The Dark Knight Rises *SPOILERS*

[jye4ever]

It's interesting seeing how divided people are on this movie, but its even more fascinating (to me) how divided I am on this movie. I go back and forth and really, even now, can't figure out how I feel about it. I was certainly underwhelmed and don't think its anywhere near the quality of batman begins or the dark knight, but when I watch it or read some people's praising of it I do find myself agreeing on a lot of points (though not all) and then also seeing how a lot of people hate it. It's really strange and I don't think I've ever felt so conflicted over a film.

You don't seem conflicted to me.

 

[Russell1982]

You don't seem conflicted to me.

Well my point is, while I don't think it lives up to those two films, that wouldn't mean it's awful. I adore the first two films and think batman begins is possibly my favourite batman film, so I just don't think this comes close to matching how I felt about those two. But as I said, I go back on forth on it generally. There is a lot of things wrong with it, lots of plot holes, terrible extras (as in the background extras, not special features haha) and I think the story itself is quite lacklustre. I also feel there was too much stuffed in there. I also think the delivery of bane's lines is quite bad at times, not so much the voice itself. In the original prologue I loved his voice, then when I saw it in the cinema I literally laughed out loud. And that's not really like me.

All that said, I loved bane's design, I was like a giddy school kid when I saw bane lift up batman to break him over his knee as I really didn't think they'd really do that. Loved the batpod scenes, batmans come back was brilliant and the almost hour long build up to it made it that much more exciting. Selina Kyle was also a high point and really well done.

Of course, all this is just one mans humble opinion and I have no intention of changing anyone's opinion.

 

[jye4ever]

Well my point is, while I don't think it lives up to those two films, that wouldn't mean it's awful. I adore the first two films and think batman begins is possibly my favourite batman film, so I just don't think this comes close to matching how I felt about those two. But as I said, I go back on forth on it generally. There is a lot of things wrong with it, lots of plot holes, terrible extras (as in the background extras, not special features haha) and I think the story itself is quite lacklustre. I also feel there was too much stuffed in there. I also think the delivery of bane's lines is quite bad at times, not so much the voice itself. In the original prologue I loved his voice, then when I saw it in the cinema I literally laughed out loud. And that's not really like me.

All that said, I loved bane's design, I was like a giddy school kid when I saw bane lift up batman to break him over his knee as I really didn't think they'd really do that. Loved the batpod scenes, batmans come back was brilliant and the almost hour long build up to it made it that much more exciting. Selina Kyle was also a high point and really well done.

Of course, all this is just one mans humble opinion and I have no intention of changing anyone's opinion.

Nah you're right, knowhere as good as the first 2, especially when you take into consideration that the first 2 are considered masterpieces, minus a very few misteps with the microwave emitter and Dent's fall, etc.

 

[Russell1982]

Nah you're right, knowhere as good as the first 2, especially when you take into consideration that the first 2 are considered masterpieces, minus a very few misteps with the micrwave emitter and Dent's fall, etc.

Yeah, they're by no means "perfect" but very few movies are. I remember being a bit annoyed by a few editing/continuity mistakes in the dark knight, but it wasn't enough to ruin the specific scene. Just bugged me a little. But in the dark knight rises there are two separate scenes where batman is fighting a bunch of guys and one just randomly falls down. I mean, how did nobody notice that when filming, and then miss it again when editing? And it kind of ruins the scenes for me because its so noticeable and ridiculous. And it kind of symbolises the way I feel about the movie, which is that Nolan's heart wasn't in it and he kind of phoned it in.

I think it was always going to be a tough job to try and top those movies, but I think a lot of people had confidence that Nolan and crew could do it, or at least live up to those movies. And this just feels like, while still a decent movie, it is a step down from those two, which set a bench mark not only for comic book movies but, movies in general. Both James Bond and Star Trek were influenced by batman begins' take from what I remember.

 

[jye4ever]

Well said, my sentiments exactly.

 

[Russell1982]

Well said, my sentiments exactly.

Thanks man. I don't generally post in here a lot as things seem to get quite heated. But just thought I'd contribute as people still seem to be up in arms about it. Glad to see that I'm not alone in my view then. It seems most people either think its the greatest thing in existence or the worst abomination ever. thought it was weird that I'm in the middle somewhere.

 

[batfan08]

DiFabio, as a film, what did you think of TDKR? I mean, if you went in without any preconceived notions of what it should be, and just judged it as its own film.

 

[DiFabio]

You mean if Batman Begins didn't exist? If The Dark Knight didn't exist?

I just go into a movie called the Dark Knight Rises?

 

[batfan08]

Yeah, pretty much. Do you think, in terms of quality, that it was a good movie?

 

[DiFabio]

Spectacle wise, it's pretty good. If you're going for a fast, stupid ride, it delivers. There are some great scenes in there and great action. The villain/villains and their motivations sucks but some of the feelings you get like Bruce climbing out of the pit (if you put it in a different context), with the bats are pretty nice. If Begins and Dark Knight weren't to be taken into consideration, it's a nice else world's story. The script and writing is all over the place but it's not terrible as a movie. Bloated, convoluted and in need of revisions yeah, but not god awful. Not the best, but not the worst, certainly no Batman and Robin. Atleast TDKR sort of respects itself for whatever it tries to be.



But, as a sequel to the Dark Knight, as a Batman movie? Nahhh. If Nolan wanted to make a disaster movie, or some kind of "epic", a Howard Hughes bio-pic, class war thing or whatever it was he wanted to do that is conveyed and inspired in TDKR, he should have done it. Not make a "Batman-in-name" clone.

 

[CelticPredator]

if this was the first time I met these characters, i'd find the film to be an over bloated, boring mess.

 

[intothevoid]

if this was the first time I met these characters, i'd find the film to be an over bloated, boring mess.

But that's where TDKR is different from BB or TDK. Either of those films you could almost watch as stand alone pieces and they hold up great. TDKR though very deliberately builds upon what has been explored and established in the prior two. For me TDKR is enhanced by the first two, and in turn enhances the first two as well by closing the loop on a lot of the ideas presented.

 

[Russell1982]

But that's where TDKR is different from BB or TDK. Either of those films you could almost watch as stand alone pieces and they hold up great. TDKR though very deliberately builds upon what has been explored and established in the prior two. For me TDKR is enhanced by the first two, and in turn enhances the first two as well by closing the loop on a lot of the ideas presented.

I kind of feel the opposite to this, in that I now feel like the dark knight sort of never got an ending. I think batman begins works great as a stand alone film, whereas the dark knight sort of does to an extent, but the film ends and you know there's more come. Almost like it ends on a cliffhanger. And then I feel the dark knight rises didn't delivery, and so that film (TDK) now feels, to me, like it was never quite followed up on.

 

[crows]

we really needed a movie between Dark knight and Rises, Rises should have been the 4th, having batman be batman in a movie in between.

 

[Russell1982]

we really needed a movie between Dark knight and Rises, Rises should have been the 4th, having batman be batman in a movie in between.

This is exactly what I was thinking the other day. I still think plenty would need changing with Rises but I was also thinking it feels like there should have been a film in between, maybe with batman going back to having to operate in the shadows and being an outlaw, on the run for the police again like in Begins.

 

[ZaCHw117]

To me, TDKR wouldn't work as a stand alone film as well as it does as being a part of the entire trilogy.

The entire point of these movies is to take a character all the way to their limits, and even a bit further, and them bring them back from that. So the character can see what he's learned and get him back to his core values.

TDKR wasn't just about the batman rising, it was about Gotham city overcoming and rising. And the character of Bruce Wayne to come back to his main ideal, that he doesn't want to the be batman. But the city needed an example such as batman in chaotic times. It doesn't matter who the batman is, as long as there is one.

That's why Bruce left, that's why Blake steps up. He gets the message at the end of TDKR, and if pulled off right (which I think Nolan does) so should the audience.

 

[batfan08]

Spectacle wise, it's pretty good. If you're going for a fast, stupid ride, it delivers. There are some great scenes in there and great action. The villain/villains and their motivations sucks but some of the feelings you get like Bruce climbing out of the pit (if you put it in a different context), with the bats are pretty nice. If Begins and Dark Knight weren't to be taken into consideration, it's a nice else world's story. The script and writing is all over the place but it's not terrible as a movie. Bloated, convoluted and in need of revisions yeah, but not god awful. Not the best, but not the worst, certainly no Batman and Robin. Atleast TDKR sort of respects itself for whatever it tries to be.



But, as a sequel to the Dark Knight, as a Batman movie? Nahhh. If Nolan wanted to make a disaster movie, or some kind of "epic", a Howard Hughes bio-pic, class war thing or whatever it was he wanted to do that is conveyed and inspired in TDKR, he should have done it. Not make a "Batman-in-name" clone.

So, the main reason you don't like it, then, is because it's not what you wanted out of a sequel to TDK?

 

[CelticPredator]

He's said that countless times, yes.

 

[snoop101]

He's said that countless times, yes.

WAIT, DiFabio doesn't like TDKR!?

 

[Khev]

I'm glad that TDKR is great enough to stand up to the constant complaining about it. Its neck and neck with The Avengers and it's simply my mood on any given day that dictates which one I prefer.