The Dark Knight Rises ***USE SPOILER TAGS***

[EVILFACE]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Freeze Frame on the high five? I think Kubrick would be happy.

 

[King Darkness]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Yes.

Freeze frame high five.

THE DARK KNIGHT RISES titles. credits.

 

[Maglor]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

I think it just means Batman isnt dead, but he is FINALLY the Batman, there is no hope for Wayne ever being the personality anymore. Remember Wayne was still hopeful during TDK that someone will finish the job he started and there would be no need for Batman. However in TDKR I believe he will realise that there is no way, he will be Batman forever... the legend of a saviour will end, and the guardian will begin.

That is a great way to look at it, and it does fit with the themes of the first two as well. I'd love for the film to take this route

Same here.

Batman dying would mean he failed. WTF wants to watch a movie where he fails in end?

Superman shows up and throws Bane into space. Bats and Supes bump fist.

THE DARK KNIGHT RISES titles. credits.

 

[wofford29]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

How is it obvious? Just the fact that we are having this debate is evidence that it is not obvious at all, but thought provoking - you ask yourself 'could he really do it?', 'can Batman really die?' .. 'will Bane break Batman?', 'will Batman retire' etc etc.

It's not obvious. That's what I'm suggesting, that Nolan (who's famous for being secretive) isn't going to be as obvious as telling you Batman's fate on a teaser poster. He's not going to reveal a part of his storyline on a teaser poster. I have quite literally never asked myself one of those questions after seeing that poster. In fact I'd go as far as to say logic should tell you that the teaser poster all but confirms the opposite of what it conveys will happen in the film.

Reality...

"The Legend Ends" = tag line to get you in a seat.

In this thread...

"The Legend Ends" = A valid statement about significant plot points that are going to happen in the film.

 

[intothevoid]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Reality...

"The Legend Ends" = tag line to get you in a seat.

In this thread...

"The Legend Ends" = A valid statement about significant plot points that are going to happen in the film.

We'll just have to agree to disagree on this point

TBH I don't have a problem with it either way, he dies or retires or lives to fight on indefinitely, anything is fine, as long as the film is of comparable quality to the first 2. If anything, I have a slight preference for axecutioner's interpretation above.

 

[Njits]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Anyone here thinks the joseph gordon-levitt/John Blake will become Azreal?

 

[intothevoid]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Nope.

His character does seem intruiging and i'm sure there is more to him than just a beat cop but i'm not expecting anything like that

 

[EVILFACE]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Duh, everyone knows he's going to be the joker.

 

[The Mike]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

First off, let's be honest. If Nolan wanted to kill off his Batman, WB would let him, the guy has a blank check. I'm not saying he will but a reboot is already confirmed and it's at least three years away form TDKR not to mention it'll be hyped up as "A New Beginning" of the "Legend of the Dark Knight" so it'll separate itself from this incarnation anyway. They don't need to pander to the general populous in the film because they will in the marketing. They do it all the time where the actors and even Nolan himself as a producer will say it's different, it's new, blah, blah, blah.

That being said, the whole "Legend ends" thing could refer to anything, the Legend of Bane, the idea that Batman being gone for eight years has turned to more of a myth than anything else, it's all bull____ marketing.

Morning Spoilers for IO9:

Spoiler:

The Dark Knight Rises
At this point, I think we're all just sort of assuming that Marion Cotillard's character, Wayne Enterprises executive Miranda Tate, is really Talia al Ghul - and certainly, a bunch of set photos have shown her doing things that look less business executive and more international terrorist - but we've yet to have any official confirmation that Talia is even in the movie. Well, we now might have that confirmation from what absolutely has to be the most unlikely place imaginable: a profile of eight-year-old actress Leilah De Meza in an English local newspaper. Her mother is quoted in the piece as saying her daughter was offered the part of "young Talia al Ghul", and here's why they supposedly turned down the role:

"After careful consideration we turned it down as they were insistent that Leilah had to shave all her hair off. We were prepared to have it cut short but not shaved at such a young age. We were concerned how this could have affected Leilah's confidence and general social welfare."

This seems relatively likely to be true, if only because it seems like such a bizarre thing to just make up, though it admittedly wouldn't be the first time an actor and/or their coterie embellished the sorts of roles they were offered but ultimately turned down. Still, working on the assumption that this is legitimate, we can say that Talia is in the movie as a child and her head is apparently shaved. And perhaps she appears opposite Josh Pence's previously announced part, the young Ra's al Ghul. It seems like a reasonable extension to assume that Talia will also show up as an adult, but that can't necessarily be assumed from this. There's also the question of who might have ultimately gotten the part — the only young actress known to be cast in the film is 11-year-old Joey King, though she's a bit older and American, so it's not a perfect fit. Assuming this part is indeed still there, I would guess we just haven't learned who is playing it yet. [The Surrey Comet; big thanks to Ashley for the tip!]

When asked about Gary Oldman's recent reveal that there's now a Harvey Dent Act that has helped clean up Gotham City, Christopher Nolan responded:

Well, that's funny, I didn't read that. But there is a piece of legislation, and we are dealing with a Gotham that's moved on. In the last eight years, it has come to revere Harvey Dent in the way that Batman intended at the end of the last film.

He also refused to comment when asked whether Batman and Gordon's decision not to reveal Two-Face's alter ego will come back to haunt them in this final entry.

Nolan's wife and producer, Emma Thomas, explains the decision to eschew an origin story for Bane and just show him already more or less fully formed:

And I think in some ways it's kind of fun. In The Dark Knight we did the same thing when we introduced the Joker, and he was in mid-heist. And it very much, if you remember, it very much gave you the sense of who the Joker was. And I think the same thing goes for this prologue. Bane is already doing his thing, and you can see that he's a brute. He's a smart brute, but some things — there's a real grandeur.

More at the link. [IGN]

Elsewhere, Nolan was asked about the reported difficulty understanding Bane's lines in the prologue, which will also form the opening moments of the film. He attributed this to a mix of Tom Hardy's accent, the fact that audiences can't see his mouth, and that some sound work still needs to be improved, and should end up sounding better in the finished cut. However, he said he accepts that audiences may not always understand all of Bane's lines, and that this shouldn't matter as the visuals should be strong enough to compensate. [Heat Vision]

 

[intothevoid]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Oh yes, how could I forget

 

[Sweet Rabbit]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Duh, everyone knows he's going to be the joker.

 

[The Mike]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Huh...and here I thought that John Blake was a clever cover to introduce Aunt Harriet.

 

[intothevoid]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

First off, let's be honest. If Nolan wanted to kill off his Batman, WB would let him, the guy has a blank check. I'm not saying he will but a reboot is already confirmed and it's at least three years away form TDKR not to mention it'll be hyped up as "A New Beginning" of the "Legend of the Dark Knight" so it'll separate itself from this incarnation anyway. They don't need to pander to the general populous in the film because they will in the marketing. They do it all the time where the actors and even Nolan himself as a producer will say it's different, it's new, blah, blah, blah.

That being said, the whole "Legend ends" thing could refer to anything, the Legend of Bane, the idea that Batman being gone for eight years has turned to more of a myth than anything else, it's all bull____ marketing.

Morning Spoilers for IO9:

Spoiler:

The Dark Knight Rises
At this point, I think we're all just sort of assuming that Marion Cotillard's character, Wayne Enterprises executive Miranda Tate, is really Talia al Ghul - and certainly, a bunch of set photos have shown her doing things that look less business executive and more international terrorist - but we've yet to have any official confirmation that Talia is even in the movie. Well, we now might have that confirmation from what absolutely has to be the most unlikely place imaginable: a profile of eight-year-old actress Leilah De Meza in an English local newspaper. Her mother is quoted in the piece as saying her daughter was offered the part of "young Talia al Ghul", and here's why they supposedly turned down the role:

"After careful consideration we turned it down as they were insistent that Leilah had to shave all her hair off. We were prepared to have it cut short but not shaved at such a young age. We were concerned how this could have affected Leilah's confidence and general social welfare."

This seems relatively likely to be true, if only because it seems like such a bizarre thing to just make up, though it admittedly wouldn't be the first time an actor and/or their coterie embellished the sorts of roles they were offered but ultimately turned down. Still, working on the assumption that this is legitimate, we can say that Talia is in the movie as a child and her head is apparently shaved. And perhaps she appears opposite Josh Pence's previously announced part, the young Ra's al Ghul. It seems like a reasonable extension to assume that Talia will also show up as an adult, but that can't necessarily be assumed from this. There's also the question of who might have ultimately gotten the part — the only young actress known to be cast in the film is 11-year-old Joey King, though she's a bit older and American, so it's not a perfect fit. Assuming this part is indeed still there, I would guess we just haven't learned who is playing it yet. [The Surrey Comet; big thanks to Ashley for the tip!]

When asked about Gary Oldman's recent reveal that there's now a Harvey Dent Act that has helped clean up Gotham City, Christopher Nolan responded:

Well, that's funny, I didn't read that. But there is a piece of legislation, and we are dealing with a Gotham that's moved on. In the last eight years, it has come to revere Harvey Dent in the way that Batman intended at the end of the last film.

He also refused to comment when asked whether Batman and Gordon's decision not to reveal Two-Face's alter ego will come back to haunt them in this final entry.

Nolan's wife and producer, Emma Thomas, explains the decision to eschew an origin story for Bane and just show him already more or less fully formed:

And I think in some ways it's kind of fun. In The Dark Knight we did the same thing when we introduced the Joker, and he was in mid-heist. And it very much, if you remember, it very much gave you the sense of who the Joker was. And I think the same thing goes for this prologue. Bane is already doing his thing, and you can see that he's a brute. He's a smart brute, but some things — there's a real grandeur.

More at the link. [IGN]

Elsewhere, Nolan was asked about the reported difficulty understanding Bane's lines in the prologue, which will also form the opening moments of the film. He attributed this to a mix of Tom Hardy's accent, the fact that audiences can't see his mouth, and that some sound work still needs to be improved, and should end up sounding better in the finished cut. However, he said he accepts that audiences may not always understand all of Bane's lines, and that this shouldn't matter as the visuals should be strong enough to compensate. [Heat Vision]

Finally, a sensible post RE: the possible death of Batman

Spoiler:

Talia has to be the worst kept secret of all time

 

[jye4ever]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

This thread is fun to visit

 

[Kabukiman]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

If WB can kill Batman in the comics (only to bring him back by rebooting the DCU), then Nolan can kill him on film too.

Not that it has any bearing, but Bruce Wayne wasn't killed in Final Crisis nor was it ever really sold as "The Death of Batman". And he "came back" before the reboot.

 

[intothevoid]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Fair enough but the point was simply that if Batman can be killed in comics for cheap publicity/effort to boost sales, then surely Christopher Nolan, with all his influence after TDK/Inception, can be allowed to do it if he deems it the best way to end his story; in the knowledge that the franchise is planned to be rebooted in ANY case whatever happens.

 

[thenammagazine]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Not that it has any bearing, but Bruce Wayne wasn't killed in Final Crisis nor was it ever really sold as "The Death of Batman". And he "came back" before the reboot.

Disagree...

It was sold as Batman dying, but yes, he came back long before the reboot, being shown in the last issue of Final Crisis drawing the bat symbol on a cave wall.

 

[wofford29]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Batman has never truly died in the comics and he is not going to die in this film. I don't care how much control you death dealers think Nolan has been granted he hasn't been granted enough to be the first person to ever kill Batman. Blank check doesn't correlate with story it correlates with production of the film.

Does it make sense from a logical point of view? No

Does it make sense in the story arc? No

Does it make sense with Nolan's approach to this series? No

Does it make business sense? No

Does it make sense with the title of the film? No

Etc. Etc. Etc.

 

[wofford29]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Fair enough but the point was simply that if Batman can be killed in comics for cheap publicity/effort to boost sales, then surely Christopher Nolan, with all his influence after TDK/Inception, can be allowed to do it if he deems it the best way to end his story; in the knowledge that the franchise is planned to be rebooted in ANY case whatever happens.

You can pretend to kill Batman (he has never died) in comics because you have a new issue coming out every other week. It sells books. You can't do that in a film to sell someone a ticket for a reboot 3 years down the road. They want people in seats.

First showing is out and people come out saying WTF they killed Batman! Do you really think people are going to say awesome lets go see Batman die or I just saw Batman die lets go watch it again? Or better yet I can't wait for the reboot 3 years from now with none of these players involved. The reactions will be more along the lines of ____ this ____! ____ Nolan! I'm not watching that ____! Who the ____ does Nolan think he is! Nolan can lick my balls! Nolan raped my childhood! Why would Nolan do that! Nolan is an _______! This movie and everyone involved can suck a nut!

 

[intothevoid]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Batman has never truly died in the comics and he is not going to die in this film. I don't care how much control you death dealers think Nolan has been granted he hasn't been granted enough to be the first person to ever kill Batman. Blank check doesn't correlate with story it correlates with production of the film.

Does it make sense from a logical point of view? No

Does it make sense in the story arc? No

Does it make sense with Nolan's approach to this series? No

Does it make business sense? No

Does it make sense with the title of the film? No

Etc. Etc. Etc.

Does it make sense from a logical point of view? No. Perhaps

Does it make sense in the story arc? No Don't see why not

Does it make sense with Nolan's approach to this series? No A key element of his approach has been to add a sense of realism, where is the realism if you go in to a film about someone who is essentially a wildly driven, violent, possibly crazy billionaire, knowing that he's going to win/save the day/avoid dying in the end? There's no sense of danger left. I think with Bane what Nolan wants is to introduce a very real sense of physical danger to Batman, to the point where he could actually die. Whether or not that happens who knows but the point is I think Nolan at least wants the audience to go into this with sense of doubt over whether Batman will come out alive or not

Does it make business sense? No Why not? I don't see how the film's box office will be impacted. Plus humans tend to have a fascination with death, I could equally argue that it DOES make business sense, but i think it will be neautral

Does it make sense with the title of the film? No Like i've said before, it IS compatible with the title if you think of it metaphorically