Logan (New Wolverine movie March 3rd 2017)

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

I think it's okay that his goal was to retire. I just think he should have been faced with "do I retire which is what I really want or stay and take one for the team?" The guy who sacrifices is always the cooler hero IMO. Cap crashing the ship and forever missing his date with Peggy > bugging out early so you can make your date in Italy.

Well, his goal wasn't to retire, because why even start doing something, right? He said he wanted to be a symbol and to inspire people, and I think ultimately he did just that. He said in Begins that he would do it as long as he needed to. It's like that saying, "Give a Man a Fish, and You Feed Him for a Day. Teach a Man To Fish, and You Feed Him for a Lifetime"

 

[Khev]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

"Give a Man a Fish, and You Feed Him for a Day. Teach a Man To Fish, and You Feed Him for a Lifetime"

Well yeah but if he's going to be the "teacher" like Obi-Wan or Old Han then he needs to go all the way IMO.

Imagine if Old Ben hopped a shuttle back to Tatooine and just chilled in the cantina after turning off the tractor beam. That would have been weird.

Even old Gandalf didn't bail on everyone when christening new heroes. He stuck around as long as there was conflict.

 

[RIDDICK]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

 

[YoNoSe]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

Well yeah but if he's going to be the "teacher" like Obi-Wan or Old Han then he needs to go all the way IMO.

Imagine if Old Ben hopped a shuttle back to Tatooine and just chilled in the cantina after turning off the tractor beam. That would have been weird.

One of the cool things about the Buffy TV series is they use Giles to explore what happens when the Mentor outlives his usefullness. At one point he's in a drunken stupor when someone refers to him derisively as Alfred to which he replies, "no, Alfred had a job."

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

Well yeah but if he's going to be the "teacher" like Obi-Wan or Old Han then he needs to go all the way IMO.

Imagine if Old Ben hopped a shuttle back to Tatooine and just chilled in the cantina after turning off the tractor beam. That would have been weird.

He did go all the way. Gotham saw him save and "die" for the city. Remember his line about "people needing dramatic examples."

Only 3 people know he's really alive.

Even old Gandalf didn't bail on everyone when christening new heroes. He stuck around as long as there was conflict.

So did Baleman. He saved the city and everyone was arrested by the cops. They showed that.

 

[Khev]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

He did go all the way. Gotham saw him save and "die" for the city. Remember his line about "people needing dramatic examples."

I didn't mean "all the way" in tricking people so he could sneak away from the city's problems I meant all the way with regard to making the ultimate sacrifice.

His death would have been a dramatic example and wouldn't have begged the question of why he'd quit when he had so many years he could continue to help. And why'd he have to pretend that Bruce Wayne died? Why not stay in Gotham and be Blake's "Alfred" so to speak. There was still much work to be done and he could have been a much better help than just leaving some equipment for a rookie and a statue for commoners to worship.

 

[YoNoSe]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

He went all the way to Italy.

 

[Khev]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

He went all the way to Italy.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

I didn't mean "all the way" in tricking people so he could sneak away from the city's problems I meant all the way with regard to making the ultimate sacrifice.

Batman is going to fix the broken bridges? They got all the bad guys and the city was safe again. It's a bit too simple, but Batman did his job. They showed all the bad guys arrested.

His death would have been a dramatic example and wouldn't have begged the question of why he'd quit when he had so many years he could continue to help.

A dramatic example for the audience? It's the people of Gotham he wanted to inspire, and he did and they think he's dead. He was a mess physically, remember the hospital scene? Batman was a temporary solution, as he said in TDK.

And why'd he have to pretend that Bruce Wayne died? Why not stay in Gotham and be Blake's "Alfred" so to speak. There was still much work to be done and he could have been a much better help than just leaving some equipment for a rookie and a statue for commoners to worship.

It wouldn't be the first time Bruce was legally dead and away from Gotham. Blake can take care of himself.

 

[jye4ever]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

He went all the way to Italy.

 

[Khev]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

A dramatic example for the audience? It's the people of Gotham he wanted to inspire

Well we're the ones who paid to see the movie, not the people of Gotham so yeah, I tend to like movies that entertain and inspire, well, me. And like I said *I* think heroes are cooler when they don't seek early retirement to get some nooky. Sure he pulled a fast one on millions of innocent people who were obliviously inspired by his act of deception but we know the truth, and the truth isn't as cool and kind of taints his heroism IMO.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

Well we're the ones who paid to see the movie, not the people of Gotham so yeah, I tend to like movies that entertain and inspire, well, me. And like I said *I* think heroes are cooler when they don't seek early retirement to get some nooky. Sure he pulled a fast one on millions of innocent people who were obliviously inspired by his act of deception but we know the truth, and the truth isn't as cool and kind of taints his heroism IMO.

Baleman is not a hero, he's a Dark Knight. Plus, Batman has always been a selfish jerk.

 

[YoNoSe]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

Well we're the ones who paid to see the movie, not the people of Gotham so yeah, I tend to like movies that entertain and inspire, well, me. And like I said *I* think heroes are cooler when they don't seek early retirement to get some nooky. Sure he pulled a fast one on millions of innocent people who were obliviously inspired by his act of deception but we know the truth, and the truth isn't as cool and kind of taints his heroism IMO.

It's also at odds with the prominant theme of dealing with the truth instead of perpetuating a lie with good intentions.

 

[Khev]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

"Baleman is not a hero, he's a Dark Knight. Plus, Batman has always been a selfish jerk."

*cue TDK closing credits music*

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)



Not to mention, the whole Dent act which fixed the city was based on a lie to the people, so nothing new for Batsy. Batman's biggest sacrifice was literally a big lie to preserve the peace.

He's like the villain from Watchmen in many ways.

Still, I've never seen Batman as a role model, because he's actually pretty messed up. Having said that, Baleman was able to do something that no other Batman has done, and that's overcome his fears, guilt, and his personal issues and move on with his life. That's inspiring.

That's almost unheard of in any other Batman story. Look at Battfleck, in his mid 40's and still dealing with his parents death among other things.

 

[jye4ever]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

The more Clown explains the more I choose the Cap trilogy over Nolan trilogy.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

The more Clown explains the more I choose the Cap trilogy over Nolan trilogy.

Well, Cap is the new real Superman.

 

[EVILFACE]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

He went all the way to Italy.

With a chick that set him up to get his back snapped.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

With a chick that set him up to get his back snapped.

Dude, she didn't know he was Batman at the time...plus the other chick stabbed him and his original chick was replaced by Maggie Gyllenhaal. I say he picked the right one given the choices.

 

[YoNoSe]

Re: WOLVERINE (March 3rd 2017)

With a chick that set him up to get his back snapped.

And robbed him.

But I'm sure he gave her a pearl necklace of her own.