The Book Of Boba Fett (December 2021)

[Khev]

 

[ZE_501]

I know a fairly recent video talked about how the sequel trilogy was at times “anti” Star Wars because, even as a fan, Abrams was only a fan of some parts of the story and lore, but not a lot from the prequels or other material.

And to his very basic credit, he wasn’t alone. Lucas sold it off because he was tired of people hating his work and alterations. Abrams was initially lauded for getting it “back to basics” and back on track by ultimately making a fan-pleasing movie that freely borrowed plot, themes, and characters from “the good” movies.

In hindsight, it probably was a mistake to let someone who dislikes a large chunk of Star Wars steer the direction of the future of Star Wars.

The Sequel Trilogy was a fool's errand/suicide mission regardless. I sat down and tried to write out what I thought would have been better and had a very hard time. Not because I can't write or lack imagination, but because the end of ROTJ *was* an end, and more so because by 2015 or whenever it was, the original cast were all too old and had nothing to do.

I've said this before (usually with a wall of text) -- if you're a fan of Star Wars it's like being a fan of WW2 movies. Movies about the post-war period and rebuilding just aren't that interesting, which leaves you with only the option to simply negate everything everyone fought for.

I think The Mandalorian was actually the most interesting and worthy successor (before getting drowned in Filoni Service anyway) in that we see a relatively lawless Outer Rim that doesn't take the New Republic seriously, with the Imperial Remnant skulking about trying to hold on to power and wealth where it can, even as decay accelerates. But to tell that story with honesty, you need to treat it as self-contained or as an epilogue, because a sprawling saga on the level of its predecessor it ain't.

This view makes a lot of Star Wars fans mad, because they just don't want the good times to end, but hey man, all good times end, and more often than not it's what makes them special. Tolkien knew this. Shakespeare knew this. Lucas and Disney and the EU authors and many many fans refuse to acknowledge it.

"Fite me."
- Ramatuelle, Collectorfreaks.com circa 2022

 

[Garlador]

I would argue it can be done and could’ve been done. But Abrams skipped any setup and just began his movie with a big reset button to the original status quo. The Rebels/Resistance fight the Empire/First Order and the big bad Kylo Ren/Darth Vader is looking for the hidden plans/map in the droid R2D2/BB8 that is sent to the desert planet of Tatooine/not-Tatooine where a Force-sensitive kid with a lineage to a big villain finds it, teams up with Han Solo/LITERALLY-Han Solo to stop the Death Star/bigger Death Star from wiping them out, after the tragic loss of a planet/five planets and his/her mentor-figure. And Chewie gets ignored at the end.

I can’t rewrite history, but a better starting point would be from the villain’s perspective, growing and rising in power among a complacent galaxy. Our young new heroes only catching glimpses of a growing threat and trying to reach the heroes of the old films to warn them, only to get there too late. Show our heroes fighting strong with strong relationships still intact, but realizing that they can’t do it on their own, needing a new generation to stand with them.

A good example: Gundam. The wars that followed the original series only complicated the politics afterward, with power struggles and corruption even turning the former “hero” government into the villains, the original heroes often changing sides or allying with old foes, and retired legends coming back for one last hurrah. It’s not perfect, but the sagas logically flow from one event to the next while also introducing new young heroes to rise up and keep fighting.

 

[Sassafras]

I dunno ... plenty of 'fans' have messed up properties; I think Abrams was labelled a 'fan' complete with an action figure collection...

IMO tho I'm a fan; but I like some things, in Marvel, say, more than others. Which would make me a &^%$ storyteller 'coz while every director/writer puts their stamp on a work; IMO you can't do that just because you don't like integral parts of a previous story.

I think you need to start with all the (previous) pieces on the board, and then ponder, where would these characters logically go? Like I'm not a Spiderman fan. Don't dislike him, but he's not a fav. Given the right MCU property tho, wouldn't it be my job to see to it that arguably the most popular comic character in the world is adequately represented; and it's my job to immerse myself in the lore before I ever write a word of script.

There's fans. And there's IMO "expert" fans like on this board, who know a lot. Not just superficial knowledge or just about their favs. Because they put the time in. Abrams never struck me as someone who did that, or grew up doing that. As far as I know he was hired because he had churned out non-offensive large budget movies, and could handle a large budget film. A reasonable point economically, since supposedly the Mummy failed partly because the director was overwhelmed.

 

[ZE_501]

I would argue it can be done and could’ve been done.

Well...not impossible, but within the context of the legacy? Not so sure. I'm not saying a story was impossible, but using these aged heroes without diminishing them? Extraordinarily difficult. I hesitate to say 'impossible' but who wants to see their childhood heroes die or be replaced?

But Abrams skipped any setup and just began his movie with a big reset button to the original status quo.

Oh yeah, we've all written small books here about that, back and forth, endlessly. I did enjoy the simplicity of his set-up in the opening crawl "Luke's missing!" but didn't like the how and why of it.

Etc. etc. ad nauseam.

A good example: Gundam. The wars that followed the original series only complicated the politics afterward, with power struggles and corruption even turning the former “hero” government into the villains, the original heroes often changing sides or allying with old foes, and retired legends coming back for one last hurrah. It’s not perfect, but the sagas logically flow from one event to the next while also introducing new young heroes to rise up and keep fighting.

I have only the barest familiarity with Gundam, but that's always been more of a soap opera set-up, no? My whole contention is that you couldn't do that to the OT and respect the characters. At least not by 2015.

 

[Sassafras]

The Sequel Trilogy was a fool's errand/suicide mission regardless. I sat down and tried to write out what I thought would have been better and had a very hard time. Not because I can't write or lack imagination, but because the end of ROTJ *was* an end, and more so because by 2015 or whenever it was, the original cast were all too old and had nothing to do.

I've said this before (usually with a wall of text) -- if you're a fan of Star Wars it's like being a fan of WW2 movies. Movies about the post-war period and rebuilding just aren't that interesting, which leaves you with only the option to simply negate everything everyone fought for.

I think The Mandalorian was actually the most interesting and worthy successor (before getting drowned in Filoni Service anyway) in that we see a relatively lawless Outer Rim that doesn't take the New Republic seriously, with the Imperial Remnant skulking about trying to hold on to power and wealth where it can, even as decay accelerates. But to tell that story with honesty, you need to treat it as self-contained or as an epilogue, because a sprawling saga on the level of its predecessor it ain't.

This view makes a lot of Star Wars fans mad, because they just don't want the good times to end, but hey man, all good times end, and more often than not it's what makes them special. Tolkien knew this. Shakespeare knew this. Lucas and Disney and the EU authors and many many fans refuse to acknowledge it.

"Fite me."
- Ramatuelle, Collectorfreaks.com circa 2022

Yep. Although IMO the ST started out well and am still mildly *&^% thinking about what might have been - in my head anyway. Rey ending up being a Jedi, sure, but only after many trials, Kylo being sort of redeemed but going into exile because his head is a mess which it always was anyway; Finn having an entire arc and a lot more with Phasma; way less rehash.
No Palps or OT overload. I sure wouldn't have lines like "I thought he was a myth" in 30 years?

I think The Mandalorian was actually the most interesting and worthy successor (before getting drowned in Filoni Service anyway) in that we see a relatively lawless Outer Rim that doesn't take the New Republic seriously, with the Imperial Remnant skulking about trying to hold on to power and wealth where it can, even as decay accelerates. But to tell that story with honesty, you need to treat it as self-contained or as an epilogue, because a sprawling saga on the level of its predecessor it ain't.

IMO one of the best parts about the Mandalorian, like Miggs talking about how Empire or New Republic, to these people it's all the same. Peli mentioning she'd never been off world. Reflects real life - like in the U.S., are folks out in some small rural town in the Midwest really affected day to day about what is going on in DC, except as rumors and news feeds? You're lucky if you see a state senator in person, and it doesn't affect your daily routine.

No crowded fancy Coruscant with beings running around in plush robes. I am looking forward to Mando reaching Mandalore. There's the prospect of a mythosaur and possible fights with everyone from remnant Mandalorians to scavengers to Moff Gideon, but I'm also curious to see how this blasted planet will be depicted. SW Rebels showed it to be pretty much a wasteland.

 

[Khev]

I sure wouldn't have lines like "I thought he was a myth" in 30 years?

Agreed but SW has been wonky with how people refer to people and events from just a couple decades prior since the very beginning as this bit hilariously illustrates, lol:

 

[Khev]

Holy crap Fett is totally vindicated, remember this happened in the *OT*, lol.

 

[ZE_501]

Holy crap Fett is totally vindica-

LOL nah.

 

[guyver1]

They can’t be serious ..I’m reading online they want to do another season. Disney wants to prove the bad rep wrong

 

[Prime Clone]

Says Obi-Wan, using an absolute...

 

[Garlador]

I have only the barest familiarity with Gundam, but that's always been more of a soap opera set-up, no? My whole contention is that you couldn't do that to the OT and respect the characters. At least not by 2015.

I don’t want derail too hard into Gundam, as it’s its own flavor of sci-fi, but it’s far closer to Star Wars than almost anything else out there. Star Wars is itself a space opera at times, and Gundam’s themes of corruptive politics, family dynasties, humble beginnings, hard sacrifices, and fantastic, magical human futurism and potential are all DNA shared with Star Wars. That’s not coincidence; they openly admit that influence, down to the laser swords, “Force” sensitive Newtypes, and mysterious masked villains.

A specific example, the original Gundam hero Amuro Ray helps defeat Zeon and save the day in the original series. In the next series, he doesn’t show up at all until half-way through, where he’s under house arrest by the government he fought for, who fear his “Newtype” potential. He lives in a mansion as a war hero, but is monitored. He still struggles with the trauma of the last war, but is inspired by the new heroes to escape his life of security to join the efforts against his former government. He’s a support role, letting others shine. Another series immediately after also keeps him in the background. After THAT, they bring him back in a big way, front and center for the big finale, with one last hurrah, matured and grown into the type of hero his potential always hinted at, and saving billions in an epic last battle.

It’s not a perfect example, but I think about how happy I’d be seeing the cast of the OTs elevated instead of brought down.

Like, using that comparison, Luke was missing because he was a coward. He abandoned his friends for decades. He let the galaxy rot. So much of it is his fault. Amuro, also, was missing for a time, but the reasons were more grounded. Yes, part of it was “cowardice” - he suffered and lost a lot with the last war and was disillusioned that all his sacrifices did was empower the earth’s “saviors” into become the new villains. He was also under watch because they wanted him out of the way, but couldn’t kill him lest they make him a martyr. The moment he realized he could make a difference, he left his seclusion to join the fray again and guide the next generation.

 

[a-dev]

Agreed but SW has been wonky with how people refer to people and events from just a couple decades prior since the very beginning as this bit hilariously illustrates, lol:

6:08

Darth Vader bringing up Jar Jar Binks

 

[Sassafras]

Agreed but SW has been wonky with how people refer to people and events from just a couple decades prior since the very beginning as this bit hilariously illustrates, lol:

I couldn't be a fantasy fan without overlooking a lot

Tho never gonna understand the Poppins Leia thing. Visually, it's RIGHT THERE. And no one in the editing room said anything? WTF.

 

[JAWS]

As much as I love the Joker in that movie I love the action in TWS more.

The action in TDK is pretty weak BB is better even with the Tumbler.

Joker really saves TDK lol

Hmmmm. I don't find the action in BB that great. I mean you either can't tell what is happening or it's a tad goofy. I hate that the film is very real world fealing and then the final 30 min feels like Batman 89, Ive warmed up to that but there is nothing in that film that is as memorable as the Tumbler/batpod chase in TDK. And there is nothing more Batman then when he is able to save all the hostages and stop all the swat guys without killing or seriously hurting anyone in the scene. Great stuff. BB has the.. umm.. The part where... ahhhh... It does look awesome when he jumps down the stairway with all the bats.

Yes, Joker was the best part. But as the saying goes a story is only as good as its villain. I mean, Star Wars without Darth Vader? Lets face it the film would lose a lot.

To say the Joker saved TDK is a stretch since I am never bored when Joker is not on the screen.

I get the hate that the Nolan films get. BB and TDKR have their issues (BB because he basically does kill Raz, breaking his rule) But TDK is just about a perfect Batman/comic film. Ill never understand how people have turned their backs on that one.

The Winter Soldier is shockingly good when you re-watch it after a long time away. Out of the Nolan films, at this point the only one I'd bother returning to is Batman Begins.

TWS is really really good. The Nick Fury Car chase is the best action scene in all of Marvel.

Again I don't get the TDK disses.

Yes whenever I revisit it I'm always pleasantly reminded of just how solid it is from beginning to end. Even the score is unusually good for a Marvel film.

I wish the end was better. Not a fan of the final fight between TWS and Cap.

The German computer exposition is ruff also. Some of Marvel's worst

Otherwise its a great film.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

having a light saber doesn't make you a Jedi.

That's what they told Finn.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Says Obi-Wan, using an absolute...

He had the high ground.

 

[ZE_501]

Again I don't get the TDK disses.

I don't know, I just don't remember much of that film beyond a couple of scenes here and there, kind of how you feel about BB maybe. I don't think it's bad by any means, just didn't stay with me.

I wish the end was better. Not a fan of the final fight between TWS and Cap.

Maybe one of the reasons the MCU is massively interconnected is that I'll give this one flaw: they can't seem to end most of their films satisfactorily.

I did like the way The Avengers ended, though. I think Iron Man may be a better film but the ending was a little lacking in my eyes, although it looked good.

 

[Adam1138]

I've said this before.

Mark Hamill deserved an Oscar for that film. He is acting on a soundstage against a puppet. And he pulls in off 100%

I think Mark Hamill’s performances in all 3 OT films deserved at least Oscar nominations. IMO he’s one of the most underrated actors of his generation. Heartbreaking to see how the character that he helped evolve for so many years got treated with such contempt in the ST. You could see in every ST promotional interview that he was so dejected about how it all played out. A very sad and pathetic end to a truly great SW character.

 

[xipotec]

did you just say bobf’s finale reminded you of the professional???

did you just say bobf’s finale reminded you of the professional???

did you just say bobf’s finale reminded you of the professional???

oh, not the whole thing, just Fennics last scene. It pretty much is a 30 second encapsulation of the first 5 minutes of the professional. (the initial assassination scene.)