Media Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain & Ground Zeroes

[Jameson Rook]

Yeah, the HD Edition by BluPoint was fine. If anything, I'd love to see the HD Collection, MGS4 and Rising on PS4 with the usual bells and whistles.

Now that the Arkham and Uncharted series are all playable on PS4, I really love a port of the the MGS games instead of having the worst MGS game solely on PS4.

 

[Dylan]

I would buy the hell out of MGS4HD. Cut some of the load screens and have it all install at once with some updated textures and lighting. That would be killer.

 

[FSLAR]

MGS 4 Remastered would be pretty neat.

The only thing another remaster of MGS1-3 is fix the nuances like MGS3's frame drops and the sound things Ryan mentioned long ago.

 

[GasparZizou]

Wait, now the AI is bad too?

Sure, now that you've put 100+ hours (or even more) and you know your way around the AI, probably to the point of being able to glitch it out, it's bad, but c'moooon the AI has to be one of the best AI's in gaming to date.

I remember posts like "the AI is so unforgiving, I don't know if I like that".

 

[Snake Plissken]

Best AI to date? C'mon now you can't believe that. It's got a slight learning curve since they have long range vision, but they're as dumb as MGS2, but at least that had room clearing and felt more challenging since some areas had heavy amounts of soldiers. They also wouldn't spot you and stare at you for almost 10 seconds, while the Gurlukovich soldiers would power walk to where they saw you. I think anyone that thinks it was an oppressive AI just played the game without patience since stealth isn't emphasized like previous games. Overall the AI felt like PW's with better vision.

I'd say it's only brighter point is that they see further than any previous AIs but they still respond in the same emoticons were used to. There's nothing dynamic about it. I'd say MGS3 had some of the best vision in the sense on extreme that they could see you move with a 90% camo index if you just shuffle for a second and walk to you.

It was a trade off. No camo index with good vision cones of enemies, from camo index and sensitive mid range enemy vision to high camo indexes. I just honestly don't see the AI any harder to fool than previous games. I honestly found in MGS4 to be more difficult since they had long range vision that would spot you easily if your camo wasn't very high. But I wish that clearing aspect of MGS2 was used more than one game. But it wouldn't really work outside of MGS2 since that was all indoors.

 

[GasparZizou]

Slight learning curve or a couple tens of hours maybe

I said one of the best. It's certainly much much better than TLOU's IA, and that's a linear game with nothing but corridors and 1 or 2 stages of AI awareness. What AI's are better than MGSV's then? Or in your opinion what AI's are deserving of being called the best of?

I'm telling you, now you're saying that, after hundreds of hours of playtime

 

[Snake Plissken]

You don't even need stealth in this game since if you're spotted you can just mow everything down afterward. But that's all the games really. I think TLOU did it better since at least they try to flank you. V just had the generic point and shoot with an occasional mortar. There wasn't anything satisfying messing with the AI at all since the enemies just felt like dolls with heartbeats. I thought the MGS3 soldiers were way more fun to engage with in the entire series. I really think a lot of the problem is that sandbox aspect hinders the game's difficulty. The only time the AI is a threat is when you have a dozen in an area and you're stealthing it. The areas are so big that you sometimes just run into a soldier, which is an aspect of the game and not the AI.

 

[GasparZizou]

In MGSV they try to flank you too, they use tools and grenades to flush you out, it's more noticeable inside buildings and little villages, and the alert status was very hard to get out of without just running away out of the hot zone.

No way in hell does TLOU have better AI. And about the difficulty? C'mooon, I think after playing it for so long and knowing it like the palm of your hand is distorting your view a bit and you're looking down upon it now, because the first couple of weeks people were playing it, there were many posts about how hard the game was.

Sure, everything is easier after finishing the game and having all the equipment.

Maybe MGS3's was a bit harder, but not due to AI, it was a combination of smaller locations and item management, and in MGSV since you produce almost everything you need, at one point the game eases down on you big time.

Oh, the Arkham Series, MGSV also has better AI than those.

 

[Snake Plissken]

I'd say the learning curve was just a few hours. I never had this overwhelming difficulty with the AI that you're referring to. And did I say TLOU was so much better? No. It has only a few angles of AI approach, but in comparison of TLOU on it's hardest difficult vs MGSV AI, I'll take V. Smaller areas are definitely a factor, but the same goes for larger areas and you have ample space to evade even getting an alert. Plus, you can just eliminate everything at a distance.

In comparison to older games, it seems to take way more to aggro the AI in V. Even as far back as MGS2, they would more often than not come inspect an area and sometimes run. MGS1 only had a few modes of awareness, either hear a noise and go right to alert when spotted. If anything, that game can still be difficult since it's mechanics are so archaic.

The only difficulty I found in the game was the ridiculous development times of items.

 

[GasparZizou]

TLOU is definitely harder in the higher dificultes due to how scarce everything is and how easily you're killed, but the clickers sections were definitely harder than the human sections.

I think MGS1 mechanics aged like fine wine, I think it's my most replayed game ever, along with classic Dooms, I wouldn't change a damn thing about it.

But these days I don't find many games difficult at all, like old games they used to be even frustrating at times, I miss that.

Speaking of HD remasters, MGS2 and MGS3 could take the remasterization, but I wouldn't want MGS1 to be "updated" at all.

 

[Snake Plissken]

I think the Runner or Clicker areas are some of the most random AI I've ever seen. More so the one section in the basement of the hotel. The Stalkers when they appears would either come right at you, or linger in the other sections. You can play that area multiple times, and they wouldn't always do the same thing. The sewer section with the Stalkers when you're with Sam is another unpredictable area. I think in general, AI in gaming has really changed much since the PS2 era.

It comes down to, where the AI is, is it a large or small area is, the cone of vision, and level of aggro. We can argue all day about the AI in V, but it's my belief that MGS3's was the "smartest" given the setting. I think I'd like V's more if the camo index was in it, and a single trooper was more curious after spotting you.

And I know we keep talking about it, but I think the only learning curve I had was the bullet drop. Outside of that, I was able to tackle it like any other MGS.

 

[GasparZizou]

That's what makes it so difficult, the fact that those ****ers will turn on you so randomly

Curiously enough I didn't sweat with the bullet drop, not even on PS3, but I do think the AI is one of the best I've seen, considering the range of stuff the player can do and how the AI reacts to all of it and it's pretty damn aggressive, in early stages or even in GZ, if you got caught it was either run away or see how long you can survive the fact that the AI takes a bit to come at you if suspicious, and the reflex mode I think are handicaps because otherwise it would be frustrating for modern players to play like that.

That's different say in MGS4, an enemy could spot you from the other side of the map and get you in alert mode.

 

[Snake Plissken]

Well in MGS4, they had that whole "sense" thing so that is at least in the context of the game. I remember whenever I try to stealth to meeting the MK2 on Extreme, even at 70% camo, those ****ers will see you twitch from 30-40 feet away. Trying to stealth the entire middle east section, especially right before the end in that little encampment with the watchtower can be a little hard since there's a collective of soldiers and their patrol paths look in almost all directions and they can see through camo easily.

I know everyone experienced this, but the very beginning of chapter 2 in MGS4, soon as you stand up that one soldier would spot you in front of the cliff face holding a gun on the prisoner, like 100 feet away

I think we can all agree that MGS1 (albeit old mechanics) had the most sensitive AI in the series. But this is prior to them using radios.

What I think it comes down to is that all of them are predictable and never produce any randomness worthy a mention. I think given V's settings with huge areas, of course they needed to be able to see far. But since you got all that room, there should of been more pressure on the player to stay hidden. No index made staying concealed harder, but going prone would typically un-aggro a curious soldiers almost every single time.

 

[FSLAR]

The randomness isn't bad in TLoU with the patterns...what does matter if they can hear you randomly or not. Sometimes Joel will do a 'loud' execution/knock out if the game thinks there are no other enemies, and this in turn alerts everyone. This mostly happens in Bill's Town though.

Everything is bad in MGS V, end of story. Gaspar, we talked about this. Did you forget your pills again? Make sure you don't take them off the ground this time

 

[GasparZizou]

I don't need pills, I'm on a lifetime all natural supply of patriciantin.

Pleb pills are for chumps like you.

 

[FSLAR]

No Gaspar you don't understand

You are the pleb

 

[GasparZizou]

Says the pleb.

 

[FSLAR]

You don't get it Gaspar, you're the doppleganger pleb! You're Venom Pleb!

 

[GasparZizou]

Don't talk to me, you stinky ass pleb.

Ew, I'm gonna get leprosy.

 

[FSLAR]

You're....smelling me? God, what next you try to seduce me into the box like you did with Solidus?