You're free to question and disagree with me but with regard to Rey's choice you're literally disagreeing with the film. Palpatine tells her point blank that if she becomes Empress she'll be able to order the Sith Fleet to stand down and that they'll obey. So I'm not manufacturing some unsupported scenario where she's hoping to maintain control of her own wits after being possessed, that was literally the scenario that Palps presented to her.
By massive contrast Luke in ROTJ had no such offer. All Palps repeated over and over was that "your fleet has lost, your friends have failed." Basically telling him that serving good is a lost cause regardless of which path Luke chooses so why don't you just let go and join the Dark Side. Giving in to Palps in no way, shape or form would have benefited his friends so of course Luke was faced with one and only one choice. That wasn't the case with Rey.
One thing that is cool about this back and forth we're having is that it has made me realize that Palpatine seemingly did change his "pitch" so that the temptation to join the Dark Side *did* offer a direct and immediate benefit to her friends compared to how he tried to seduce Luke. That indicates that Palps was at the height of his cockiness in ROTJ but after his defeat he decided that it would be better to sweeten the deal to turn to the Dark Side a little more when the opportunity presented itself again with Rey.
Yes I'm aware that he was stabbed with a lightsaber. My question was so what if she didn't stab him? He would have just "stayed evil" because Han hadn't shown up yet? Your take is that if Rey didn't attack that Kylo would have heard his mother, dropped his lightsaber, and then what? Picked it up again and resumed the duel? I think that is more than a little silly. Do I know for a fact that he wouldn't have done that? No. But that's certainly the most silly interpretation and since Kylo/Ben isn't a silly character I just don't see it.
He didn't even get mad when she made the cheap move. He was done. Compare him to Anakin who had just gotten taken out of the fight by losing all his limbs. He was trying to crawl back up to Obi-Wan to pummel him with his stumps! So Ben could have expressed a similar level of hatred and/or anger or hell even Force choked her while she stood over him. I'll allow that maybe he wasn't fully "good" per se as he sat quietly resigned to his fate but if he had any darkness in his heart in that moment he sure wasn't showing it.
That's why I saw him as basically a clean slate or an empty shell. Then the one two punch of Rey healing him and reconciling with his dad brought him fully back into the Light. But the turning from evil, I see that as only coming from Leia. I think it's a vast misinterpretation to say that her final act of heroism did nothing more than startle him so that he could be stabbed or that that would ever have even been his mother's goal.
It isn't inconceivable to me that someone interpreted the characters' motivations and actions completely differently than me. Trust me, there's no shortage of completely stupid commentary on TROS, the ST, and pretty much all of SW when it comes to the internet. Recent posts in this very thread prove that. I'm not saying that your comments are stupid, if I did then I wouldn't respond to you at all. But I do think that a lot of them are wrong. But only because I think we're talking about questions that you can simply look to the film for answers to.
Obviously you can't say that *every* interpretation falls under the same umbrella of "hmm I disagree but your interpretation is just as valid as mine." I mean if someone said that Princess Leia was a robot is that how you'd respond to them? So there are scenarios where one can say "hey I respect your opinion and I respect you as a person but I think you're wrong here." And I think that that's where we're at.
See you're claiming that my take doesn't have merit and that's what I'm talking about above. No big. But did I say that he "turned to the Light" the moment that Leia reached out to him? I can't remember and don't want to scroll back, lol. So if I did say that let me revise it to say "turned
from the Dark." Because that's what I meant. I think there were those three important moments of Leia, Rey, and Han, with Leia being the catalyst to disconnect him from the Dark. And if that didn't happen, if he had just stayed the rage filled screaming and murderous Anakin right down to his last breath I think it's safe to say that Rey would have either been dead at his hand or at the very least wouldn't have had that moment of reflection and remorse that prevented *her* from fully embracing the Dark.
Why does if have to be either/or? Can't I lie to myself *and* have a constructive discussion about silly movies on the internet?
