderson gets crucified for AvP, when it really wasn't all his fault. I agree it wasn't up to the standards of it's fore bearers. However, I don't feel it was Anderson's fault.

Having read all this i think Paul Anderson begs to differ about his Predators experience in hunting, he states himself on the special features disc that "my Predators are older and wiser than that of P1 and P2, those 2 Predators were let loose on earth like children to play with human prey whereas my Predators were more seasoned hunters going after the Alien prey in the pyramid" i **** you not he said this on the special edition disc. Its not a quote but thats what he said in a nutshell

 

[Bardoon]

Having read all this i think Paul Anderson begs to differ about his Predators experience in hunting, he states himself on the special features disc that "my Predators are older and wiser than that of P1 and P2, those 2 Predators were let loose on earth like children to play with human prey whereas my Predators were more seasoned hunters going after the Alien prey in the pyramid" i **** you not he said this on the special edition disc. Its not a quote but thats what he said in a nutshell

Wow...then Anderson is really a flippin' moron to say one thing in an interview and then have his film say completely the opposite.

I remember reading all the stuff prior to AvP about how the Predators were "young, unblooded" hunters. The whole Predator caste system, the blooded,unblooded,bad blood,etc. status system was something brought up by the Predator novels and comic books.

Anyways, anyone think Sideshow will have the battle-damage Predator 2 for pre-order this week?

 

[Jamal]

Im gonna go through the disc again and see how he said it exactly and post it up

 

[DouglasMcc]

Having read all this i think Paul Anderson begs to differ about his Predators experience in hunting, he states himself on the special features disc that "my Predators are older and wiser than that of P1 and P2, those 2 Predators were let loose on earth like children to play with human prey whereas my Predators were more seasoned hunters going after the Alien prey in the pyramid" i **** you not he said this on the special edition disc. Its not a quote but thats what he said in a nutshell

I will take your word on that part. After I found out how little gore/R material was being added into the "non-rated" version, I skipped that double dip. And, if that's true, then either A.) Anderson is trying to rationalize/ i.e. sell what he put on the screen or B.) well, not really a B, unless he's delusional. Because, I can't see an experienced Predator running around with all those toys. Hell, all the Elders they have shown us were minimally armed. If those Predators were that experienced and well trained, A.) why would they need to come to some offworld theme park hunt for kicks and B.) why would they need 4 foot swords in addition to their wrist blades? A true warrior (and I would imagine this, no matter the species) wins and, in that, is challenged by the hunt... not running around with the Terminator's armory strapped to his body. Plus, the flash back to the Predator in ancient times standing on top of the Pyramid makes no sense with that interpretation. But, I digress. I interpret it in my way. And, since no one ever says, "yes, these are elite predators" in the film, I will continue to believe what I see.

However, I still say that FOX ruined that movie, not Anderson.

 

[screamingmetal]

Wow...then Anderson is really a flippin' moron to say one thing in an interview and then have his film say completely the opposite.

I remember reading all the stuff prior to AvP about how the Predators were "young, unblooded" hunters. The whole Predator caste system, the blooded,unblooded,bad blood,etc. status system was something brought up by the Predator novels and comic books.

Anyways, anyone think Sideshow will have the battle-damage Predator 2 for pre-order this week?

Yep, that's usually the way it goes, Sideshow releases a teaser image of a figure one week, and has the preorder the week following. Look for it in Thursday night's newsletter.

 

[Praetorian380]

I will take your word on that part. After I found out how little gore/R material was being added into the "non-rated" version, I skipped that double dip. And, if that's true, then either A.) Anderson is trying to rationalize/ i.e. sell what he put on the screen or B.) well, not really a B, unless he's delusional. Because, I can't see an experienced Predator running around with all those toys. Hell, all the Elders they have shown us were minimally armed. If those Predators were that experienced and well trained, A.) why would they need to come to some offworld theme park hunt for kicks and B.) why would they need 4 foot swords in addition to their wrist blades? A true warrior (and I would imagine this, no matter the species) wins and, in that, is challenged by the hunt... not running around with the Terminator's armory strapped to his body. Plus, the flash back to the Predator in ancient times standing on top of the Pyramid makes no sense with that interpretation. But, I digress. I interpret it in my way. And, since no one ever says, "yes, these are elite predators" in the film, I will continue to believe what I see.

However, I still say that FOX ruined that movie, not Anderson.

Anderson ruined the movie - he wrote it and directed it - the script sucked - the story sucked, the casting sucked (except for Lance Henrickson who was killed off mind you), the acting sucked (except for Lance Henrickson), the timeline of events sucked, the cinematography sucked, and the creature concepts sucked. I hated that movie and that is hard for me to deal with because I am such a HUGE HUGE Predator/Alien fan. I had such high hopes for the series going in a new direction but unfortunately FOX went with a director who had done crap movies in the past and he continued that trend with AVP. I could sit here all day go off on all of the problems, minute by minute throughout the entire film, but I dont want to waist my breath.....and I do believe that it was a combined effort by FOX and Anderson screwing up this movie. FOX for hiring Anderson to script and direct and Anderson because he is just not a very good film maker.


Heres hoping the Strause brothers can rejuvenate these characters and give them the respect that they deserve and earned since the day they graced the minds of all sci fi fans long ago. I hope and pray that AVP2 is what it should be. A badass movie!!!

 

[gdb]

Back on topic, I'm still pissed at HT. Why couldn't they have given us that switchable mandible thing for the first P2 release, or every other Pred release for the matter? That would've made me content with the first version at least.

I agree. Ideally I'd like them to have released one Predator with all the bells and whistles but no blood. Then an exclusive with green blood on his face and chest.

 

[screamingmetal]

I agree. Ideally I'd like them to have released one Predator with all the bells and whistles but no blood. Then an exclusive with green blood on his face and chest.

I'm starting to think that the Battle Damaged P2 Sideshow exclusive version might have all the bells and whistles including the regular mask. It may still have the blood paint but I could live with that. I'd doubt Hot Toys would've released an alternative version with just blood painted on. Perhaps have him come with the missing arm and alien skull would've been enough.
I did notice that the BD Pred 2 doesn't come with King Willie's skull and spine. But truthfully, I'd rather have the Alien skull, especially since HT screwed up and made the spinal column and sacrum grossly underscaled. Besides, it's actually easy and cheap to find a replacment skull and spinal column in 1:6 scale.

 

[Rob]

Actually, the skull/spine was Jerry Lambert's(Bill Paxton).

As for Anderson's comment on the earlier Predators; he's a *******. He's also lied about how long the fight scenes were in interviews before the movie came out. Here's hoping a Predator comes to Earth and hunts him down for being a stupid, lying idiot.

Besides, he's breaking continuity with AVP anyway, so I wouldn't take his word for granted.

@Praetorian380: Agreed! But I put blame on both ******* Anderson and 20th Century ******s since they've been screwing the Alien Franchise since A3, so it wouldn't surprise me they sabotaged AVP aswell.

 

[DouglasMcc]

Anderson ruined the movie - he wrote it and directed it - the script sucked - the story sucked, the casting sucked (except for Lance Henrickson who was killed off mind you), the acting sucked (except for Lance Henrickson), the timeline of events sucked, the cinematography sucked, and the creature concepts sucked. I hated that movie and that is hard for me to deal with because I am such a HUGE HUGE Predator/Alien fan. I had such high hopes for the series going in a new direction but unfortunately FOX went with a director who had done crap movies in the past and he continued that trend with AVP. I could sit here all day go off on all of the problems, minute by minute throughout the entire film, but I dont want to waist my breath.....and I do believe that it was a combined effort by FOX and Anderson screwing up this movie. FOX for hiring Anderson to script and direct and Anderson because he is just not a very good film maker.

Okay, please don't take this as a personal attack. It's aimed at a whole subset of people. Best way not to ramble is to hit it point by point:

1.)Anderson ruined the movie - he wrote it and directed it - the script sucked - the story sucked

Well, from all the information that has been released, can we all agree on 2 key factors - 1.) the studio forced Anderson to turn his R-rated movie into a PG-13 at the last minute and 2.) the studio cut his budget by around 33% at the end (in fact, from what I have read, the explosion at the end cost him 40% of the entire budget he finished with - when the script was in the planning, he had plenty more cash to play around with). So, you are going to blame the man despite all these factors? He wrote it, sure. But the suits CHANGED it over half way into the film. He directed it, but the SUITS forced him to cut massive amounts of R-rated material, then wouldn't give me any cash to fix the holes that left. But, no, it's his fault. Sorry, I don't agree with you, and I don't see the logic in that statement. Yes, I will agree the story had plot holes and problems. But, since that was a compromised version of his story, script, and directing, I don't get the logic in blaming him. Oh, I get your hate, but hate is never logical. He is the big name on front of something you thinks hurts a property you love, so you attack him. I get that.

2.) the casting sucked (except for Lance Henrickson who was killed off mind you), the acting sucked (except for Lance Henrickson), the timeline of events sucked, the cinematography sucked, and the creature concepts sucked. I hated that movie and that is hard for me to deal with because I am such a HUGE HUGE Predator/Alien fan.

I actually liked the cast. My only problem was the ever-present Hollywood need to fill scientists/ intellectual roles with models and GAP commercial refugees. However, I didn't have a problem with the acting. But, I know stuff like acting is a personal taste thing, so I will not argue with you there. I also agree the timeline sucked, but once again, that was due to the last minute changes and shift to a PG-13 film. The only point I will argue is the cinematography. Anderson used the same guy he used on the original RE and I think he brought a dynamic style to both films.

I really feel like most people who blindly hate this film do so out of some imaginary, self-inflicted sense of personal attack. Anderson and FOX did this to ME dammit. To quote the Star Wars PT haters, "Anderson rapped my childhood ... *sob* ". I too admit that the film wasn't anywhere near the original films. But it wasn't a horrible film. It was just average. But, that seems to be the personal insult to the haters. It wasn't suppose to be average. It was suppose to be amazing ... some fanboy wetdream. Same thing happened to Freddy vs. Jason. It was an entertaining film. However, it took so long to get out, and people's expectations were so high, it never had a chance.

However, I welcome any explanation and discussion of all you "suck" points. Maybe then you sentiment would make more sense to me.

P.S.

He's also lied about how long the fight scenes were in interviews before the movie came out.

The fights were the most cut elements of the purge to PG-13 - cutting down on the graphic violence. That's why they felt so clipped/jumpy. But that's Anderson's fault, since he should have know when he scripted them that FOX would force a PG-13 on him ... right

 

[AdamBombOi]

I'm not trying to start anything, but I had to put in my two cents about AvP.

Yes, Anderson did not do a great job.

Yes, things could have been better.

Yes, he could have used the Machiko/planet Ryushi story to make long time fans happy.

Yes, PG-13 ratings suck.

Yes, Fox sucked for not having him do a better job.

Yes the Predators were too big.

But, he did give nods to the comics.

It is possible that like our own world, that their race differs in size, coloring, and customs.

The crap he spewed on bonus scene's weren't in the actual movie, and really mean nothing.

The blooding and marking hadn't been established when Predator 1 came out. If Stephen Hopkins had looked over the comics that were released ONE year before Predator 2 came out, he could have included some marking on the creatures to make them appear 'older' and more 'experienced' and that'd have taken care of this crap now. Instead, he followed the comics Hopkins SHOULD have when he made his movie and included the blooding of Scar, and Scar blooding Lex, just like in the original comics Broken Tusk blooded Machiko.

But it's whatever, and no one can go back in time and change anything. I still watch, and LET myself enjoy AvP because aside from being into punk, it's the only thing I've continuously had an interest it. All I'm saying is, take his movie with a grain of salt, it's really REALLY not as bad as people make it out to be.

 

[DouglasMcc]

I'm not trying to start anything, but I had to put in my two cents about AvP.

Yes, Anderson did not do a great job.

Yes, things could have been better.

Yes, he could have used the Machiko/planet Ryushi story to make long time fans happy.

Yes, PG-13 ratings suck.

Yes, Fox sucked for not having him do a better job.

Yes the Predators were too big.

But, he did give nods to the comics.

It is possible that like our own world, that their race differs in size, coloring, and customs.

The crap he spewed on bonus scene's weren't in the actual movie, and really mean nothing.

The blooding and marking hadn't been established when Predator 1 came out. If Stephen Hopkins had looked over the comics that were released ONE year before Predator 2 came out, he could have included some marking on the creatures to make them appear 'older' and more 'experienced' and that'd have taken care of this crap now. Instead, he followed the comics Hopkins SHOULD have when he made his movie and included the blooding of Scar, and Scar blooding Lex, just like in the original comics Broken Tusk blooded Machiko.

But it's whatever, and no one can go back in time and change anything. I still watch, and LET myself enjoy AvP because aside from being into punk, it's the only thing I've continuously had an interest it. All I'm saying is, take his movie with a grain of salt, it's really REALLY not as bad as people make it out to be.

Well said. My opinion, exactly ... and it didn't take you 20 minutes to type. DOH! Word conservation is a wonderful thing ... when will I learn

 

[Rob]

The fights were the most cut elements of the purge to PG-13 - cutting down on the graphic violence. That's why they felt so clipped/jumpy. But that's Anderson's fault, since he should have know when he scripted them that FOX would force a PG-13 on him ... right

Uh, yes it is. He surveyed the final editing process himself, the interview was taken 1 day before the movie was released, he shouldve told the truth that they weren't 8 minutes long(Celtic's battle wasn't even 4 minutes, and that including the ridiculous part where the Alien who impales Chopper, with an even more ridiculously long tail).

Second, it was ALWAYS PG-13. Even before he filmed it. He even admits he wrote the script with PG-13 in mind after told him they wanted it PG-13.

So yes, it partly is his and Fox's fault.

 

[TOE]

I liked AvP.

I don't think the Preds were too big at all. It would be boring to have all Preds to look alike.

In addition, I think the changes he, Anderson, made on the weapons were creative. It's been a while since the previous Predator movie so maybe the Predator race upgraded their technology.

I'm looking forward in ordering this Pred and also the new AvP2

 

[DouglasMcc]

Uh, yes it is. He surveyed the final editing process himself, the interview was taken 1 day before the movie was released, he shouldve told the truth that they weren't 8 minutes long(Celtic's battle wasn't even 4 minutes, and that including the ridiculous part where the Alien who impales Chopper, with an even more ridiculously long tail).

Second, it was ALWAYS PG-13. Even before he filmed it. He even admits he wrote the script with PG-13 in mind after told him they wanted it PG-13.

So yes, it partly is his and Fox's fault.

Not sure which interview you are talking about, so I don't feel comfortable arguing that point. However, I am going to have to call you on Shenanigans on that "always PG-13" talk. Provide me one link or piece of evidence that proves that. Because, if you look at Anderson's previous Sci-Fi/ Horror films (Event Horizon and RE), it's obvious the man loves his blood and gore. Same BS popped up right around the time Live Free or Die Hard was announced as a PG-13. "No, it was always intended as a PG-13 film." Sure, that's why the uncut film is so wonderfully bloody and profane. Don't believe the hype Rob.

 

[DouglasMcc]

I liked AvP.

I don't think the Preds were too big at all. It would be boring to have all Preds to look alike.

In addition, I think the changes he, Anderson, made on the weapons were creative. It's been a while since the previous Predator movie so maybe the Predator race upgraded their technology.

I'm looking forward in ordering this Pred and also the new AvP2

Okay, this is the part that always confused me. Was AVP set before or after P1 and P2? I always assumed it was before.

 

[TOE]

Okay, this is the part that always confused me. Was AVP set before or after P1 and P2? I always assumed it was before.

I would assume after P1 and P2 because the technology that the humans were utilizing were far more advance compared to what the humans were using for P1 and P2.

 

[screamingmetal]

Anderson was the one that contributed that Chariots of the Gods B.S. to the Pred and Alien universe. Just for that he deserves a good swift kick in the nuts sufficient enough to sterilize him.

 

[DouglasMcc]

I would assume after P1 and P2 because the technology that the humans were utilizing were far more advance compared to what the humans were using for P1 and P2.

Yes, but there wasn't that much tech at all in P1 (it was the jungle after all) and the environment for P2 was a rundown city inhabited by drug-dealers and a rundown police force. Can't really compare that to the resources of a billionaire. However, it could have happened after. I guess there's no way to tell for sure.

 

[DouglasMcc]

Anderson was the one that contributed that Chariots of the Gods B.S. to the Pred and Alien universe. Just for that he deserves a good swift kick in the nuts sufficient enough to sterilize him.

Personal Quote from Anderson on IMDB: "If you work with a subject matter beloved by a hardcore fan base, then there's going to be a huge amount of discussion of what you've got wrong or right. In some ways you can never please overly obsessive fans, it's just impossible."

Woah, he knows us better than we think ... lol

Say what you want about the man and his directing. But any man who gets to bang Milla on a daily basis deserves our respect ...