Terminator Genisys (July 1st, 2015)

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Re: Terminator: Genisys (July 1st, 2015)

Chip scene and 'Read/-Only' scenes make sense to me.

The T-800 was in a cold storage room, reprogrammed by the Resistance. Skynet probably had all of those set to Read-Only. You know, like grunts and infantry. The Columbu T-800 that infiltrates the base, the HKs we see in both films (Kyle Reese said they weren't very bright), the Endos we see on the battlefield in the T2 prologue, etc. those were probably all Read-Only. Uncle Bob was just a random, run off the mill T-800 before the Resistance programmed it. The Resistance didn't have a clue about switching the tab or whatever and figured just programming it to protect John was good enough (and it would have been).

"Skynet doesn't want you to do much thinking", well, yeah. If these machines are so advanced, then it makes sense that Skynet would fear having them go rogue. If you have a cyborg that's learning more and more, what if it abandons Skynet? It would be it's own sentient being. Skynet has nothing to lose with the original 1984 T-800 because that creation/intention is to save it's own ass. It can do all the free thinking ("**** you ********") that it wants because it's in a different time. A battlefield full of those though? That might not be good for Skynet. A group of them could go rouge and do some serious damage if they start thinking about logic. Look at Uncle Bob, it was it's idea to prevent Judgment Day by destroying Cyberdyne. IT decided to go down that chain, into the hot molten steel. It wasn't even it's mission! It was just the logic of preventing the war.

Also, in the making of documentaries and behind the scenes commentary by James Cameron and the other writers, Skynet is actually fearful of the T-1000 because it has a mind of it's own. It was Skynet's last creation and was capable of doing anything it wanted. I'm paraphrasing a bit, but Cameron said somewhere that to Skynet, the T-1000 is it's LAST resort. Skynet just wants Connor dead, so it sends it's worst assassin yet.




As for "feels", I don't think the Uncle Bob T-800 felt ****. Of course it wasn't going to cry or say it was afraid. I do think it looked at John and Sarah as allies and "friends" though, a comradery you know? He/it said sorry to John because he knew that sacrificing itself would hurt him. Yeah, he doesn't feel those things himself, but he knows and understands it. If it was just a big, dopey machine following orders, it wouldn't have thought up the Cyberdyne destruction, it wouldn't care about preventing the war. There wouldn't be a thumbs up, there wouldn't be it's own devilish smile, and there wouldn't be things like a "click" gesture to Dyson when it shows him how to use the detonator. By the end of the film, it had it's own personality. True, it learned most of those things and isn't a "real boy", but it's still characteristics and logic.

T-1000 on the other hand . . . .
 
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Re: Terminator: Genisys (July 1st, 2015)

Was it Uncle Bob's idea to take down Cyberdyne? It was Sarah that went to kill Dyson, and it was only after that incident that they went to Cyberdyne, so I don't remember that being his idea, he was probably just following orders from John, or just going along with the situation and reacting accordingly, making sure the dumb humans didn't get killed and ruined his mission, which according to him, it would making him useless.

Now, when it decided to go down that chain, into the hot molten steel, his original mission (to protect John) was over, so what was he supposed to do? Wait for Judgment day? Ok, but if the mission changed at some point, the same way it changed when they went to the mental hospital, then Uncle Bob has to complete the mission successfully, which means he didn't have a choice. He had to "die" in order to accomplish his "new" mission. So wait a second, was Uncle Bob still programed to take orders from John at the end of the film? If so, why did he not stay? Was it because the original mission (protect john) was over?

As far as Skynet being afraid of their own creation, I can see the irony of the situation, but isn't it all one system? It's all Skynet, why would the terminators turn against it self...Skynet?
 
Re: Terminator: Genisys (July 1st, 2015)

Terminators are like a regular computer. They do what they are programmed to do. Shynet is the system that becomes self aware so yes, Terminators can turn against Skynet if programmed to like the ones sent back to protect John Conner in T2 and T3. Now in this new film they are trying to go with the developing emotions stuff so that throws a wrench in it, but I'll still watch it. I'm a sucker for Arnie as a Terminator even if this movie doesn't look like a winner.
 
Re: Terminator: Genisys (July 1st, 2015)

Man, this debate is wrecking my head even more than a time-travel paradox. I'm typing up a big response to Difabio's post in another tab and I keep going back on my own points. Maybe I could do with being set to read-only :lol
 
Re: Terminator: Genisys (July 1st, 2015)

Hot Toys didn't build Skynet, so Motu doesn't care.



Anyway, these are the kind of discussions (along with the time paradox stuff) that would make for a good story/movie. Too bad Genisys and it's alleged sequels won't even allude to any of those kind of things.
 
Re: Terminator: Genisys (July 1st, 2015)

They are too busy rehashing what worked 30 and 24 years ago and spewing old catchphrases instead of writing an original story focusing on a terminator and exploring their potential to become something else with the passage of time....that sounds like Interview with the Vampire meets Terminator. :lol Or just make a Terminator film set in the James Cameron future, which is what most people wanted anyway, not Salvation.
 
Re: Terminator: Genisys (July 1st, 2015)

Just give us the future war to the point T1 T-800 and Kyle get sent back.
 
Re: Terminator: Genisys (July 1st, 2015)

They are too busy rehashing what worked 30 and 24 years ago and spewing old catchphrases instead of writing an original story focusing on a terminator and exploring their potential to become something else with the passage of time....that sounds like Interview with the Vampire meets Terminator. :lol Or just make a Terminator film set in the James Cameron future, which is what most people wanted anyway, not Salvation.

presinator.jpg
 
Re: Terminator: Genisys (July 1st, 2015)

Chip scene and 'Read/-Only' scenes make sense to me.

The T-800 was in a cold storage room, reprogrammed by the Resistance. Skynet probably had all of those set to Read-Only. You know, like grunts and infantry. The Columbu T-800 that infiltrates the base, the HKs we see in both films (Kyle Reese said they weren't very bright), the Endos we see on the battlefield in the T2 prologue, etc. those were probably all Read-Only. Uncle Bob was just a random, run off the mill T-800 before the Resistance programmed it. The Resistance didn't have a clue about switching the tab or whatever and figured just programming it to protect John was good enough (and it would have been).

"Skynet doesn't want you to do much thinking", well, yeah. If these machines are so advanced, then it makes sense that Skynet would fear having them go rogue. If you have a cyborg that's learning more and more, what if it abandons Skynet? It would be it's own sentient being. Skynet has nothing to lose with the original 1984 T-800 because that creation/intention is to save it's own ass. It can do all the free thinking ("**** you ********") that it wants because it's in a different time. A battlefield full of those though? That might not be good for Skynet. A group of them could go rouge and do some serious damage if they start thinking about logic. Look at Uncle Bob, it was it's idea to prevent Judgment Day by destroying Cyberdyne. IT decided to go down that chain, into the hot molten steel. It wasn't even it's mission! It was just the logic of preventing the war.

K but remember, T-800 says they are preset to read-only when they are sent out alone. Now, I take that as meaning him and other infiltrators - they're the guys who apparently aren't allowed have free-thinking, not the footsoldier endoskeleton on the battlefield.

But look, other than that, I give up. I'm going in circles. This is draft 3 or 4 at this point.
 
Re: Terminator: Genisys (July 1st, 2015)

Chip scene and 'Read/-Only' scenes make sense to me.

The T-800 was in a cold storage room, reprogrammed by the Resistance. Skynet probably had all of those set to Read-Only. You know, like grunts and infantry. The Columbu T-800 that infiltrates the base, the HKs we see in both films (Kyle Reese said they weren't very bright), the Endos we see on the battlefield in the T2 prologue, etc. those were probably all Read-Only. Uncle Bob was just a random, run off the mill T-800 before the Resistance programmed it. The Resistance didn't have a clue about switching the tab or whatever and figured just programming it to protect John was good enough (and it would have been).

"Skynet doesn't want you to do much thinking", well, yeah. If these machines are so advanced, then it makes sense that Skynet would fear having them go rogue. If you have a cyborg that's learning more and more, what if it abandons Skynet? It would be it's own sentient being.

"My CPU is a neural-net processor... a learning computer. But Skynet presets the switch to 'read-only' when we are sent out alone." The first 1984 T-800 was most certainly "sent out alone" and didn't need his chip reset to learn. But...I could see someone making a case based on what Uncle Bob means by "learning." Maybe the first Terminator was programmed with "Get clothes, get weapons, go through the phone book and blow away every Sarah Connor you find. Speak to humans only when you need something, repeat their own dialogue and phrases back to them as necessary." That could theoretically be all the first Terminator "knew," in which case he wasn't so much learning a new phrase (**** you ***hole) as he was just following the directive that instructs him to repeat dialogue as appropriate. He probably didn't even know what that phrase actually meant other than you apparently say it when you want to make somebody leave you alone.

So I do think you could make an adequate bridge between T1 and the T2 SE if you like that theory.

Skynet has nothing to lose with the original 1984 T-800 because that creation/intention is to save it's own ass. It can do all the free thinking ("**** you ********") that it wants because it's in a different time. A battlefield full of those though? That might not be good for Skynet. A group of them could go rouge and do some serious damage if they start thinking about logic. Look at Uncle Bob, it was it's idea to prevent Judgment Day by destroying Cyberdyne. IT decided to go down that chain, into the hot molten steel. It wasn't even it's mission! It was just the logic of preventing the war.

How do you know that it wasn't it's mission? Primary mission? No. But I think the fact that John's "orders" couldn't overrule the decision indicated that it was programmed to seek it's own destruction once John was protected from the T-1000. "I cannot self terminate" has always been weird though. You can't kill yourself but you can give up and instruct someone how to kill you? Even to the point of stepping onto the device that will be your doom? Same damn thing dude. :lol

I understand Cameron's reasoning for the contrivance of course, the ending wouldn't have been nearly as poignant if Uncle Bob simply did a running cannonball into the steel instead of slowly letting the movie's theme song play as they all gazed into each other's eyes. :lol
 
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Re: Terminator: Genisys (July 1st, 2015)

How do you know that it wasn't it's mission? Primary mission? No. But I think the fact that John's "orders" couldn't overrule the decision indicated that it was programmed to seek it's own destruction once John was protected from the T-1000. "I cannot self terminate" has always been weird though. You can't kill yourself but you can give up and instruct someone how to kill you? Even to the point of stepping onto the device that will be your doom? Same damn thing dude. :lol

I understand Cameron's reasoning for the contrivance of course, the ending wouldn't have been nearly as poignant if Uncle Bob simply did a running cannonball into the steel instead of slowly letting the movie's theme song play as they all gazed into each other's eyes. :lol

Sarah should have pushed him in :lol
 
Re: Terminator: Genisys (July 1st, 2015)

That is what was going to happen though. Sarah was going to literally ask him "are you afraid" then he was going to say yes and walk off the edge into the molten steel himself.

Dunno about anyone else, but I think that would have been awful. The coldness of the T-800, the slow burn, it's what makes the scene perfect. I'll chalk up the "cannot self terminate" as a program that prevents it from messing itself up. I'll take that over the original screenplay bit.
 
Re: Terminator: Genisys (July 1st, 2015)

You know what just popped into my head? Is it entirely out of the realm of possibility for HT to make another clean version of the T" T-800? Non DX, sculpted by the same sculptor that did Matrix? I know I'd buy it.
 
Re: Terminator: Genisys (July 1st, 2015)

Just, it kinda raises questions - he says Skynet presets the switch to ''read-only'' when they are sent out alone (on infiltration missions presumably) - it would seem this is because Skynet doesn't want it's Terminators ''doing too much thinking'' - what is ''too much thinking''? Is there some concern on Skynet's part that a Terminator could indeed be reasoned with and change sides or something? Otherwise what's the problem?

Good point. My feeling on that is, Skynet probably figures that read only means there's one less X factor.
 
Re: Terminator: Genisys (July 1st, 2015)

This film my MOST wanted to see this Summer- AOU already automatic see but I have this HUGE desire to see what this comes to- no matter how BAD..I actually think this will be better than most of you think it will be...
 
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